Early stage planning my garden building - advice

danlightbulb

danlightbulb

danlightbulb

Soldato
Joined
14 Jul 2005
Posts
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Birmingham
This may be a bit premature, but you know what its like when you get an idea in your head...

Im buying a house soon (hopefully), but it doesn't have a garage or any outdoor storage apart from an old 6x4 shed at the bottom of the garden.

So Im hoping to build a proper garden room that can be multi function as both a storage area/toolshed/bikeshed, and also be fully insulated with proper double glazing for year round/office use and could include a dartboard, some furniture, maybe even a pool table one day.

I expect the maximum space I'll have to play with will be around 5x5m, and I'd like to do everything myself.

I understand the fundamentals - 6x2 timber frame base with insulation sitting on some concrete strip foundations, walls 4x2 timber frame, insulated, with plasterboarded interior, tyvek wrap covering and cladded exterior. Double glazed french doors to the front. Gradually sloping roof again made from 4x2 with plywood over, probably edpm covering, insulated and plasterboarded internally. Obviously I will need to properly design all the timber frame structure.


I'd like to know if anyone has any ideas or examples for how to think about laying out a space like this given that I'd want it to be used for both storage and enjoyment?

And also any early stage tips on how to begin designing the structure, and where to get cheap used upvc doors from (I read somewhere these are freely available, but a look on gumtree and freecycle didn't yield much).

Off the shelf buildings like this cost upwards of £20k. By doing it myself Im hoping to do it for £3k maybe. Not sure how realistic that is, haven't priced anything up yet.

Thanks
 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
Bear in mind that anything attached to your main structure is going to need planning if it exceeds permitted development size or requires specific planning (such as location, covenant etc)

Are you planning to heat it, run power to it etc?
Click to expand...

It will be at the bottom of the garden, approx 20m from the house. There shouldn't be any unusual restrictions, so I'll likely build it to the smaller of 5x5, whatever space I have available, or the limits of permitted development. I think the limit is 2.5m in height and upto 30 square meters. So I should be ok.

Yes, Im going to properly insulate it, heat it and have power and internet.
 
Ah ok I assumed you were attaching it.

Your pricing seems keen from my experience, not saying its impossible but it all adds up quickly.

I saw something a few weeks back which is basically factory assembled (so they are structural) panels, like 2.2m high by 1m wide, already insulated and lined. You basically buy them and screw them together.

Personally if i was making a 5x5m structure, I would probably create an internal wall that screws in and trim over to make it tidy. Worst case you can then unscrew to remove, or relocate.
I think I would put a door into that wall (double internal) and have the main double doors leading into the main area.

I suppose it depends if you want it really really segregated or semi segregated. If you happy with semi segregated, make/buy a load of tall racking and use that as a wall divider internally. You an cover the back in posters or something to help that seperation, but its easy to rearrange or somethign as you want.

Bear in mind garden structures are damp, they by default cant be completely dry, so your going to want some airflow.

What are you thinking for the base?

Also FWIW I would seriously consider a log cabin. They are really nice spaces, for not much more than your budget you should be able to get one with everything already enabled bar the electrics etc. Some of them even have an internal partition built in.

I built our log cabin, added another completely fake back wall (outside to double up with more pir insulation), added a false roof (insulation), did all the electrics (lighting, sockets, internet cable) in less time that its taken me to build the frame for my new greenhouse!
 
I recently bought a door and window from this site for use in a garage office/pod I am currently building, I found them to be cheaper than most of the private sales on ebay/facebook marketplace etc

usedupvc.co.uk

Green Doors | Doors that don't cost the earth

We're committed to staying true to our values - sustainable, eco-friendly door and window solutions have been top of our agenda from day one.
usedupvc.co.uk usedupvc.co.uk

Also here are a few resources I have bookmarked regarding self building a garden room.

Facebook Group - Oakwood Garden Rooms self build group - https://www.facebook.com/groups/3043587272414632

YouTube Channels



 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
Bear in mind garden structures are damp, they by default cant be completely dry, so your going to want some airflow.
Click to expand...
Even if I build it properly insulated with a building wrap around, double glazing and rubber roof?


Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
What are you thinking for the base?
Click to expand...

Was thinking 6x2 timber floor sitting on concrete strip foundation and breeze blocks, insulated between the beams.

Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
Also FWIW I would seriously consider a log cabin. They are really nice spaces, for not much more than your budget you should be able to get one with everything already enabled bar the electrics etc. Some of them even have an internal partition built in.
Click to expand...

I can see good sized log cabins for £3k but aren't they just more solid wood sheds really?

roccles said:
Also here are a few resources I have bookmarked regarding self building a garden room.
Click to expand...

Thanks will take a look.
 
danlightbulb said:
Even if I build it properly insulated with a building wrap around, double glazing and rubber roof?




Was thinking 6x2 timber floor sitting on concrete strip foundation and breeze blocks, insulated between the beams.



I can see good sized log cabins for £3k but aren't they just more solid wood sheds really?



Thanks will take a look.
Click to expand...

Think about it, if you make it impervious to water then whatever you take in yourself is stuck in there. It cant and wont be watertight, and you don't want to aim for that

Have you priced up the timber?

Well cabins are made of wood yes, but they interlock and basically use very few fixings, even the door/window will in effect be floating in place due to how they work
 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
Think about it, if you make it impervious to water then whatever you take in yourself is stuck in there. It cant and wont be watertight, and you don't want to aim for that
Click to expand...

I assumed it would be similar to a house waterproofness.

Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
Have you priced up the timber?
Click to expand...
Not yet no. Not sure what design to go for yet hence this forum post. 5x5 will be just one big square room, but could also go for an L shaped building with a decking area or something similar. or maybe I could combine the room with a greenhouse somehow?

Im thinking of at least using it for:
* Storage of tools eg compressor, car trolley jack, loose tools and power tools etc.
* Storage of my mountain bike and bike maintenance tools.
* My turbo trainer with bike and fan, possibly a screen for zwifting.
* Storage of gardening tools and lawnmower.
* Dartboard
* A garden room to use in the summer with the doors open etc and a beer.

Basically a year round man cave plus outdoor summer house.
 
danlightbulb said:
I assumed it would be similar to a house waterproofness.


Not yet no. Not sure what design to go for yet hence this forum post. 5x5 will be just one big square room, but could also go for an L shaped building with a decking area or something similar. or maybe I could combine the room with a greenhouse somehow?

Im thinking of at least using it for:
* Storage of tools eg compressor, car trolley jack, loose tools and power tools etc.
* Storage of my mountain bike and bike maintenance tools.
* My turbo trainer with bike and fan, possibly a screen for zwifting.
* Storage of gardening tools and lawnmower.
* Dartboard
* A garden room to use in the summer with the doors open etc and a beer.

Basically a year round man cave plus outdoor summer house.
Click to expand...

It will be similar to a houses waterproofness (if thats a word lol) which also decay if there is moisture allowed to enter, but seeing as mostly they are heated then they don't have moisture issues, or its easier to control

Its the biggest issue for exterior spaces in the uk, the more you seal them up the more you need to be really on top of ventilation or you can trap moisture in place with no way to escape.

Sick of Your Garden Room / Garden Office Getting Damp From Condensation?

Damp is a common problem in UK garden rooms and garden offices, it can occur at any time but it is particularly common during the colder, wetter months of the year and anyone who has experienced it is probably well aware of just how much of a nightmare it can be to deal with! Damp
www.homegardenroom.com www.homegardenroom.com
 
How big ideally would my building need to be to accommodate a DIY woodworking area, as well as space for a dartboard, bikes and tools and gardening equipment?
 
Surely that's a how long is a piece of string question. I.e. if you need a lathe or other big powered tools then they take up huge amounts of space.

Realistically I'd say your space is going to need to be multipurpose, I don't think you'll have the room for dedicated areas for different activities.
 
Semple said:
Surely that's a how long is a piece of string question. I.e. if you need a lathe or other big powered tools then they take up huge amounts of space.

Realistically I'd say your space is going to need to be multipurpose, I don't think you'll have the room for dedicated areas for different activities.
Click to expand...

Yeah I guess I was asking what the minimum is I can get away with. Only for hobby scale stuff.

A typical UK single garage is what, 5mx2.4m?

I am going to have choice on how big I build this thing upto the maximum size I can fit in, but obviously if I can get away with not building it to the max, that will help with costs and build complexity.
 
roccles said:
I recently bought a door and window from this site for use in a garage office/pod I am currently building, I found them to be cheaper than most of the private sales on ebay/facebook marketplace etc

usedupvc.co.uk

Green Doors | Doors that don't cost the earth

We're committed to staying true to our values - sustainable, eco-friendly door and window solutions have been top of our agenda from day one.
usedupvc.co.uk usedupvc.co.uk
Click to expand...
Have bookmarked that site, could be useful, cheers.
 
I think your budget is unrealistic for a 25m2 building. Ungraded treated timber 47x100mm is around £3.25 pm up here atm. Then the cost of PIR (8 50mm sheets for the floor, 14 70mm for the walls and then the roof). Then cladding. The list goes on.

There are some options out there. Have a look a SIP's (Structural insulated panels) I think a 1.2 x 2.4m 122mm panel goes for around £90. The speed of construction is the main selling point for these. Have a look at "Simply Sips" Their cheapest option is to buy full panels then you configure/cut out windows and doors. Also insulated metal roof panels

As for the layout I would definitely partition the space to suit your needs. Keep the workshop/storage separate from the paly/seating area. Have a connecting door. Also I would think about having a separate door for the workshop. You don't want to be dragging the mower over your fresh laminate/carpet.

There is a lot to get your head around.

Just read the thread. MKW covered what I have writen.
 
Lean said:
I think your budget is unrealistic for a 25m2 building. Ungraded treated timber 47x100mm is around £3.25 pm up here atm. Then the cost of PIR (8 50mm sheets for the floor, 14 70mm for the walls and then the roof). Then cladding. The list goes on.

There are some options out there. Have a look a SIP's (Structural insulated panels) I think a 1.2 x 2.4m 122mm panel goes for around £90. The speed of construction is the main selling point for these. Have a look at "Simply Sips" Their cheapest option is to buy full panels then you configure/cut out windows and doors. Also insulated metal roof panels

As for the layout I would definitely partition the space to suit your needs. Keep the workshop/storage separate from the paly/seating area. Have a connecting door. Also I would think about having a separate door for the workshop. You don't want to be dragging the mower over your fresh laminate/carpet.

There is a lot to get your head around.

Just read the thread. MKW covered what I have writen.
Click to expand...

Thanks, its an interesting option certainly worth pricing up in detail.

14 of those panels would make nearly a 5x4m building (not including roof or floor) for around £1300 . But as they are just (I think) PIR type insulation sandwiched between 11mm OSB, then not sure why it won't be cheaper just to frame it and board it myself. I'd still need some framing I think to join those pre-built panels together.
 
Your correct. Timber sole and wall plate plus corners. You can use bought splines( keep the thermal properties) or use timber to join the panels.

I would estimate that to frame your building, just walls would be £500 timber, £400 insulation (seconds&co for slighty cheaper insulation), £280 OSB external sheathing (11mm+), £80 plasterboard for internal seating area, £160 OSB workshop. So it comes in around the same price. Obviously you have your floor, roof, base, cladding, electrics etc.

We have a 5x3 simplysip summer house coming on site this morning (wont be going up for a while). I'll let you know what I think of the quailty when we get to erect it.
 
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