Dolby Atmos -anybody tried it? Any Good?

Soldato
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Hi all,

Thinking of upgrading my home cinema setup - just curious if anybody here has experienced dolby atmos? Is it worth the extra expense. My current system is Onkyo HT-R390, about 4 years or so old, with the kit speakers it came with.

Any advice on AV receivers/Speaker kit reccomendations. Budget somewhere around £2500, but would like to spend less if possible, but don't want to compromise too much either. Lol.

Your thoughts/experiences please.

Mark
 
Due to it being a rental property I would say a deffo no - I am aware this is not perfect, but there are upward firing speakers I assume?

Mark
 
There are but i think a lot of people feel its a dilution of what Atmos is supposed to be - its using the same idea as 'virtual surround sound.'

Perhaps find a good dealer that could give you a demo and see if you think the upwards firing atoms is worth it over just a very good 5.1 / 7.1 setup.

The Denon amps are looking very nice this year with Atmos / DTS X and proper Audssey setup
 
There are but i think a lot of people feel its a dilution of what Atmos is supposed to be - its using the same idea as 'virtual surround sound.'

Perhaps find a good dealer that could give you a demo and see if you think the upwards firing atoms is worth it over just a very good 5.1 / 7.1 setup.

The Denon amps are looking very nice this year with Atmos / DTS X and proper Audssey setup

Funny you should mention Denon - I was considering the 5200 model, or even stretching to the 7200. Thanks for your input. Have you got a Denon?

Mark
 
No I've got an Onkyo 818 it developed a fault and had to go back a couple of months ago - i did think it might not get repaired and when looking into the current amps on the market decided that i liked the look of the Denon's and Anthems.

The manufacture fixed it but i wouldn't be buying a current Onkyo.
 
Not interested TBH. I've spent enough money on my HC in the last 28 years & it gets so little use these days with the hours I work & the jobs that need doing in the spare time I have. I've spent more on PC's than I have my HC since blu-ray came out, that was the last feature I was an early adopter of. 4K/8K I can't justify buying into that either. You don't know just how hard it was trying to buy a 6.1 speaker setup, when 5.1 was mainstream in 2004 when I last upgraded my speakers. I think you need a big room for Atmos/DTS-x & I havent got that.

There will be a point when I will have to sell everything, but right now what I'll get for all my hardware isn't worth the time or effort. :(
 
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I have a friend who has just moved in to a new build during the building of the place he knew he was going down this route with Atmos so had everything put in place.

After visiting and listening I wasn't really impressed I think it's too early and not enough content to warrant it yet.

The other thing speaker placement is really important so you end up needing to design the room around it which isn't really practical unless you do have a dedicated room.
 
Ooh err - a lot of negative, but still viable points/oppinions. Makes me wonder whether all the fuss and expense is going to be worth it. Have heard others say that atmoss is the dogs danglies - but as others have said on here - depends whether you have the righr room etc,

I am more confused now. Lol. Thought this was going to be easy - wrong again it seems.

Any more opinions either way?

Thanks to all who have chimed in so far.

Mark
 
I would stick with what you currently have and down the road then invest Atmos is not the only new thing that is hitting the market you have Atmos, DTS X and Auro3D so it's worth waiting.
 
Well implemented 5.1 beats poorly implemented 7.2, and so it is with Atmos.

£2500 is a chunk of cash. However, once you subtract £1000-£1100 for the Denon receiver it leaves £1400-£1500 for speakers. Presuming the idea of bounce speakers is a goer then the main surround speakers all need to be either floor standers or standmounts so the bounce speakers can live on top. Once the budget for subs is allocated (a minimum of £500 for a pair of BKs) then what's left is £1000 to spread between 7 ear-height speakers (plus stands) and 4 bounce speakers. That won't work. The quality of the speakers gets massively compromised because the money is spread far too thin. It doesn't matter how impressive Atmos is in the reviews, a poor sound system just won't do it justice and at best you'll be left wondering what all the fuss is about, or at worst you'll have a system that just isn't nice to listen to in any configuration.

As good as the HTR-390 system is for the money (£250-£300), the difference in performance going to larger fronts, centre and surrounds plus a quality active sub will knock your socks off. Making the investment in decent speakers that you can add to at a later date will pay dividends both now and in the future.

Rented accommodation presents its own challenges, but if you're allowed to hang speakers on the walls then you should really consider speaker brands where there are bipole/dipole surround speakers within the range. The main reason for this is that they work far better as surrounds where the seating is fairly close to the speakers. KEF, Monitor Audio and B&W all have these type of surround speakers available.

You'll need an amp to go with the system. If it was me, and my ultimate aim was to go Atmos at some point in the future then I'd want to keep my immediate spend as low as possible rather than throwing a huge chunk of cash at an Atmos receiver now which might become out of date by the time you're ready to add the extra speakers. I would be looking at used receivers. There's a reasonable selection of 7.1 3D capable receivers available on the used market that will do a good job of driving a proper 5.1/5.1 package including good stand-mount/floor-stander fronts for pure stereo.
 
I was under the impression that if he wants to go Atmos at any point then he absolutely shouldn't go for di / bi pole speakers as Atmos is pretty strict in using directional speakers.
 
I was under the impression that if he wants to go Atmos at any point then he absolutely shouldn't go for di / bi pole speakers as Atmos is pretty strict in using directional speakers.
Dolby also has recommendations the speaker angles relative to the listener, and the height of the surround wall speakers, and the distances involved, and recommendations about using diffusing and absorbing room treatment materials. In practise there are very few real world living rooms where these recommendations can be followed. It is even difficult in some dedicated rooms because either the room isn't big enough or finances don't allow, or both.

When you read through the Atmos spec you'll also find that in certain circumstances Dolby recommends the use of Dolby Atmos enabled speakers where they use upwards firing modules to bounce the sound off the ceiling because (and this is a direct quote) "are naturally creating a more diffuse experience" and this is specifically to avoid the distraction of hearing them individually as point sources.

I know there's a lot written right now in mags and on the web trying to interpret the Atmos specs in a very rigid way. That's understandable because there are many writers simply working in theory rather than from experience and they have agendas generally based around satisfying their advertisers, or flogging gear directly or generating site traffic. Theory is fine if starting with an unlimited amount of space and money in order to achieve a perfect result. The challenge though for most of us is that we live in the real world where gear has to fit around certain limitations.

The way I look at it is that any home surround system is trying to replicate what happens in a large cinema auditorium which has the space for sound from direct firing speakers to disperse naturally and then scale that down to fit in a domestic environment. Sitting a couple of feet away from a direct radiating speaker firing straight at my ear isn't my idea of a successful translation.

I'll leave you with three thoughts...

Do you know of any of the magazines or websites that have done a comparison of Atmos based on monopole versus di/bi-pole surrounds in a typical space limited UK living room?

Has the DTS.X speaker spec changed? Last I read was that it wasn't tied to any specific type of speaker for the surrounds.

What if Aura 3D takes off?
 
Hey lucid,

Thanks for the very informative posts - a great help. I have now decided to wait on the receiver, and have taken on board the suggestion to upgrade my speaker package with my current HT-R390. Any suggestions of a good speaker package I should be looking at? I can mount speakers on the wall- no problem.

I will also get some semi decent at least speaker cable to hook it all up with.

Many thanks to your input and everybody else too for that matter.

Mark
 
Hi Mark,

I'll start with the sub since that's the trickiest on to deal with as an upgrade to your particular receiver. The HTR-390 kit uses a passive sub, so to all intents and purposes it's just another speaker in a box. The receiver has speaker outputs for the sub rather than the more conventional line level connector on an RCA/phono socket used with active subs that have their own amplification on-board. If you plan to use the Onkyo receiver as a stop-gap then any sub you might choose must have speaker level inputs as well as a line input. That would be a problem if you were looking at the typical <£800 sub/sat package. Fortunately you're looking long term and your speaker budget is sufficient to get what you need now. If I were in your shoes then I'd look at a BK subwoofer.

BK is one of those brands sold directly by the manufacturer. Cutting out the usual distribution and retail chains reduces the sales costs hugely. That wouldn't be worth much though if the products weren't that good. Fortunately BK has a great reputation. It was the manufacturing sub-contractor for REL subs.

BK's entry-level sub is the Gemini 2. I'd happily pitch that against MJ Acoustics' equivalent sized product the Pro50 MKIII. MJ sells via retailers. The Pro50 MKIII retails for £450. IMO the Gemini matches the features and performance but at £200 less. It's the same story with the higher-spec BKs too. The XLS200 uses a better driver and has more power for greater control. It also digs deeper producing strong bass lower down the frequency scale. The XLS400 goes deeper again. Both of the XLS products use Peerless drivers. That's top-spec gear. The Gemini 2 and the P12-300SB (Platinum line) use unspecified drivers but they're still excellent.

Main speakers: I am a big fan of Monitor Audio. Their products do most things right. If there's a criticism then it's that the speakers can be a touch boomy compared against KEF, but other than that they tick a lot of boxes. If you can act quick then you'll be able to scoop some serious bargains too. There's a range change happening right now. The new Bronze range is out so the older Broze BX range is beaing cleared at some hefty discounts. IMO the BX5 and BX6 floorstanders are a no brainer. Add the BX Centre and BXFX switchable di-pole/bi-pole surrounds to complete the package.


Speaker wire: There's no need to go mad. A basic 100% copper 79 strand with a cross sectional area of 2.5mm will cover all your needs. There was some stuff I saw from TLC Direct under their "Bell Wire & Speaker Cables > 79 Strand Twin Fig 8 Speaker Cable" section that would run in at around £60 delivered for 100m.
 
Hi Mark,

I'll start with the sub since that's the trickiest on to deal with as an upgrade to your particular receiver. The HTR-390 kit uses a passive sub, so to all intents and purposes it's just another speaker in a box. The receiver has speaker outputs for the sub rather than the more conventional line level connector on an RCA/phono socket used with active subs that have their own amplification on-board. If you plan to use the Onkyo receiver as a stop-gap then any sub you might choose must have speaker level inputs as well as a line input. That would be a problem if you were looking at the typical <£800 sub/sat package. Fortunately you're looking long term and your speaker budget is sufficient to get what you need now. If I were in your shoes then I'd look at a BK subwoofer.

BK is one of those brands sold directly by the manufacturer. Cutting out the usual distribution and retail chains reduces the sales costs hugely. That wouldn't be worth much though if the products weren't that good. Fortunately BK has a great reputation. It was the manufacturing sub-contractor for REL subs.

BK's entry-level sub is the Gemini 2. I'd happily pitch that against MJ Acoustics' equivalent sized product the Pro50 MKIII. MJ sells via retailers. The Pro50 MKIII retails for £450. IMO the Gemini matches the features and performance but at £200 less. It's the same story with the higher-spec BKs too. The XLS200 uses a better driver and has more power for greater control. It also digs deeper producing strong bass lower down the frequency scale. The XLS400 goes deeper again. Both of the XLS products use Peerless drivers. That's top-spec gear. The Gemini 2 and the P12-300SB (Platinum line) use unspecified drivers but they're still excellent.

Main speakers: I am a big fan of Monitor Audio. Their products do most things right. If there's a criticism then it's that the speakers can be a touch boomy compared against KEF, but other than that they tick a lot of boxes. If you can act quick then you'll be able to scoop some serious bargains too. There's a range change happening right now. The new Bronze range is out so the older Broze BX range is beaing cleared at some hefty discounts. IMO the BX5 and BX6 floorstanders are a no brainer. Add the BX Centre and BXFX switchable di-pole/bi-pole surrounds to complete the package.


Speaker wire: There's no need to go mad. A basic 100% copper 79 strand with a cross sectional area of 2.5mm will cover all your needs. There was some stuff I saw from TLC Direct under their "Bell Wire & Speaker Cables > 79 Strand Twin Fig 8 Speaker Cable" section that would run in at around £60 delivered for 100m.

Thanks for such a detailed response. I have been researching this on the net, and one suggestion as a work around to connect the sub is to connect the two spare speaker connections on my Onkyo for the front b speakers to the line inputs on the sub - not ideal but should work apparently until I replace my receiver later on. Will this work ok?

Mark
 
Thanks for such a detailed response. I have been researching this on the net, and one suggestion as a work around to connect the sub is to connect the two spare speaker connections on my Onkyo for the front b speakers to the line inputs on the sub - not ideal but should work apparently until I replace my receiver later on. Will this work ok?

Mark
:eek: Eek!!!! No! :eek: Only if you want to wreck the subwoofer. Don't do it!!

If that's really what they suggested; plug the speaker output directly in to the line level input on the sub, then whoever suggested that is an idiot.


The voltage required for the sub's line input is typically around 1Volt (rms equivalent to roughly 1.4V peak) and generally 2V (peak) is the maximum input voltage before the circuit is overdriven and distortion sets in. 1Vrms represents reference level when the amp's volume is at 0dB. In general we listen at lower levels; somewhere around -30dB to -15dB is typical, so the sub is running on somewhat a lesser voltage most of the time. Also, the current drawn by a line level connection is negligible because the impedance is very high (10,000~20,000 Ohms). Now compare and contrast with the voltages and current involved with a low impedance speaker connection at 8 Ohms. Your amp can delivery probably 40-50 Watts per speaker connection. If we take just a fraction of that, say 8W, then your amp will be pumping out a little over 8V and about 1 amp in potential current. It's gonna fry the sub.
 
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good job I checked.
To be fair, you didn't really check. It was more by good luck alone that you just happened to mention your plan.

Work-arounds..... this is when we start to try to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. These things never end well. Bearing in mind how I just saved your sub from going up in smoke then I hope you'll take this piece of advice and just run with it.... Messing about with a work-around is a waste of time and money. Yes, it can be done, but it involves many compromises and is rather short-sighted.

If I was you I'd sell the complete HTR-390 kit and buy a proper AV receiver with a subwoofer out. After all, you won't easily be able to shift the Onkyo speakers on their own, so they're going to sit gathering dust until you have a complete kit to sell.

Rather than dropping £50 of dead money in to some workaround boxes why not advertise the 390 kit for around £150 and pick up a used AVR of similar spec for around £100. The TX-SR333 would do just fine. There's one on AVForums classifieds right now. If you want to really give those new Q Acoustic speakers a good workout then there's a Yamaha RX-V1800 for sale at £200.
 
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