EV general discussion

Em3bbs · 22 Dec 2020 at 13:40

WJA96 said:
Weren't you just APPALLED when you saw how little there actually was inside that gigantic housing?

Not really no, it's a good shape that it isn't jutting out from the wall, and as johnnycoupe says as it is tethered it looks neater.

One design change I'd make, would be that the power socket doesn't stick out so much when in the holder.

SDK^ · 22 Dec 2020 at 13:59

WJA96 said:
one video where they tested how long it took to get the car up from -10C to +20C and it took 20 minutes and 10% of the battery without a battery heater

That’s the problem I think people are finding - 20 minutes is probably longer than most are driving in a single trip, so the battery never gets warm.
Before the schools finished for Christmas I was doing 3 miles a day on drop off/pickup, which consisted of 4 separate trips, each one only 0.75 miles. So pre-warning is pointless and the battery never gets warm.
Even for me to drive to a town centre it could take 15-20mins so for all of the trip the battery isn’t at optimum.

it’s fine for me, getting shorter range in these conditions, as I knew this when going into an EV. For some people buying them, or watching YouTube reviews it’s a major shock.

jpaul · 22 Dec 2020 at 15:00

seeking alpha has an interesting meta-analysis

bimbleuk · 22 Dec 2020 at 15:16

RoboCod said:
Nio is going to directly compete with tesla I believe

If BEVs were ever only 2% of the market then this would be true except EVs will eventually start to replace ICe vehicles with Norway being the extreme example with 80% sales recently.

There's less info available about the Chinese companies but from what I gleaned NIO are more like the Apple of EVs wanting to offer a more complete lifestyle package as part of the car buying experience. They don't just sell you a car but offer clubs and extra customer after care services. So I'd say XPeng were the more comparable Chinese brand with similar or lower cost vehicles.

NIO cars are very much in the Model S/X price range with lower cost models coming late 2021/22. They offer a lower entry cost by offering a battery lease and swap service.

lordrobs · 22 Dec 2020 at 16:27

jpaul said:
seeking alpha has an interesting meta-analysis

So in summary... take Tesla quoted range with a huge pinch of salt?

Jonnycoupe · 22 Dec 2020 at 17:59

Tesla submits their own EPA rating as seem to still manage to use a 0.77 factor rather than others who submit actual cars or have a 0.7 factor....

I had a good experience earlier for a quick splash to get home from a National Trust place.

car was brilliant to highlight chargers on route, what connectors and even if available.

Really simple using just the phone app. Will use the dedicated app in the future as 31p and next time I’ll try BP as rates are cheaper especially with polar subscription. Keen to see what Octopus are working on with their Juice card for 2021 to link all the providers, give preferential rates and then simply bill to your home electric bill.

jpaul · 22 Dec 2020 at 23:00

Jonnycoupe said:
Tesla submits their own EPA rating as seem to still manage to use a 0.77 factor rather than others who submit actual cars or have a 0.7 factor....

given the litgious USA , I'm surprised no one has complained, the public/we will view this like a continuation of the emissions scandal.
sandbagging for battery longevity/consistency is one tesla explanation.
edit: ie. it will do 330W/mile forever because there is a X% battery degradation built in.

Jonnycoupe said:
a quick splash to get home

did you actually need it ? or , just, practise makes perfect , for when you need it in anger.

Jonnycoupe · 22 Dec 2020 at 23:26

Was 41mile home and 53 in the tank and I work on logic 10miles can disappear in an instant (on most cars if the BMS sees a low module voltage) so wasn’t gonna play that game, kinda needed it and wanted to get a feel/experience of it all.
Easy in a pub carpark at the minute

Car seems to want to get home on 10% so even described the 13 minute delay for charging enroute.

Journey · 22 Dec 2020 at 23:31

I love how accurate the GOM on the Ioniq is, its so much nicer than a petrol car, you can actual tell how many miles range you have left, and it is accurate. If it says I have 36 miles left, then I have 36 miles left, plus another xx miles below 0, but I try not to let it go to zero, normally no less than 3%.

Can certainly see the difference in the summer vs the winter range though, mainly based on the wet roads, and more wind, also the battery temperature not being ideal has an impact, still seeing 4.2 mpkWh though on the day-to-day use. Still 160 miles from a 38kWh battery put other manufacturers to shame.

Jonnycoupe · 22 Dec 2020 at 23:42

Yeah that’s impressive, but it ain’t got 400bhp

funny when slow traffic and drive thru etc doesn’t chew down on trip average mpg and the car becomes more efficient. So far mines consistently 244-265mile battery range on the screen. I’ll see how it fairs with more use and charges etc but so far I’m really impressed with the range and its reasonable roadload efficiency to power and interior space. Just the stickler is RRP. :mad:

Charging is where the more efficient cars win though. Significantly more miles per minute when using the wide range of 50kW rapids.

Simon · 22 Dec 2020 at 23:47

Journey said:
I love how accurate the GOM on the Ioniq is, its so much nicer than a petrol car, you can actual tell how many miles range you have left, and it is accurate. If it says I have 36 miles left, then I have 36 miles left, plus another xx miles below 0, but I try not to let it go to zero, normally no less than 3%.

Why constant comparisons to petrol that are irrelevant. The range on most petrols is as accurate as it also knows how much energy is left vs the rate of consumption

Oh and big surprise a bigger car like an 4wd SUV uses more energy than a shopping car.

Journey · 22 Dec 2020 at 23:52

Jonnycoupe said:
Yeah that’s impressive, but it ain’t got 400bhp

My TSLA could pay for a Tesla/iPace etc. many times over but why when I can still do 0-38 mph in less time than most ICE cars away from the lights which is the only real difference.

Jonnycoupe said:
funny when slow traffic and drive thru etc doesn’t chew down on trip average mpg and the car becomes more efficient. So fair mines 240-265mile tank is telling me. I’ll see how it fairs with more use etc but so far I’m really impressed with the range and reasonable roadload efficiency to power.

Inner town and city driving really shows you how beneficial BEV's are, but it is when you get them on them on faster roads you can see the badly designed/inefficient some models can be... bloke round the corner has an EQC, man that thing is totally crap for doing 50+ mph it just eats kW of electric. I really wanted to replace my last Merc with a BEV model, but they had nothing out, and is seems they may only have something out when this car is due back. I really hope they make them better than the crap they have on offer now.

Jonnycoupe said:
Charging is where the more efficient cars win though. Significantly more miles per minute

Yeah, max speed on the Ioniq is 46kW from a rapid, but that is way more than enough, was great in summer touring the lakes, Scotland and getting 5.8-6.2 mpkWh, a 20 minute pee break/drink meant a huge range increase.

RoboCod · 23 Dec 2020 at 00:04

bimbleuk said:
If BEVs were ever only 2% of the market then this would be true except EVs will eventually start to replace ICe vehicles with Norway being the extreme example with 80% sales recently.

There's less info available about the Chinese companies but from what I gleaned NIO are more like the Apple of EVs wanting to offer a more complete lifestyle package as part of the car buying experience. They don't just sell you a car but offer clubs and extra customer after care services. So I'd say XPeng were the more comparable Chinese brand with similar or lower cost vehicles.

NIO cars are very much in the Model S/X price range with lower cost models coming late 2021/22. They offer a lower entry cost by offering a battery lease and swap service.

Nio have recency offered up 60 million new shares to raise cash to invest in R&D. I definitely think they're the ones to watch going forward. Li Auto and XPENG look set to follow suit but I definitely think Nio are the ones to potentially compete the most.

Hyburnate · 23 Dec 2020 at 01:22

The Osprey chargers are good if a little on the expensive side.

I'm a big fan of the Polar ones purely because of the .15p, I topped up at the local Tesco earlier on the 50kw Pod-Point which was nice.

Jonnycoupe · 23 Dec 2020 at 01:34

True but only as a polar subscriber, seems PAYG is 25p and contactless payment 30p.

I’ve got free trial for 3months but still waiting to activate. (Only 2days into EV Ownership)

Hyburnate · 23 Dec 2020 at 01:44

Jonnycoupe said:
True but only as a polar subscriber, seems PAYG is 25p and contactless payment 30p.

I’ve got free trial for 3months but still waiting to activate. (Only 2days into EV Ownership)

You'll still be waiting in two weeks. They are still moving everyone over to a new system so it's causing delays.

Look at Milton Keynes with the Polar App

That's the reason I love it.

SDK^ · 23 Dec 2020 at 05:37

Hyburnate said:
Look at Milton Keynes with the Polar App That's the reason I love it.

Looks like the budget holder has a passion for EV’s

bimbleuk · 23 Dec 2020 at 08:36

RoboCod said:
Nio have recency offered up 60 million new shares to raise cash to invest in R&D. I definitely think they're the ones to watch going forward. Li Auto and XPENG look set to follow suit but I definitely think Nio are the ones to potentially compete the most.

60m plus the extra 9m that the banks optioned which is usually a good sign when raising capital.

I started investing in NIO in February. So though I'm bias towards them and rate them second to Tesla currently they do have limited capacity to produce cars and rely on a 3rd party to manufacture them. They are increasing volume to 60,000 units which is fine for a high end car brand but they will have to keep increasing this as they introduce lower cost models such as a saloon. If they break even in the next year or so they'll really explode again.

XPeng can produce ~250,000 units themselves as far a I'm aware. NIO can't really compete on cost but they are trying to establish themselves as the go to brand in China for the nouveau riche.

Journey · 23 Dec 2020 at 19:40

I'll be popping the car in charge tonight for some free electricity, might not put to much in as I can see some negative pricing over the next week for sure.

Jonnycoupe · 23 Dec 2020 at 20:26

Xmas day free 8-12. Shame no smart meter yet