Elderly Parent had a fall - Ambulance took 7 hrs

Soldato
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So I put this in TIAM yesterday, but I would like to describe the events yesterday in more detail.

So my dad is 71 and has had a bad form of arthritis that has been eating away at his skeleton for years. He has had 2 hip replacements, a shoulder and the latest was a knee replacement last Easter.

Yesterday he was putting up a curtain pole, when it slipped and fell on him knocking him off the small steps he was on. He fell in a crumpled heap, bashing his head open and in extreme pain unable to get up or support himself without mums help.

Mum phoned for the Ambulance at about 9.45, saying they suspected he had broken his hip as he couldn't walk or lift his leg. They said they were really busy and because it was a non-emergency (really? :confused:) they would get there as soon as they could, but it could be up to 2 hours.

At this point we would have taken him in the car, but he said he was unable to walk, let alone get in and out of the car, hence the need for an ambulance.

So they got him onto a dining room chair and he sat waiting. At 12 they rang again, only to be told the same thing, that they were busy etc. At 2pm, still no ambulance and another phone call, when they upgraded the call to 'priority'

At 4.30 my mum rings 999 again, understandably very upset and finally the ambulance arrived at 4.45.....7 hours after the fall! With the poor guy sat in extreme pain all day in a high backed chair.

He is then taken to the local A&E, and unfortunately as we all know they are over stretched, it was another 3.5 hr wait before he had his X-Rays. It turns out nothing was broken, thankfully, but he has torn all the muscles around his hip joints and in his groin. So they discharged him last night, with him still saying he was unable to walk, sit/stand. So they gave him some crutches and said he would have to be picked up.

I have seen this guy cut his finger off, go through multiple joint replacements and all the physio....I have never seen him yelp like he did last night when i picked him up and had to get him in and out of my car :(

Now we are generally not people who make a fuss about things, but this does seem unacceptable, how can an elderly person having a fall and a suspected broken hip be classed a non-emergency and left 7 hours before the ambulance arrives. Is it worth making a complaint? Who would I complain to?
 
Your local health board or ambulance service should have the information on how to make a complaint online. But I found this for Lincs http://www.healthwatchnorthlincolnshire.co.uk/content/making-complaint

I would take legal advice as making a complaint against any part of the NHS is a hell of a process and i speak through experience. Although they have to respond to any complaint within 20 working days they can easily give themselves unlimited time by telling you that the complaint is complex and they need more time to investigate. As long as you have received this notification with this 20 working day period they are covered to take as long as they want. This is why complaints against the NHS take so long they hope, of course, that you give up the longer it takes.

If you do go ahead with a complaint do not deal with it via the phone, it is amazing how forgetful of what has been said over the phone by the complaints department.
 
Now we are generally not people who make a fuss about things, but this does seem unacceptable, how can an elderly person having a fall and a suspected broken hip be classed a non-emergency and left 7 hours before the ambulance arrives. Is it worth making a complaint? Who would I complain to?

You can complain all you want, this is pretty standard now. It's classed as non-emergency because it's not life threatening.
 
The ambulance wait time is crazy and a sign of how the NHS is failing, but on a separate note what was your father doing putting up curtain poles with the serious and debilitating conditions you describe? That is very irresponsible and he could have easily asked someone else to do it.
 
You can complain all you want, this is pretty standard now. It's classed as non-emergency because it's not life threatening.

Pretty much this.

The ambulance wait time is crazy and a sign of how the government is failing the nhs

Fixed for you.

Poor management, poor spending and a push for privatisation is why these levels of standards wont go anytime some.
 
Took them 3 hours to come out to me when I was younger, when my appendix was about to burst.
 
The ambulance wait time is crazy and a sign of how the NHS is failing, but on a separate note what was your father doing putting up curtain poles with the serious and debilitating conditions you describe? That is very irresponsible and he could have easily asked someone else to do it.

Sympathy with the OP and his dads pain and time it took for an ambulance but have to agree here. Why was your dad, in his state, doing this sort of thing?
 
The ambulance wait time is crazy and a sign of how the NHS is failing, but on a separate note what was your father doing putting up curtain poles with the serious and debilitating conditions you describe? That is very irresponsible and he could have easily asked someone else to do it.

Sympathy with the OP and his dads pain and time it took for an ambulance but have to agree here. Why was your dad, in his state, doing this sort of thing?

Lots of people do things that might be a little ill advised and give rise to a need medical attention. That's just life.

It's really very disappointing to hear about such a slow response on such an injury.
 
I'm a big supporter of the NHS, but it needs to sort itself out.

Whilst I am more than happy to pay more tax, I need the confidence that they have removed any and all financial wastage.

7 hours wait time for an ambulance (emergency or not), is simply unacceptable. My standards are higher.
 
I would take legal advice as making a complaint against any part of the NHS is a hell of a process and i speak through experience.

You can complain all you want, this is pretty standard now. It's classed as non-emergency because it's not life threatening.

I wasn't thinking of a formal complaint, just 'feedback' so I might use that link tom_e has posted up.

I know what you mean Burnsy, it's not a red call of a stroke or heart attack and we expect in rural areas that there can be a wait, but 7 hours is ridiculous.

Heh, combine that with they nearly killed off my mum this weekend anyway.....it's not been a good show for the NHS with our family this week :p

She just had a operation for a frozen shoulder on Friday (open it up and shave off the ragged flesh/bone) all went great and on discharge she was prescribed oral morphine for the pain. 10mg / 5 ml solution.

She says the doctor said she could take 2 tablespoons worth at a time (ok she could easily have misunderstood) but she thought that was a lot so queried he meant tablespoons, which he confirmed.

She then even queried with the nurse before leaving, who looked surprised saying that sounded a lot, but if that's what the doctor said etc...

Thankfully, they still thought that was a lot and she took 1 tablespoon, 15ml which is 30mg of morphine.....well, it completely flattened her. I've looked it up and 100mg is what is classed as dangerous and only given to opiate dependant patients. If she had taken the 2 tablespoons she would have had 60mg of morphine in one hit...:eek:
 
7 hours wait time for an ambulance (emergency or not), is simply unacceptable. My standards are higher.

There are times where real emergencies such as drug overdoses where the patient is unconscious and about to go into cardiac arrest or someone who is actively losing lots of blood through an open wound where ambulances have not been available and police have had to transport to hospital.

The ambulance service is understaffed and underfunded. This has been the case for quite a while now.
 
The ambulance wait time is crazy and a sign of how the NHS is failing, but on a separate note what was your father doing putting up curtain poles with the serious and debilitating conditions you describe? That is very irresponsible and he could have easily asked someone else to do it.

I absolutely agree, but you have to understand who he is and his situation.

He is of the older generation who just work, they both work (around the house, in the garden) all day every day.

He has lived with this condition and intolerable pain for decades now. He came to the end of 'pain management' a long time ago and was addicted to prescription painkillers for years - which caused numerous health side effects.

So he has lived with the pain, medication free for years now. He has to work, it's all he has got. He has to still feel useful and needed, if he just 'sat down' and couldn't do anything he would have just given up and withered away a long time ago.
 
There are times where real emergencies such as drug overdoses where the patient is unconscious and about to go into cardiac arrest or someone who is actively losing lots of blood through an open wound where ambulances have not been available and police have had to transport to hospital.

The ambulance service is understaffed and underfunded. This has been the case for quite a while now.

oh I completely agree. The ambulances so to the highest emergency first. That said, we need more ambulances and paramedics.

cut waste, raise taxes
 
I absolutely agree, but you have to understand who he is and his situation.

He is of the older generation who just work, they both work (around the house, in the garden) all day every day.

He has lived with this condition and intolerable pain for decades now. He came to the end of 'pain management' a long time ago and was addicted to prescription painkillers for years - which caused numerous health side effects.

So he has lived with the pain, medication free for years now. He has to work, it's all he has got. He has to still feel useful and needed, if he just 'sat down' and couldn't do anything he would have just given up and withered away a long time ago.

Well, I would still have a word with him, or get your mother to supervise him a bit more closely, because misplaced pride isn't worth dying over in a silly and avoidable accident like that.
 
Can someone who works inside the NHS explain the root cause of such a slow service in recent years. Is it over population? Rise in elderly people? Lower numbers of ambulance crews?
 
Can someone who works inside the NHS explain the root cause of such a slow service in recent years. Is it over population? Rise in elderly people? Lower numbers of ambulance crews?

It's understaffing. Retention of paramedics and ambulance technicians is poor and there are always vacancies.
 
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