Confessions of an idiot: AF-ON Button

[Andrew_McP]

I've had my 40D for six years, and it's only this week, as I caved in to temptation and prepare to receive a 70D (hurry up DPD man!) that I've realised the AF-ON button isn't just another wasted button.

I am a total fool! How did I not separate out the focusing before? I used the camera for a few hours very very early this morning (out on another futile expedition hunting kingfishers and trying to capture plummeting house martins) and was amazed at how intuitive and helpful this is when setting up shots.

I can't see myself using any other method to focus any more. Just leave it in AI-SERVO, use the back button to focus and the shutter button to meter & capture. I may even set the back button to do the metering as well, now I come to think of it.

Sometimes I think cameras can be like washing machines. We end up using the same few settings every time without thinking, but there are really useful features right under your nose. Literally!

Anyway, the DPD man's just delivered a suspiciously 70D shaped box. I think this time I'll actually read the manual properly, with my thinking head on, while the battery's charging.

 

[DBT85]

You're a better man than I for waiting for the battery to charge

Similarly to you, I've only just started using Auto ISO. Very handy in changeable conditions or when going from extreme sunlight to harsh shade!

 

[Andrew_McP]

You're a better man than I for waiting for the battery to charge

During the initial phase of DSLR ownership I'm too busy fretting about getting dust on my pristine (I hope!) sensor to be in a hurry to take the cap off. And in this case I'm too busy turning my nose up at the mushy buttons on the back of the 70D. I'd heard/read about general mushiness and lack of clicky feedback, but I wasn't prepared for the difference to be so stark!

Still, for an instant 100% crop factor over my 40D I think I'll learn to live with it. And I've loved articulated screens ever since I first had a Canon S1, so although the 7D Mk II is bound to have one, it's also not going to be £720 including a spare Canon battery! (Curry's code at the weekend plus Canon Cashback).

I've only just started using Auto ISO. Very handy in changeable conditions

I'll be honest and say that most of the time (except the brightest conditions) my 40D has lived at 400ISO, because it cleaned up very well in Lightroom, and I generally want shutter speed for wildlife rather than absolute quality. Both would be nice, but I'm not that good a photographer.

However the various ranged ISO settings are increasingly attractive on more forgiving modern sensors, and I suspect I'll be using it on the 70D... just as soon as its lost its finger grease and dust virginity.

Maybe I'll scratch it deliberately to speed up the "it's a tool not a precious museum piece!" transition. :->

 

[Neil777]

During the initial phase of DSLR ownership I'm too busy fretting about getting dust on my pristine (I hope!) sensor to be in a hurry to take the cap off. And in this case I'm too busy turning my nose up at the mushy buttons on the back of the 70D. I'd heard/read about general mushiness and lack of clicky feedback, but I wasn't prepared for the difference to be so stark!

One of the first things I noticed when I got my 5D recently was how much softer the shutter button click was compared to my 450D, I've had a few incidences of accidentally pressing it.

 

[Zogger]

I have always heard about the benefits of back button focusing but never really got to trying it on my 30D. I tried it on the 60D but personally I don't think it works for me in most situations - I suspect the biggest problem is that they don't have the joystick for focus point selection any more - and selecting focus point is just a natural habit for me now, which means my thumb does quite a lot of traversing back and forth for each photo and slows down most of my pictures - and for 99% of photos I need to refocus between shots anyway.

 

[Andrew_McP]

I suspect the biggest problem is that they don't have the joystick for focus point selection any more

Possibly, though it's not something I've messed with much even though I have the joystick on the 40D.

I've used the central point on the 40D 99% of the time, so it may be that back button focus simply fits better into my focusing 'workflow' than into other people's. I do an awful lot of One Shot mode focus, hold, recompose; so the AF-ON button means I can do that even with AI-Servo engaged, so I'm ready for both moving and stationary subjects under all circumstances without fiddling with settings.

The only times I've used other focus points is when using a taped 1.4x converter on my 100-400L. Only the left hand focus point works then... though why I ever bothered is beyond me. It's not a sensible combination at all.

One of the first things I noticed when I got my 5D recently was how much softer the shutter button click was compared to my 450D

Canon are a very frustrating company. I've got used to having to compromise on features so they can extend their hardware range and tempt you up the price range, but it's impossible to understand how things like this make it past their ergonomics team.

The only reason I originally got a 40D was that it felt so right in my hand compared to the Nikon D300 I tried. So ergonomics is something they know how to do! Mushy buttons though... maybe they last longer? I'd rather have clicky ones which fail sooner if that's the case!

 

[Neil777]

Canon are a very frustrating company. I've got used to having to compromise on features so they can extend their hardware range and tempt you up the price range, but it's impossible to understand how things like this make it past their ergonomics team.

The only reason I originally got a 40D was that it felt so right in my hand compared to the Nikon D300 I tried. So ergonomics is something they know how to do! Mushy buttons though... maybe they last longer? I'd rather have clicky ones which fail sooner if that's the case!

I did wonder if it was something to do with the weather sealing, maybe somebody more informed could chime in?

 

[Andrew_McP]

I did wonder if it was something to do with the weather sealing

Having had a proper play around, I'm beginning to think they let some work experience kid design the back of the current range.

If it wasn't for the fact I'm very impressed by everything inside the case, I'd be sending it back because of the outside of the case. The combo rotation/cursor dial in particular is just horrible to use, and the lack of click on other buttons means you lack that immediate reassuring feedback telling you that you definitely pressed the button.

It would be nice to buy something occasionally which didn't feel like a compromise, but this most definitely does. But never mind, it takes great photos and that's what matters. I'll get used to the ergonomics, but at the moment if I could put the fancy new internals into the 40D's scruffy old body I'd do it in a flash.

For now though I need to stop fiddling and start sleeping, or work tonight will be even more 'orrible than usual. The ergonomics on that suck too.

 

[THC_SsSsSnake]

Finding your thread most interesting,please continue it

 

[Vertigo]

Personally I love Canon's ergonomics.

With one exception...

The change to the zoom function when previewing shots on the 5D3 is driving me to total distraction - why they felt the need to change this after all this time is beyond me and it's a total pain when switching between my 7D and the 5D3.

 

[Andrew_McP]

7D and the 5D3.

Well, the 7D is 'old school' like my 40D, and the 5D3 is in a different league to the cheap & cheerful nouveau ergonomics of the current pro-sumer range. The main grip of the camera in your hand is still great (apart from the more plasticky feel now), but the buttons and dials are still major step back (in positive feedback terms) from my 40D. It's night and day... even after a few hours' sleep.

I really don't think I'd have parted with my money in a hands-on shop. I'd have been trapped in a nasty feedback loop between this and the 7D (both similarly priced as it nears EOL). However I can't be separated from the internal features now I've experienced them. So I'll just have to grit my teeth and pray the 80D doesn't reinstate the 'grown up' buttons. Otherwise I'll be sulking for the next 6 years.

Still, no purchase is complete until you have a little buyer's remorse. Mine just kicked in before the Barclaycard bill arrives for a change. It can't go back though, because I've already forked out £53.50 just for the pleasure of Adobe allowing me to read 70D files without converting them first. Thanks Adobe! Of course Picasa does it for free, thankfully, so I'm not twiddling my thumbs for a few days.

Well, I am twiddling one thumb, but that's just me desperately trying to get used to the action of this manky new 70D combo-wheel. Less combo, more Compo IMO.</grumpy_old_men>

 

[Vertigo]

Well, the 7D is 'old school' like my 40D, and the 5D3 is in a different league to the cheap & cheerful nouveau ergonomics of the current pro-sumer range.

Not sure the 7D is "old school" when it comes to ergonomics really. I still have my old 40D and the 7D and 5D3 are incredibly similar in control layout and operation whereas the 40D feels very "old" by comparison. That's what makes the zoom function I mentioned so bemusing and annoying - the 5D3 and 7D are so similar with the exception of this single function.

 

[Janesy B]

I think my 70D is spot on really, it's a bit plastically but most things are now. I've started to use back button AF too and it helps me keep the camera more stable.

 

[Andrew_McP]

I still have my old 40D and the 7D and 5D3 are incredibly similar in control layout and operation whereas the 40D feels very "old" by comparison.

Ok, fair enough. But my specific points were about the most used (in active operation) controls under the thumb. Those on the 7D seem very similar indeed to the 40D, and the buttons are 'old school' in the sense that they are the same generation and, I imagine, click rather than mush.

Anyway, so most folk clearly aren't as fussy as me. But I think we're entitled to be a bit fussy when spending this kind of money.

 

[redline]

Anyway, so most folk clearly aren't as fussy as me. But I think we're entitled to be a bit fussy when spending this kind of money.

Absolutely... I've had my 70D for three weeks now, but fortunately the only thing I can really fault is those less than positive buttons, otherwise it is an utter delight, and by a massive margin the best camera I've owned. Coming from a Nikon D5100 this feels wonderful to hold and far more sturdy... handling the Nikon now makes it feel like a tiny plastic toy, and it has some squishy buttons too [great camera though]. I thought I might struggle to get used to a totally new layout, but find the ergonomics fine and intuitive... plus, I have simply managed to locate and set everything up without even opening the bag containing the manual.

For me the best thing - and the reason for getting it - is the live view video mode focusing, which is simply amazing... being able to select an area to focus on via the touch screen makes solo film making so much better; and the face tracking works great for filming the kids charging around... there is no hunting, just instant, precise and silent operation

I managed to pick-up a used, mint 55-250 STM to go with the 18-135 STM... and for a cheap lens the sharpness is superb, plus, being an STM retains the same standard of focusing. I would now like a wide prime I can use wide open apertures with, but sadly have no money left.

Anyway, sorry for hijacking with my mini review ... I have been trying the AF-ON button since reading this, and won't go back, so thanks for making me give it a try.

 

[Andrew_McP]

Anyway, sorry for hijacking with my mini review ... I have been trying the AF-ON button since reading this, and won't go back, so thanks for making me give it a try.

No need to apologise, I already derailed my own thread. :-> And the AF-ON button is frustratingly good... frustrating because I wish I'd separated focus out years ago! It doesn't prevent user error, as I just proved on a walk on this glorious day (down south anyway). However I couldn't resist walking far further than I planned to revisit my favourite subject at this time of year.

This shot is in the shade, at full reach on the 100-400L, ISO1600. And it's the best result I've ever had! Which is just as well because I got wet lying in the glass to avoid neck ache.

That's the camera jpg resized by Google+, cropped (the long side is actually the narrow part of the sensor) and brightened slightly. I'll revisit this image when Lightroom 5 turns up.

For now though I have to do the sleep thing again. Really didn't need a 4 hour walk in between night shifts, but a new camera is like a dog... it needs to be taken out regularly. And fate laid on a buzzard, heron, and even a passing Spitfire for me to practice on.

Not very well, as it happens, but I blame it on incompetence and lack of sleep. An excuse I've been using for about 25 years.

 

[redline]

Nice capture... those Swift's are mighty fast. I was trying to capture some Sand Martins coming out from their nesting holes in Corwall, but they were simply too fast for me, and I ended up with nothing decent

 

[Andrew_McP]

Dled the Lightroom demo until my upgrade arrives, and Lightroom cannot work miracles on a 1/1125th, f5.6, 1600iso shot @ 400mm. However the bird finally, after about 20 failed shots, managed to stick its head into the narrow depth of field zone when my shutter opened... though part of me -- the part which lived with film cameras for many years -- always feels using burst mode capture is cheating.

Then I remember I need all the help I can get!

Although situations like this can be prefocused in manual or one shot, I'm finding the AF-ON button, in AI-SERVO, to be a very flexible tool that saves fiddling with other buttons.

Having said that, I did some experimenting with the 70D's AF and although I'll stick to central point most of the time (especially against busy backgrounds) it's going to be invaluable for attempting birds in flight against the sky.

It's also a real delight to have a totally clean sensor and viewfinder again. I'm seriously considering never taking the 100-400L off. Ever! :->

 

[Energize]

The bird seems slightly out of focus? It looks like the rocks behind it are the focal point.

 

[Andrew_McP]

The bird seems slightly out of focus?

It is, but it's still better than I've managed before. I'm not sure there's a consumer level AF system on the planet fast enough to catch a bird diving out of a nest. So it's just a matter of prefocusing and hoping for the best, especially with a wafer-thin depth of field @ f5.6/400mm.

I did try the AF system, just for a laugh, but there was no way it was going to track a plummeting martin against that background even when I had chance to focus on the bird as it paused before dropping out of the nest.

Ultimately shots like this are always going to be about patience and perseverance. And reaction times! Mine are rather long in the tooth now, and I only get 2 frames worth of bird per drop even if I just use jpg mode to get close to 7FPS. So I have to guestimate where the bird's eye is going to be when either of those frames is captured.

While I'm here, this Google+ automated creation illustrates the problem.