Engineers/Engineering

[KaHn]

Right,

Just a quick question, we have a lot of people doing IT support, plumbers, technicians etc and I would like to ask.

How many of you are called an engineer? And what job/qualifications do you have?

Seen it a few times on this forum that people will say they are an IT support engineer or something like that and was just wondering the whole numbers of it. I know we have a few proper engineers as well.

Also as a whole do you think the term "engineer" is thrown around too much in non-related industry?

Personally it doesnt bother me on a day to day basis if support monkeys want to call themselves engineers but seems to be happening more and more recently.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

Not sure I have too much empathy for the OP, though, who is clearly looking for bait, certainly given the forum he's decided to post on.

It wasn't a bait post as such, more wanting to see who one here actually calls themselves an engineer and what position they hold. The comments afterwards convey my thoughts on the subject and you jumped on them as bait.

I've stated my opinion on this subject many times but as a general I don't post in SC and unless there is an engineering sub forum I am yet to see I'll post most of my threads in GD.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

But do we, people who are not engineers, care? No. A guy does a thing. And you can dress this up as "oh but it's not proper engineering!" or "but he's only a phone engineer!" but to the people who are receiving the benefit of what the guy is doing, it's irrelevant.

Go to Germany/Frane and have the same opinon, the title there is protected as is Doctor here.

Would you goto a X Ray Operator or and Orderly for medical consult?

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

You've posted this before and for the same reasons. It's trolling. I should probably also state that it doesn't involve me in any way and if you engineers want to do this thing again then I guess that's fine.

So in sense you have basically come into a thread for the sole point of disagreeing with me? Great.........

That two different countries 'protect' a title means little to me. Do you live in either of them?

I've worked all over the world, Poland, Germany, France, Italy, Spain, Cyprus, Egypt and with engineers from a lot more countries than that so I can safely say that the title of engineer is regarded a lot higher than in this country.

But as I've said and stated that this thread was to find out numbers, I still think system admins etc should not be called an engineer but on the grand scheme of it, it doesn't bother me outside of my field as everyone understands this, but as a whole in this country its getting silly.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

You've asked this question before kahn, I'm sure of it. We get it, you're a real engineer

Must havebeen a while ago, this came up in topic when I met up with -Ad- for a beer the other week and I was discussing it with another engineer last night and recently in a thread which is why I wanted to know the numbers I put my view on it at the end of the question as to not post and run

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

Well, I came in to point out that this has been done to death and the only people who really care are the 'proper' engineers and the 'improper' engineers. Everyone else is pretty ambivalent as long as you guys do your job.

Again my question was regarding the numbers on here as it interested me, was not to belittle them I know its down to the company in question but on a whole when I tell people I'm an engineer i normally get a dumbfounded look and thats down to the diluted nature of the title.

So what will happen is that the 100 'proper' engineers will say it's a travesty that the lowly engineers can use the title and the lowly engineers will either not repond or have a hissy fit and everyone else will wonder why this has been raised yet again by a 'proper' engineer.

Seems to be going that way, but I really did just want to see how many IT guys, washing machine engineers, BT Engineers and even CNC operators who call themselves engineers.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

You should probably not post things like this if that is what you're after :

Just an idea

Tbh, my posting style on here hasn't changed in years and I don't plan on softening my opinions on something like this.

But nevermind, thanks to those who have answered the question correctly regarding what/how and opinion on if they are an engineer or if they are just given the title.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

Here's a question. What would you lot think if a established and recognised form of accreditation and regulation was applied to the term "Engineer" in IT?

Would you accept it then?

Look at it this way,

A network support person is someone who goes and fixes network problems, would you be happy if he called him self a network doctor and started telling people he is a doctor?

Or someone who deals with terms and conditions problems calling themselves a lawyer?

I think the IT lot jumped on the engineer bandwagon early and opened the flood gates to everyone else. But if a reglatory body was set up which maintained the principles of say the IMechE, RAeS or IStructE etc then yes I would have no problem with them calling themselves engineer.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

I don't care whether your style has changed or not. You cannot - or should not - state inflammatory nonsense and then when challenged on it say that you were just enquiring, only to then later say that you won't soften your opinions.

Make your mind up. You either believe the baiting crap you made in your OP or you don't. You're an intelligent man so I'm sure we can all look forward to some clarity on this.

System monkeys? Is that the comment you are so wound up about? Oh please go away magnolia, this is getting tiresome, most people know how to take my humour on here and if you don't please the ignore button is right there.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

There are plenty of roles in IT which could essentially be aligned to skill sets and processes of a typical engineer.

And I said if that was the case I would happily call them an engineer, but for this to happen it would require the title to be protected within the UK or would you still want the line blurred with those who have went through this new body with other people in the IT profession using the title?

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

I'm not wound up about anything but I will bow out. I look forward to the same post in 3 months time from now.

Post or thread? I'll probably post this again if it comes up I won't be posting the exact same thread in 3 months time asking the same question, but thanks, you can be my internet stalker now if you wish?

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

Kahn, I thought you'd said before that those in the industry know the difference, and that's what matters... and that the term "engineer" being used more wisely didn't annoy you.

I did and on a day to day basis it doesn't. Doesn't mean that I don't think the term should be protected in the UK.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

This does bother you lol, You used to bring it up when I was a Gas Engineer and you musta raised it on here a bunch of times .

Ya just have a superiority complex, the word Engineer has just become diluted over the years, much to the dislike of you top end folk

Just checked back over threads and I have never started a thread on here regarding this, I might have stated my opinion few times. Also that what when I was still at uni and I've said before it used to bother me a lot more when I was a student.

But as you said the word has become diluted from people like the council calling everyone engineers from bin cleaners to plumbers

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

Yes, it probably gets used more now than before, but hey, if it was that much of an issue there would be a minimum criteria that would have to be met for people to be called 'Engineers'.

You mean, like there is in every other western country?

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

I'm talking about this country, if you live in this country, you live by it's rules

Which is why a lot of engineers leave this country. I'll be following suit I think.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

So you're going to leave purely because other people share the same job title?

How very odd

No I'll be leaving for better pay and better working conditions in somewhere like Canada or Aus.

But nevermind Delvis, when I leave, you might be able to get my job as an engineer.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

Haven't read the whole thread but just wanna mention how engineers are thought of in my country Cyprus.

1st) Whoever listens to the fact that i'm studying Engineering says: "why didn't you go at a garage or something?"
2nd) The pay is less than half of what you get in the UK while the cost of living is about the same if not more.
3rd) I'm currently in my 3rd year studying Mech. Eng. and when I get my degree I will not be able to work in my country as an engineer simply because three year degrees are considered incomplete and you cannot register to a professional body.

My point? Stop complaining about pay, recognition etc. I find that the UK is amongst the best countries to be for engineers.

P.S. A friend of my cousin's was working in the UK and found an ad from a Cypriot company asking for engineers with a 50,000euro pay per year, whereas if you called to the offices from Cyprus, they wouldn't even say they were looking for someone for a job opening. This shows that the 4 year degrees taught in the various "Universities" are not better than the 3 year degrees over here, bad worse, and this shows how bad the infrastructure is for finding jobs.

Sorry but what you are saying is that the engineering companies in Cyprus prefer engineers from the UK over Cypriots, not that they don't recognise the qualifications, just that they don't want cypriots working for them.

Different kettle of fish.

KaHn

 

[KaHn]

No, the guy is cypriot, they were just looking for someone who studied in the UK.

So then its your universities.

KaHn