FAO: Bikers - Does this seem like a good plan?

AtomicBanana

AtomicBanana

AtomicBanana

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Hi there guys, long term lurker here making my annual motors post ;)

I've done a search through the threads here and plenty of research elsewhere but would just like to get some input on my current plan for biking.

At the moment, I've only done my CBT, which was quite an eyeopener (you're going to let me on the road after showing me *this* little?). I feel I've benefited from 2 years of driving experience, but of course I'm not claiming I'm 'experienced' just that 'road sense' helped a lot that day.

Then a few months has gone by as I wasn't sure about which bike to get, go straight on and do my full (restricted as I'm under 21) bike test, or ride a little one around for a while, then do it.

I decided that the latter is perhaps the best idea, but I'm not really sure what the best option is. What I'd like to do ideally is ride around on a little L plated 125 for a few a few months, then at the start of summer, do my restricted bike test (sorry forget the proper name) and get a restricted vfr400.

Or, should I just wait till I'm 21 and do that? I guess in the end I'd only have to wait to august 12th (still summer right? ;)) and could ride it unrestricted.

Being a young male, I of course want something like a cbr 125, but if I'm only keeping a few months, I shall imagine it's not worth it? In terms of insurance and depreciation. As much as I hate it - a cg125 is a safe bet? How cheap are they to insure?

Final question is that of motorbike gear. What brands should I look for, and what shops should I be looking at? How much am I looking at? I'm not looking to cheap out, but obviously don't need the premium stuff either.

Sorry for the long post, I appreciate any input I can get :]
 
AtomicBanana said:
Hi there guys, long term lurker here making my annual motors post ;)

I've done a search through the threads here and plenty of research elsewhere but would just like to get some input on my current plan for biking.

At the moment, I've only done my CBT, which was quite an eyeopener (you're going to let me on the road after showing me *this* little?). I feel I've benefited from 2 years of driving experience, but of course I'm not claiming I'm 'experienced' just that 'road sense' helped a lot that day.

Then a few months has gone by as I wasn't sure about which bike to get, go straight on and do my full (restricted as I'm under 21) bike test, or ride a little one around for a while, then do it.

I decided that the latter is perhaps the best idea, but I'm not really sure what the best option is. What I'd like to do ideally is ride around on a little L plated 125 for a few a few months, then at the start of summer, do my restricted bike test (sorry forget the proper name) and get a restricted vfr400.

Or, should I just wait till I'm 21 and do that? I guess in the end I'd only have to wait to august 12th (still summer right? ;)) and could ride it unrestricted.

Being a young male, I of course want something like a cbr 125, but if I'm only keeping a few months, I shall imagine it's not worth it? In terms of insurance and depreciation. As much as I hate it - a cg125 is a safe bet? How cheap are they to insure?

Final question is that of motorbike gear. What brands should I look for, and what shops should I be looking at? How much am I looking at? I'm not looking to cheap out, but obviously don't need the premium stuff either.

Sorry for the long post, I appreciate any input I can get :]
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Right, i'll try to answer in order.

With regards to riding a 125 on L's vs. getting a "bigger" bike after doing your full test, I would suggest the latter.

I'm doing my motorcycle theory tomorrow and shall be getting my test done soon after, then i'm looking to buy a CBR400RR (I'm 18) and ride that.

You'll gain the needed experience during your lessons, so you wont benefit from riding a 125 around for a while really. You also don't have to wait that long before you can ride the VFR you talk about derestricted, so why not just go the whole hog now and get a bike while they're cheap (winter).

Once you've passed your test and got your VFR you'll be all set up for the rest of your riding life. Just keep upgrading the bikes and you're sorted.

With regards to equipment, look for the "A.C.U Gold Approved" helmets (a little gold sticker on the back somewhere) when it comes to helmets, then pay as much as you're willing to. My helmet is an HJC CS, which cost me £120. It's not the best, but it's comfy and does the job.

My gloves are double stitched leather ones with a carbon fibre knuckle guard. They were £20 from my local bike shop and do fine. You don't have to pay megabucks to get good equipment.

Get yourself a pair of boots, mine cost me £25 and they're leather with sliders on the side and a zip and velcro fastening. Provided they're well made, you've got nothing to worry about.

Then a jacket and trousers are a good idea, make sure the jacket has a spine protector and elbow guards built in. Try to get a material one rather than leather because they're warmer in the winter, cooler in the summer and waterproof. Same goes with trousers.

I think that's everything, if not, just ask :)
 
Thanks for the advice - am I best just going down to my local shop for gear, or are there any good websites I can browse now?

regarding gear just buy the best you can afford. can you afford to put a price on your life?
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Yes, that's pretty much what I was thinking, I guess really what I was looking for was a 'baseline' for quality stuff vs tat on stuff I'm not sure of the value of (gloves, boots, etc).
 
AtomicBanana said:
Thanks for the advice - am I best just going down to my local shop for gear, or are there any good websites I can browse now?



Yes, that's pretty much what I was thinking, I guess really what I was looking for was a 'baseline' for quality stuff vs tat on stuff I'm not sure of the value of (gloves, boots, etc).
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i recommend sidi shoes if you can afford them. i have them my dad has them and my mum has them. comfy look good and last a long while. i also use sidi cycling shoes of which i have 2 pairs and the quality is well worth the money
just try on as many things as you can and see which is comfiest though really
 
Personally id say do your full test asap.
Although rideing on a 125 for a while does benifit you, as you can learn a lot in that time, it goes boreing quickly and they are not fun to ride during winter (wind really affects their handling being so light).

A CG125 is an excellent leaner bike, can be bought for cheap and run for peanuts, compleatly bulletproof to boot!
However, if you choose to be rideing a 125 for a fair while, I can highly reccomend a CBR 125.

Ive been rideing a CBR 125 for a year now and Im waiting till Febuary until I can do my DAS, simply because its only around the corner plus I can save for a bigger bike in the time.

As for bike gear, the general rule is buy the best you can afford.
I have two kits myself.

For my work commute its a textile jacket, Draggin Jeans (lined with kevlar), Sidi Vertigo Corsa`s, Rev'It! Quicksilver gloves and a Caberg V2 helmet.

For anyting else its Rev'It! RS2 leather jacket, Rev'It! Pulse leather pants, Sidi`s, quicksilvers and Caberg V2 again.
 
I would wait mess around on your 125 till summer (maybe get a bike now as suggested due to a winter bargain) do your full test then Jump on a 600 (you will out grow the 400 too quickly)

don't neglect any area of protection as you will regret it. Going to the child killing zx10r from my 600 I replaced all my old gear £270 on alpine star trousers £430 on a Jacket £190 on boots £120 on gloves my trusty X900 Shoei helmet may get replaced incase as its had a few knocks so maybe another £360 and a back protector is also coming at £90

£1460 is far less than the value of my life and it's not a question of if you crash but when

obviously I have paid out for the best but cheaper gear with the correct approval stamps will do pretty much the same Job but it I get an extra 2% chance of walking after a crash I'll pay another £500

I would say It you can afford it don't skimp on the helmet spend the extra to protect your head

take it carefully on the bigger bike and hopefully you will never need your gear :)

These guys on very helpful and competitively priced http://www.onyerbike.net
 
PyroboyUK said:
So true, I used to ride with a caberg helmet and after comparing it with my Latest Shoei im so glad i didnt have an accident while wearing the caberg.....
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Care to elaborate?
I wear a Caberg V2 and the only thing I can complain about is the noise.
 
So it's worth getting a cg125 or something to mess around on /ride about up here at uni? To be honest, after doing my CBT I didn't feel that comfortable to be moving on to new stuff. I'd just like to gain a little experience before hand. But if you guys really think I'm not going to gain much, maybe it's not worth it.

I am tempted by a cbr 125 for now - but surely insurance is going to rape me, and it's pretty likely to get nicked? Do they have good resale value? that'd make it easier to swallow.

I'd never cheap out on gear - I guess I phrased it badly. It's more that I wanted to know how much to budget for it!
 
Regarding the ACU Gold sticker. There was an article in MCN a few weeks back saying that the helmets that have that sticker might not be worth the small premium that allows you to use the helmet on track as the helmets didn't meet the standard. They were going to buy a sheet of gold stickers for about £10,000(?) but didn't go through with it because of the money that was required upfront.

Best bet is to go to your local bike shop and try and helmets and kit as a propper fitting cheap helmet will offer better protection than a £500 race rep poor fitting helmet. Everybody has a different shape head.

A CBR 125 is just a newer CG 125 with plastic fairings which can be expensive if you fall off. As you are looing at doing the test in less than a year then I would get the cheaper CG 125 until then. Although the CBR 125 is one of the best selling bikes at the moment so you probabaly won't have a problem selling it.
 
AtomicBanana said:
So it's worth getting a cg125 or something to mess around on /ride about up here at uni? To be honest, after doing my CBT I didn't feel that comfortable to be moving on to new stuff. I'd just like to gain a little experience before hand. But if you guys really think I'm not going to gain much, maybe it's not worth it.

I am tempted by a cbr 125 for now - but surely insurance is going to rape me, and it's pretty likely to get nicked? Do they have good resale value? that'd make it easier to swallow.

I'd never cheap out on gear - I guess I phrased it badly. It's more that I wanted to know how much to budget for it!
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If you dont feel comfortable moving up to a bigger bike so soon dont.
Get some road experience and miles under your belt.

CBR 125 insurance does tend to be highish, mine last year was £1008 (no NCB) and this year is going to be 213-50ish.
Yes, due to the sporty look it has a higher chance of being nicked, but theres many things you can do to make sure it doesnt.
Yes, they have very good resale value, a good looked after 2005 bike can reach around 2000.

I dont think anyone could give you a budget for your gear, as said as much as you can afford really. That extra 1% chance of coming out of a crash/fall unharmed is worth the money.
 
Hello AtomicBanana,

I was in a similar situation to you a few months ago - being under 21 but wanting to get a good bike.

There are good reasons for going strait for a big bike. A 125 is underpowered, is downright dangerous on A roads, you cannot get out of danger, you cannot overtake effectively, and you can be easily pushed about by cars due to being on a small bike with L plates.

Monetary matters also affect it – you pay through the nose for a 125 for not much reward due to the demand for them because of the law. You will be bored of a 125 within weeks, and will find yourself wishing you spent the money on a test and a big bike. (e.g. CBR125, slow and unfun £2500. or intensive course £450 and a bandit 600 £1500 or even a CB500 £1000 ) You are much better off passing you’re test and buying a commuter 500/600 to get used to biking on.

Insurance - you simply need to ring around and have selective hearing. You can get a good bike for cheap insurance if you play the companies off each other. It takes time, but think about your current job- spending time ringing around could save you £200 for an hours work. Do you get paid more than £200/hour? If so you don't even need to worry about insurance, get your butler to do it :D edit: For reference, I first got a quote of £1k/£400 excess TPFT on my bandit. Ringing around got it down to £370/£200 excess. 19yo no years NCB, no years on liscence, no previous bike

I did an intensive course. Basically ask a bike school for a DAS on a 125. I had a full car licence for about a year before so understood the rules of the road, all I needed was to learn how to control the bike and bike specific road rules (positioning, lifesavers etc). This took me 3 days, and cost me £420 including bike hire, gear, petrol, and test. One point – I had passed my theory before as it was not feasible to book theory and normal test so close in case I failed the theory.

You will get a single instructor to 2 of you (sometimes 1 if you’re lucky). Usually the other person will doing a DAS on a big bike, however you lead so they don’t get away from you.

With regards to gear – To start off with get a helmet jacket and gloves, these are the minimum needed for you to be able to be able to use the bike without freezing to death strait away. Helmets range from £100 up for good quality ones. Below this price, helmets are still safe, they just don’t have useful features, like non-fog visors, washable liners, well placed air vents etc.

For a jacket put aside £150. Both leather and textile are good, leather obviously looks a hell of allot better, but textile is better for miserable English winters. Then again I’ve been using my leather jacket with no trouble, you just have to wear a jumper beneath it if it’s really cold, and if it’s really chucking it down on a long journey something waterproof over it. (Leather is fine for medium amounts of rain)

Gloves – at this time of year winter gloves are needed as your hands are sticking right out in the wind. Summer gloves make it easier to control the bike in warmer weather, but at these temperatures (10C and less ambient) your hands will become too cold to be able to control it.

Pretty soon you’ll want to get some trousers and boots. (Although the engine keeps your legs warm if you’re really skint. Don’t leave it too long though, as road rash will hurt if you fall off). Again, the textile/leather argument follows exactly the same lines as the jacket. Boots – get waterproof ones, try for ones designed for a bike, as regular boots lacing can get caught on pegs of the bike meaning you drop it.

Finally, ignore your family . These well intentioned kill joys will be concerned about your health and non mangled state. Let them go and be boring elsewhere, have some fun whilst you have little responsibilities. They’ll get over it eventually. Plus, if you get proper training and don’t be an arse, you’ll probably be fine.

Hope this is helpful,

Loz
 
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That's very helpful, thank you.

To be honest, I think you are right, I think I can easily skip the 125 stage. While I felt a little shaky after just a few hours during CBT, by the end of the day I was fine and just knew it'd be a matter of practice.

I must admit I'm a little embarrassed to say my main reason for considering a 125 to learn on was because I didn't want to see like a complete n00b doing my intensive course but I think I just have to get over that and realize that's why I'm there being taught!

Also, to be clear, it's not so much that I'm scared of bigger bikes, and don't feel worried - it's just that I do wonder what I'll be like on one. For the time being I drive an old cheap Clio, the typical student run-around (fox notwithstanding ;)) and we're talking 0-60 in ~ 20 seconds ;) Of course any of these 400/600 bikes are going to blow my mind restricted or not. In that regard and I just wanted some input on what the general opinion is on going straight to a big bike.

Regarding the 125 prices, I know, it's *insane* a crappy 125 more than a sexy vfr400? madness!

I have gone all over the place on which bike I'd like and decided it'd be sensible to own, from GSXR 600 (yeah, perhaps not eh? ;)) to Bandits and the like, and atm really into the vfr 400's which is why I must ask:

(you will out grow the 400 too quickly)
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Really? VFR's get glowing reviews as 'first big bikes' and seem pretty quick? This is a genuine question, I'm not being factitious :)

EDIT: Forgot to say:

Finally, ignore your family . These well intentioned kill joys will be concerned about your health and non mangled state. Let them go and be boring elsewhere, have some fun whilst you have little responsibilities. They’ll get over it eventually. Plus, if you get proper training and don’t be an arse, you’ll probably be fine.
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Yeah, my mum isn't too pleased, but it's all good - my dad has ridden since he was 17 and he's still around ;) Only had one minor accident and he's had some fast bikes in his time. I intend to take as much training as I can afford - I know I want to ride fast bikes, and fast, but I want to do it as safely as possible.
 
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Nah you wont feel like a n00b on the intensive course - sure youll screw up but thats exactly why your doing the lessons.

wrt whats a bigger bike like - remember that a throttle isnt on/off :p . Just because you have 30mm worth of throttle travel doesnt mean you have to go past the first 5mm for the first few weeks :)

About 400's - as a big guy i tried them and simply did not fit on them, but if my bandits anything to go by, Id probably find the lack of top end power annoying when i was on the motorway/dual carrigway. Or even overtaking on NSL roads without a bit of a runnup

Buuut, whats your use of it gonna be? If its going to be a weekend fun tool for going around on local twisties, then a 400 sports is fine. If you commuting or using it more generally try something a little more like a bandit, hornet etc.

Whatever you buy you will love it, dont be too hasty in beleiveing all those online reviews as to what you must have as your first big bike.

If you have your heart set on a certain bike dont get something else without at least trying it (blagging test rides at dealers are good way to go about this, dont try it with private sellers you'll get a slap) as youll constantly be thinking "I wish i got..." I personally had my heart set on a Black Bandit 600, and ended up on a red bandit 600S, whic turned out to be a better choice cause of front fairing, and the red's growing on me :cool:

edit: Just seen that your dad rides bikes. That'll be a massive help, as none of my family or any of my friends family do. You can take your dad to view bikes as he'll stop you buying a ringer.

Also, theres no problem riding a bike fast, you've just gotta learn where and when to do so, so your liscence and yourself stays intact
 
Yeah, for me personally a bike is a fast-track to the kinda of thrills I just can't afford to provide myself on four wheels. Between the fear of not knowing what I was doing and getting used to the controls - even the feeling on the crappy 125 I rode for my CBT was wonderful.

For me really it's all going to be about that clean stretch of road and acceleration like nothing else. About the throttle not being binary - you're right and I suppose fear would be a good way to stop any problems there ;)

As you bring up the subject - I am curious about that. What does it take to get a dealer to let me have a go on a bike? I assumed this was just totally out of the question for someone of my age. I'd love to have a go on a few to see what I'd like - because obviously I have no idea what any of these bikes are like to ride :]

Another thing - how does the bike test compare to the car test? I've done the theory so it is literally just that after my training. Now lots of people fail their first driving test (me included \o/) but most people seem to pass the bike test first time? Is it easier or am I missing something?
 
The bike test is pretty much the same as the car test. The reason so many people pass bike first time is becuase of the much more convoluted procedure needed to get a liscence means people do it more thouroughly. In a car, you dont need CBT's, power restrictions etc. Also, bike riding is done to a hihger standard as youll get nailed if you screw up, whilst in a car you feel safe and secure.

With a dealer - to get a test ride, its all about how you present yourself, and selective facts. After all, technically youve been riding since you did your CBT, so thats x months experiance, not "i passed my test 2 weeks ago". Looking confident, assured, taking commandingly about the bikes and the quirks in the model - like you know what your on about. The dealer will make a snap deciiton at the time whether you can have a test ride or not, its all about that moment in time, not the facts. Also appear like you have cash to burn on a good bike. It worked for me...

The CBT was wonderful for me as well, but soon you will get sick of that 12bhp, and only being able to have fun with overtakes etc in a 40zone. Dont get a 125 - go strait for a bigger bike. If your not an idiot you'll be fine. (not to say idiocy isnt fun, just keep it to selective bouts of idiocy :p )
 
My 2p.

The motorbike system is a farce. You wouldnt even consider having a few hours in a car showing you clutch and gears then spend a couple of years 'gaining experience' yet this option is available to 16 years olds on 2 wheels.

I'd put in for proper training and your test asap. Learn some proper roadcraft, pass your test and then decide if you want to spend a couple of couple of years getting experience on low powered 125. Lack of training, awareness and skill is more likely to see you coming off than more power. Of course if do the training then decide to ride like an idiot anyway theres no hope ;)

As for gear, agreed buy what you can afford but dont always assume that more money = better safety. Heine Gericke clothing does consistently better in crash tests than the much more expensive Alpine Stars. Helmets have to pass a certain BS standard. I've used both Shoeis and Cabergs. I currently use a Caberg v2 - its a decent enough helmet and I have no reservation about its safety. The Shoei however is a much better helmet in terms of comfort and weight and thats where most of the extra cost is going. Noise wont be an issue if you use earplugs, which I'd recommend with any helmet.
 
Not read replies so apologise if I am repeating, but get your test done asap and get a restricted NC30. You cannot go wrong on this at all and you will be fine on it. It will save you the most time and money in the long run.
You need to get you test passed ASAP, the faster you do it the better, so get yourself on a course!

Gear wise, do not skimp, £15 bargain bin gloves may look ok, but I guarentee they will fall apart the second you hand hits the ground at over £40. No need to pay premium prices, (although I can really reccomend dainese, arai, alpinestars and spidi), I dont want to bankrupt you! Its just about what your body is worth to you really, I go out every day wearing well over £1000 worth of gear, ad I am by no means well off! There are always bargains to be had on good gear, especially this time of year!

Boots and gloves and a good jacket is most important, and although I have done it, do not pretend jeans will give you any protection at all.

Personally I only trust leather, but I beleive the textile stuff is pretty good these days. If you have any sports bike riding pretences get yourself some leathers.

Helmet - Depends on your head, I love arai and wouldent have anyting else, but as long as you are spending upwards of £100 it should not be too bad. Shark and AGV are good more budget lids. Just get one that fits well!

Bike - VFR400 NC30 is really the only word you need to know, one of the best handling bikes of all time, amazing little V4 engine, gorgeous, and one of the best learner bikes about for those who want to ride quick in my opinion. It will let you get away with loads of mistakes and wont bite you like a 600 upwards will, much more planted and predictable. Supremely reliable also! I had some amazing fun on mine!

SV650's/cbr400/zxr400 are ok too, but not in the same class as the above IMO.
 
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