CCTV NVR - Inbuilt PoE switch or seperate?

Soldato
Joined
31 May 2005
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Nottingham
Am presently speccing up a NVR CCTV setup for home.

Any benefit of running a seperate PoE switch to connect the cameras to then connecting that to the NVR?

Or, if the NVR already has PoE switch built in, just use that?

I assume an NVR without might be cheaper if you already have a PoE switch?

Thanks.
 
Soldato
Joined
29 Dec 2002
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7,252
Convenience? It may/may not be easier to run to a switch or switches in different locations. If you can run from the NVR and it supports PoE of the right standard and with enough capacity, then it makes sense to do so, it’s one item to UPS rather than 2-3 assuming you are doing it properly.
 
Don
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21 Oct 2002
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Parts Unknown
Yes, use it in work after testing it at home and in work.

Synology Surveillance Station is excellent.

Bear in mind, each Synology comes with 2x camera licences, each extra camera is £35 ish.

H265+ means about 10% space and bandwidth used compared to a h264 camera. Only hikvision make these.
 
Soldato
Joined
29 Dec 2002
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7,252
Before you buy a Synology product, please make sure you are fully aware of the support life cycle they offer. The internet is littered with people who either personally or professionally have purchased Synology products only to be surprised that despite the hardware they own being capable and technically superior to the current range sold, only a few short years after purchase you are moved onto extended support and no new DSM versions. I'm not saying the products are bad, far from it, Synology used to set the standard in functionality for home users and DSM is still a popular option with people installing XPEnology on generic hardware.

Also look at FreeNAS and Unraid, both offer long term support and combined with BlueIris/Zoneminder etc. are decent, the camera's can also write direct to NFS shares.
 
Caporegime
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18 Oct 2002
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26,096
I've not personally witnessed any issues with DSM support on older devices - a DS1512+ that we store backups on still receives the latest software. How long do you honestly expect a prosumer NAS to be supported for? Is it really an issue if the other options in the market are a Chinese DVR that will never see a firmware update?
 
Soldato
Joined
29 Dec 2002
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7,252
I've not personally witnessed any issues with DSM support on older devices - a DS1512+ that we store backups on still receives the latest software. How long do you honestly expect a prosumer NAS to be supported for? Is it really an issue if the other options in the market are a Chinese DVR that will never see a firmware update?

Interesting question.

Synology used to offer 4 years main DSM and 3 security updates, for 'prosumer' hardware as you term it, that really sucked, especially at a time when they were actually killing off hardware support on better specified products than those they were selling 3 years later and justifying it by claiming the cost of certifying older hardware was prohibitive despite identical cpu's etc. being used in current gen hardware. Some models could be (and were) cross flashed, but generally felt like you were being short changed for the sake of it. Apparently that's changed (yay!) to 7 years of DSM as the 11's are still showing as in support now, though in some cases the feature set looks limited.

Compare that to Unraid, I purchased my first Unraid Licence in 2007? and my last two in 2011, the 2011 hardware is still running (N36L) and the earlier licences will still work. I've received point release and major version upgrades and unless something drastic changes in the base linux system requirements, I don't see that changing.

So to answer your question, I don't think 4 years from launch is long enough for a premium product to receive major version upgrades, especially when hardware is more than capable of running the latest version, 7 years main support with extended security updates feels much more reasonable, but FreeNAS is ... well you get the idea and Unraid is amazingly good value, that's without Xpenology.
 
Soldato
Joined
13 Jul 2005
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19,286
Location
Norfolk, South Scotland
Before saying anything else I’m not a camera installer or a video security expert and I was trained by Dahua on their equipment as a courtesy because I bought rather a lot of it! Because of my ‘friendly’ relationship with my reseller I only use Dahua cameras. If you want to use something else then much of my experience will be worthless!

I’ve put several systems in for clients using both Synology NVR-216 and Dahua NVRs and the Dahua NVRs are very good indeed, assuming you use Dahua cameras. A good dedicated NVR has features like a wheel for moving the images backwards and forwards and possibly even a PTZ joystick if you have that sort of camera (and a lot of the new very high-res cameras have virtual PTZ so it can be quite useful for that) and if you’re doing clever stuff like linking rapid PTZs to panoramic cameras for face detection then you need to be running DSS and DSS generally runs best on one of Dahua’s own NVRs. And as you would expect, all Dahua cameras are FULLY supported on Dahua NVRs.

A dedicated NVR will also support at least one direct video connection (although so do many NAS boxes) and that could be a factor if you want to review the images regularly.

The Synology NVR-216 is a DS-216 with 4 or 9 Surveillance Station licences included at a good discount over buying them separately. One downside is you only get a single RJ-45 Gigabit port on it so there is no networking redundancy option if you like that sort of thing. The Dahua NVRs allow you to stream a second feed from the second RJ-45 port. If you buy an expensive enough Synology or QNAP NAS with multiple RJ-45s or SFP+ ports I’m sure they would let you do that as well.

I find Synology Surveillance Station straightforward to use but some of the options on the Dahua cameras don’t seem to be fully supported. On the two occasions that I have been asked to give the police access to data from the camera systems both Synology Surveillance Station and Dahuas DSS NVR software made it a piece of cake to locate the time required and copy the files to a USB stick for them to take away. If you are installing a system with a lot of cameras then the Surveillance Station licences do add significantly to the cost of the system with Synology or QNAP. On a 20 Camera QNAP System the Surveillance Station licences are £800. Which is more than an entire Dahua 50 Camera system fitted with 4 x 4Tb HDD. Dahua also make a really nice NVR backup solution that automagically replicates everything across up to 4 NVR backup stations.

Personally, I wouldn’t worry about updates for either type of system as the software is fully stable now and you won’t mess about with it once it’s installed. The only issue would be if you needed to add a new camera and the NAS manufacturer hadn’t updated their Camera list.

And @bledd - Dahua also do H265+ camera support across the range now. From what I’ve seen, HikVision and Dahua are pretty even on price, features, image and build quality. Even using H264+ I’ve been amazed as how long you can store images for on what seem like very small hard drives.
 
Soldato
Joined
18 Oct 2002
Posts
4,655
Location
The Darkside
Am presently speccing up a NVR CCTV setup for home.

Any benefit of running a seperate PoE switch to connect the cameras to then connecting that to the NVR?

Or, if the NVR already has PoE switch built in, just use that?

I assume an NVR without might be cheaper if you already have a PoE switch?

Thanks.

You can use Poe switches or if cameras are easily fed back to an NVR with Poe ports, you can you them also. Some Dahua NVR’s come without Poe ports which are cheaper.

Main decision is the number of cams you want to use. A Synology is ok but I prefer instead to build a machine with power and use separate software.

Easiest option is an NVR. Built to do the job, aren’t expensive and you can still mix cams. However, to get the best out of a camera, you need to stick to the same brand or you will need to individually edit camera settings.

Personally, I would go the NVR route with either Hikvision or Dahua. Unless you have some specific reason why you need a Synology like running the cams of a 4G network, then I wouldn’t bother. Dahua or Hikvision have some fantastic kit and it’s simple. Dahua have the advantage of running their Poe cams up to 800m away over cat6 if needed.


https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/threads/spec-me-a-cctv-system.18568132/
 
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