EV general discussion

[Kenai]

IMO Phev's are useful if you dont have a driveway or cant charge from home.

I see them as the opposite really, they almost only make sense (outside of tax dodging) if you can charge at home.

You can do all your local driving on electric, possibly even a decent commute with some of the longer range ones, get all the convenience of cheap home charging but no range anxiety if you have odd habits or routines that might be a pain with an EV alone. That way you can look past the fact you're lugging an engine and battery around, because you can do enough mileage on cheap electric.

Throw in half decent BIK rates still, fuel cost based mileage reimbursement and doing around 1500 miles between fuel fills and they can make a lot of sense in the company car market.

I haven't charged mine on a public charger once yet because it's (usually) more expensive than just running the engine in that case. This is why people who only get them because of company car tax often don't ever charge them if they can't home charge.

 

[VincentHanna]

I remember needing to charge once and finding a bloody PHEV on the only charger nearby with nobody in it and it at 100%.

That sort of thing is less of a problem now the charging infrastructure is better of course

 

[Alibaba99]

Phev is great if used right. But it's a narrow tipping point where daily range fits in a small phev battery that you charge all the time versus have to charge on a long journey in a BEV a few times or are so remote to have few charging options or it's a pain to do so.

I think if so many dislike the whole charging thing that it puts them off a BEV they'll never do it with a PHEV. A non hybrid ICE might just be better for them.

But I'm bias because I'm not doing the journeys that a phev might be ideal for.

There are plenty of hybrids with 50-60 mile ranges available these days. That is going to cover the majority of peoples daily commutes, where 75% cover less than 20 miles a day.

A friend of mine got a Skoda Superb hybrid start of last year, he's currently averaging around 1500 miles/tank of fuel.

 

[chanjy]

There are plenty of hybrids with 50-60 mile ranges available these days. That is going to cover the majority of peoples daily commutes, where 75% cover less than 20 miles a day.

A friend of mine got a Skoda Superb hybrid start of last year, he's currently averaging around 1500 miles/tank of fuel.

But a decent BEV would probably have worked for them too tbh

 

[sandys]

You can do all your local driving on electric, possibly even a decent commute with some of the longer range ones, get all the convenience of cheap home charging but no range anxiety if you have odd habits or routines that might be a pain with an EV alone. That way you can look past the fact you're lugging an engine and battery around, because you can do enough mileage on cheap electric.

Pretty much this for us, we rarely use the engine on our XC60, it's there for long distance and towing rest of the time we are driving an EV, doesn't matter its lugging engine or battery around, it is not like you notice that in this type of vehicle, it is still efficient for the size of car it is, beats our old diesel 4x4 hands down.

 

[OspreyO]

There are plenty of hybrids with 50-60 mile ranges available these days. That is going to cover the majority of peoples daily commutes, where 75% cover less than 20 miles a day.

A friend of mine got a Skoda Superb hybrid start of last year, he's currently averaging around 1500 miles/tank of fuel.

So for the majority of their driving they bought a Newish EV with a 50 mile range that they have to charge daily.

Granted many people do long trips to places at the weekend where charging is inconvenient. And granted if everyone's wants a phev it will depreciate slower. But you're going to hammer that battery.

 

[lordrobs]

When on fossil fuel you are pulling batteries, motors and inverters around with no benefit,

All hybrids (apart from mild) have that stuff as well, just with a smaller battery.

People don't worry about lugging 80kWh of battery when on a daily basis they don't use more than 20kWh.

Plugging in a PHEV is more than just about the pure electric miles anyway. The hybrid fuel economy boost is massive. I soon learnt what mode works out best across a journey. Although I did mess up today returning home from a 64 mile round trip with 12% left in the battery

 

[Simon]

All hybrids (apart from mild) have that stuff as well, just with a smaller battery.

People don't worry about lugging 80kWh of battery when on a daily basis they don't use more than 20kWh.

Plugging in a PHEV is more than just about the pure electric miles anyway. The hybrid fuel economy boost is massive. I soon learnt what mode works out best across a journey. Although I did mess up today returning home from a 64 mile round trip with 12% left in the battery

Indeed a good hybrid will get a lot of regen that a ICE would not. All about flexibility and different circumstances

As you say the engine etc is less weight than ‘unused’ battery

 

[Rroff]

Phev is great if used right. But it's a narrow tipping point where daily range fits in a small phev battery that you charge all the time versus have to charge on a long journey in a BEV a few times or are so remote to have few charging options or it's a pain to do so.

I think if so many dislike the whole charging thing that it puts them off a BEV they'll never do it with a PHEV. A non hybrid ICE might just be better for them.

But I'm bias because I'm not doing the journeys that a phev might be ideal for.

This is the thing for me - my normal commute fits inside the battery range of a PHEV, popping out to the shops, etc. and living rurally it would be nice if we ever have to deal with things like fuel shortages - though fortunately that hasn't been a thing lately. But sometimes I have to do a lot of miles for work and occasionally have to do a lot of miles on top of a lot of miles (due to the emergency nature of it I can't be messing about) so a PHEV would be a great fit there but I've not found one yet which ticks all the boxes for me - the only hybrids which otherwise do fall over because they aren't plug in ones which defeats the point.

 

[OspreyO]

All hybrids (apart from mild) have that stuff as well, just with a smaller battery.

People don't worry about lugging 80kWh of battery when on a daily basis they don't use more than 20kWh.

Plugging in a PHEV is more than just about the pure electric miles anyway. The hybrid fuel economy boost is massive. I soon learnt what mode works out best across a journey. Although I did mess up today returning home from a 64 mile round trip with 12% left in the battery

If it's not about the electric. Where do think the economy comes from?

 

[OspreyO]

This is the thing for me - my normal commute fits inside the battery range of a PHEV, popping out to the shops, etc. and living rurally it would be nice if we ever have to deal with things like fuel shortages - though fortunately that hasn't been a thing lately. But sometimes I have to do a lot of miles for work and occasionally have to do a lot of miles on top of a lot of miles (due to the emergency nature of it I can't be messing about) so a PHEV would be a great fit there but I've not found one yet which ticks all the boxes for me - the only hybrids which otherwise do fall over because they aren't plug in ones which defeats the point.

Can't be many people who need to do emergency non stop "miles on top of lot of miles".

 

[Rroff]

Can't be many people who need to do emergency non stop "miles on top of lot of miles".

Talking about my personal circumstances - my average daily use sits well inside the ideal spot for EVs and I have off road parking near to power, but I'm on the emergency call out list at work and have elderly relatives so occasionally I have to do stuff which is a deal breaker for an EV (only happened twice this year and 3 times last but it isn't something you can just get around), whereas a PHEV would work great, but I've not yet found one that ticks all the boxes for me personally.

 

[OspreyO]

I know a few people who just do regular "non emergency" long trips at the weekend to places that don't have many chargers. Home to family, or a boat. Or surfing, or just a weekend away. It's just convenient not to have to charge. That I get.

I don't really get the concept of plan that has the only emergency contact or resource hours and hours and miles and miles away from where it might be needed. Each to their own.

 

[OspreyO]

A more straightforward reason to choose the phev is that it's likely to depreciate less.

 

[Rroff]

I don't really get the concept of plan that has the only emergency contact or resource hours and hours and miles and miles away from where it might be needed. Each to their own.

That is a good question though another topic again - but partly because most people don't want to do it and there is only a limited number who can.

 

[OspreyO]

That is a good question though another topic again - but partly because most people don't want to do it and there is only a limited number who can.

It's a fringe use case, that doesn't apply to the vast majority.

 

[OspreyO]

Happened to have time to kill the other day beside a Renault garage. Got to look around the R5 in the showroom. I was surprised by how little room there was in the back. Very sporty driving position.

They had a BEV Scenic. That was a nice interior but it's 2.5 seats across in the back. But lots of space otherwise. There was a bigster beside it, was disappointed in the rear space in that. I think the Scenic had more space. Big difference in the quality of the interior. The bigster didn't feel basic, it felt cheap. For the size of the vehicle I was disappointed in the interior space. I miss the MPVs.

 

[Rroff]

It's a fringe use case, that doesn't apply to the vast majority.

Yeah but there are people in situations like me especially say people who do caring, etc. proper where a PHEV would be a good compromise.

Got to look around the R5 in the showroom.

Someone around my way has one in green actually passed it on the way to work today - pictures/video doesn't come close to conveying how good they look in person, I'm not one for the design language of a lot of new cars but they really did something special with the R5.

 

[OspreyO]

It's quite the compromise.

 

[Tinders]

For me my old 330e was a gateway drug into full EV, obviously the lower BIK helped. Range was a paltry 450milea combined so it wasn’t a huge deal more than the 320 I get in the ID.

Now I look back on it after a year and 27k on EV, the older PHEV’s were far too compromised , the batteries steal so much space and the range was too low, not to mention the 3kw charging speed. However the twin turbo 2.0 petrol did help add some drama.

All the new ones seem to do 7.2kw ac and 50-100kw DC charging and the batteries are 20kw. But I can’t see myself going back to PHEV now. The wife will get a used EV next then I’ll get a nice old petrol toy before they are killed off.