CCTV in a public place ? vs filming and photos in a public place?

Combat squirrel · 19 Jul 2014 at 01:19

Hey the combined wisdom of OCUK.

Question, in the UK its legal to film or photo in a public place in the UK, however, I have been told by someone that cctv; even such that is placed to protect ones own property that happens to include public road in the outskirts of the shot is illegal?

I am confused, there seems to be a conflict of laws here? They are techically the same thing - a video recorder

What say you people ?

Pestilence · 19 Jul 2014 at 01:47

It is legal to record in public. For example, making your own "found footage" film or whatever. That's in the sense that the camera is seeing something that a general person may see as they walk through the area. No problem with that.

Where it becomes a problem is setting up personal CCTV -- ie. static cameras -- that are facing onto land that is not yours. That could be seen as intimidating to those whose land you're pointing on.

Combat squirrel · 19 Jul 2014 at 02:22

Interesting, so what if that land is public Road or public land and not someone else's land or property? I. E. It's a public Road in which anyone has right of way and is publicly available constantly and the road is a proper UK Road? Long story short is a public highway.

Hyburnate · 19 Jul 2014 at 02:32

Thats fine

Tefal · 19 Jul 2014 at 03:37

Combat squirrel said:
Interesting, so what if that land is public Road or public land and not someone else's land or property? I. E. It's a public Road in which anyone has right of way and is publicly available constantly and the road is a proper UK Road? Long story short is a public highway.

no you can only film your own property with fixed security cameras. but no ones gonna be too arsey if you have a little bit of pavement in the shot.

setting it up on a pole to watch the local children's park though will probably get you in a bit of ****.

Fuzz · 19 Jul 2014 at 04:34

Public land/road/pavement is fine.
It's someone else's PRIVATE property/land/garden you can't film.
Simply because people have a right to privacy in their own home.

dymetrie · 19 Jul 2014 at 07:49

It's almost like there's something which provides guidance about CCTV use!!

Private CCTV use isn't governed, so technically you can do what you want. However (in big letters), if someone feels as though something you do is intrusive then they can go to the Police who will then advise you about what is reasonable.

Intentionally filming another person's property could be seen as harassment, and would be treated as such. Filming a children's play area could be seen as predatory, and would be treated as such. It's not so much the activity as the intent behind it.

Of course, you can certainly film someone else's property provided you have a valid reason to (gathering evidence of harassment/ASB/criminal activity), it's governmental organisations that need to get dispensation under RIPA to do anything like that...

enkoda · 19 Jul 2014 at 08:49

Fuzz said:
Public land/road/pavement is fine.
It's someone else's PRIVATE property/land/garden you can't film.
Simply because people have a right to privacy in their own home.

No you don't.

There was the case of the guy masturbating in his own home but his neighbour over the back could see into the house and reported him to the police. They even recorded the event on mobile as evidence.

And yes, he was arrested and convicted (can't link, on mobile

).

godinman · 19 Jul 2014 at 08:55

Tefal said:
no you can only film your own property with fixed security cameras. but no ones gonna be too arsey if you have a little bit of pavement in the shot.

You can have the whole street in shot if you want, as long as it's public land and not viewing private property then you're fine.

Vulcan · 19 Jul 2014 at 11:14

godinman said:
as long as it's public land and not viewing private property then you're fine.

Not true. No where in law does it state that.

£15 · 19 Jul 2014 at 11:35

I hate to say it, but google the matter and you'll find loads of CCTV suppliers stating what you can and can't do.

It's perfectly acceptable to record your drive, for example, even if it includes a section of the pavement/road in it. If it's obvious the intent is to record your property and the extra public stuff is collateral damage, it's ok. I even think you can go as far as to record your car if it is parked on the road. It's public, but the intent is lawful.

However, if it was the other way around - your camera is aimed at someone else's property and hardly covers your own - then you'd be on very thin ice.

dymetrie · 19 Jul 2014 at 14:20

BadMojo said:
However, if it was the other way around - your camera is aimed at someone else's property and hardly covers your own - then you'd be on very thin ice.

There is no law which governs private individual use of CCTV.

TJM · 19 Jul 2014 at 14:35

dymetrie said:
There is no law which governs private individual use of CCTV.

Pointing a camera at someone else's property would leave you open to a civil claim for invasion of privacy if it wasn't for a legit purpose (e.g. recording/deterring crime).

stopper · 19 Jul 2014 at 14:38

Longbow said:
Not true. No where in law does it state that.

Very true. There are no "laws" regarding CCTV at all. People tend to forget that legislation is not actually law, it's just commonly mistaken as law.
However, the man made legal system was put in place to deal with things like where people have had their natural rights infringed, like in the topic of this thread, people using CCTV in the wrong place.

TJM · 19 Jul 2014 at 14:48

Abort thread, freeman on the land detected.

Rich_L · 19 Jul 2014 at 15:06

TJM said:
Abort thread, freeman on the land detected.

V F · 19 Jul 2014 at 15:06

enkoda said:
No you don't.

There was the case of the guy masturbating in his own home but his neighbour over the back could see into the house and reported him to the police. They even recorded the event on mobile as evidence.

And yes, he was arrested and convicted (can't link, on mobile ).

What a sick society we live in.

v0n · 19 Jul 2014 at 15:21

enkoda said:
There was the case of the guy masturbating in his own home but his neighbour over the back could see into the house and reported him to the police. They even recorded the event on mobile as evidence.

And yes, he was arrested and convicted (can't link, on mobile ).

Good urban legend, but just imagine if it were true and possible to get arrested and convicted for masturbating in privacy of your own home in 21 century Europe. There would be literally no free roaming males under age of 70 anywhere in Britain.

Vulcan · 19 Jul 2014 at 16:38

TJM said:
Pointing a camera at someone else's property would leave you open to a civil claim for invasion of privacy if it wasn't for a legit purpose (e.g. recording/deterring crime).

Anyone can make a civil claim, doesn't mean they are going to win.

Whilst the inside of a house may be private, the outside can often be clearly seen from a public area and thus there is no right to privacy.

£15 · 19 Jul 2014 at 16:59

dymetrie said:
There is no law which governs private individual use of CCTV.

Where/when did I say there was?

Are you, and others, saying I can, without fear of prosecution of any kind, civil or criminal, direct my CCTV at the bedroom window of my neighbour's house, across the road. I believe it's their 8 year old daughter's bedroom.