First Time build advice

[noclue]

hi everyone,

So ..... decided I will try to build an entry level gaming pc. My i5 laptop just doesn't cut it anymore!!

I don't want much - I don't do the headset stuff or co-op multiplayer, etc, etc. But I do like to play things like Elite or Resident Evil and it seems these days even the most simple single player games need a super quantum computer just to boot!!

Being a very poor disabled guy on benefits I'll have to buy the components a few at a time over the next 6-8 months. And I'll want to be able to upgrade in the future. I've been looking at a gigabyte z390 SLi board as this supports both 8th and 9th gen CPUs, plus 2 GPUs. So was thinking grabbing a i5-8400 and a GTX 1060 now ....... then in a few years time swapping to a 9th gen i9-9900 (which have just come out and cost a fortune!!) and adding a 2nd GTX 1060 (sound good???)

ANYWAY .... here's the bits I was looking at. Any advice, comments and suggestions that spring to mind would be massively appreciated.

I already have a dvd drive from my old pc and a wifi card, plus several 1tb sata hdds if i need more storage later.

TIA
NoClue


https://www.overclockers.co.uk/giga...cket-1151-ddr4-atx-motherboard-mb-57b-gi.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/inte...e-socket-lga1151-processor-oem-cp-649-in.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/cors...hannel-kit-black-cmk16gx4m2d30-my-4bu-cs.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/giga...ddr5-pci-express-graphics-card-gx-18f-gi.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/phanteks-eclipse-p300-glass-midi-tower-case-black-ca-06u-pt.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/cool...-lite-240-aio-cpu-cooler-240mm-hs-07l-cm.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/sams...-3.0-x4-nvme-solid-state-drive-hd-23w-sa.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/thermal-grizzly-m.2-ssd-cooler-hs-000-tg.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/be-quiet-pure-power-11-600w-80-plus-gold-power-supply-ca-12y-bq.html

 

[Danny75]

Hi, welcome to the forum.

1060 SLI:

Just to be clear straight-away: This test was largely conducted under the context of “because we can.” For the full, in-depth GTX 1060 review, check this article. Also note that this test does not make use of the Scalable Link Interface, and so we're throwing scare quotes around “SLI” just for clarity. The GTX 1060s do not have SLI fingers and can only communicate via the PCIe bus, without a bridge, thereby demanding that applications support MDA (Multi-Display Adapter) or LDA Explicit (Linked Display Adapter) to actually leverage both cards. NVidia does not officially support dual GTX 1060s. This was just something we wanted to do. We also do not recommend purchasing two GTX 1060s for use in a single gaming system.

https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/2519-gtx-1060-sli-benchmark-in-ashes-multi-gpu

Intel processors usually remain at the same price, even going up as they become rarer, despite getting old and slow. Don't know what will happen to the 9900K, if Intel will change their tune, just bear that in mind.

AMD are releasing new Zen 2 (Ryzen 3XXX) processors with accompanying motherboards from the board partners. They're announcing it near the end of May when there should be news on actual release date. Mobo vendors are starting to leak pics etc, so it looks like they are pretty much raring to go. I believe they will have something that will beat out the non-overclockable i5-8400 (or i5-9400F) in core and thread amount, and IPC. Maybe even some Intel chips more expensive than that.

 

[noclue]

hi danny, thx for info about 1060. Gigabyte specifically listed it as one of the cards their z390 mobo can link together, which is why I thought about it.

From what i've read AMD and intel are pretty much on a par these days on CPUs. But what about future proofing? The z390 is 8th and 9th gen intel support ... are there any mobos that do similar for AMD CPUs as well as support multi GPUs?

What GPUs go well with the Ryzen CPUs?

for less than the price of the i5-8400 I could get this:-

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/amd-...hz-socket-am4-processor-retail-cp-3af-am.html

 

[Danny75]

From what i've read AMD and intel are pretty much on a par these days on CPUs. But what about future proofing? The z390 is 8th and 9th gen intel support ... are there any mobos that do similar for AMD CPUs as well as support multi GPUs?

AMD boards are a bit more futureproof in terms of new CPUs coming out. The new CPUs will be able to function with older AM4 boards (if they are of decent quality). What you miss out on is some new features the new boards will bring, like full support for PCIe 4.0 lanes, which are faster than what Intel and AMD have at present (3.0). Search for "AMD X570" and you'll be able to read up about that and other features.

As for SLI or CrossFire, just check that the board you're interested in supports it (not every Intel or AMD board does), and also that the card is actually capable of physical SLI/CrossFire.

What GPUs go well with the Ryzen CPUs?

Any really. Just avoid anything less than 6-core CPU, at this point in time, and it'll do well.

for less than the price of the i5-8400 I could get this:-

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/amd-...hz-socket-am4-processor-retail-cp-3af-am.html

Gibbo posted some special AMD bundle offers which you might want to have a look at:

https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/t...e-with-some-insane-deals-free-stuff.18853663/


If you aren't willing to wait for the new CPUs and boards, let us know your budget so suggestions can be offered. Which monitor (refresh rate and resolution, any Gsync or Freesync) will you be using?

Right off the bat, the Antec HCG 650W Gold is a better PSU than that BeQuiet, and available for the same price. And RX 580 8GB is a better GPU (has matured well) than the GTX 1060 6GB. An alternative to a 500GB NVME M.2 SSD would be a 1TB Sata SSD for the same money, or indeed a 500GB version if 500GB is all you need, so that the savings can go towards better GPU for example. NVME M.2 doesn't have much benefit for a gaming PC, and tends to be a better use of your money when it comes to other things like serving as a scratch disk for photo/video editing and things like that. That's something I personally would add to the system in the future, as a luxury, and first focus on CPU/GPU power.

Given the cost of the things you listed, you could quite easily fit a Vega 56 for £249 (Sapphire Pulse), which would be a lot better than RX 580, not to mention GTX 1060.

 

[noclue]

Ah, so the new ryzen 3rd gens will work in AM4 slots? Good to know.

in terms of budget - I can probably go £800-900 over the next 6-8 months. Monitor ... hadn't actually thought about that. I have a full HD 24" tv I was going to use

I looked at the 500GB NVME M.2 SSD because it appears the read/write speeds are a lot faster than the lower priced 1tb ssd, but if it makes little difference to gaming then a cheaper drive makes more sense. So something like this would be good enough:-
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/wd-b...-solid-state-drive-wds500g2b0a-hd-54h-wd.html

I have loads of 1, 2 and 3tb HDDs that I can use for storage if I need them. Just wanted a SSD for the operating system.



£40 difference on these ... but appear to be identical. What am I not seeing????

AMD Ryzen 7 Eight Core 2700X GOLD EDITION 4.35GHz (Socket AM4) Processor - Retail @ £329.99 inc VAT
AMD Ryzen 7 Eight Core 2700X 4.35GHz (Socket AM4) Processor - Retail @ £289.99 inc VAT



Some of those bundles look great, but how long will they last? This looks like a good middle of the road bundle, but will take me at least 3 months to save for it!
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/amd-...rx-580-8gb-gddr5-graphics-card-bu-01m-am.html



Thinking that board and CPU should be the LAST things I buy to give it time for new stuff to appear. I could wait for a newer board that can handle 3rd gen, but buy a cheaper 2nd gen until I can save for a bigger/better CPU later. So concentrate on getting the SSD, GPU, case, power and cooling stuff first? Does that make sense?

Does the 56 support crossfire?

 

[Danny75]

Ah, so the new ryzen 3rd gens will work in AM4 slots? Good to know.

in terms of budget - I can probably go £800-900 over the next 6-8 months. Monitor ... hadn't actually thought about that. I have a full HD 24" tv I was going to use

I looked at the 500GB NVME M.2 SSD because it appears the read/write speeds are a lot faster than the lower priced 1tb ssd, but if it makes little difference to gaming then a cheaper drive makes more sense. So something like this would be good enough:-
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/wd-b...-solid-state-drive-wds500g2b0a-hd-54h-wd.html

That'd be a good choice.

£40 difference on these ... but appear to be identical. What am I not seeing????

AMD Ryzen 7 Eight Core 2700X GOLD EDITION 4.35GHz (Socket AM4) Processor - Retail @ £329.99 inc VAT
AMD Ryzen 7 Eight Core 2700X 4.35GHz (Socket AM4) Processor - Retail @ £289.99 inc VAT

The Golds have a signature from Lisa Su of AMD and are binned/selected as the best 2700X chips for a bit better overclocking. That seems to be it. It's a 50th Anniversary commemorative thing more than anything else.

Thinking that board and CPU should be the LAST things I buy to give it time for new stuff to appear. I could wait for a newer board that can handle 3rd gen, but buy a cheaper 2nd gen until I can save for a bigger/better CPU later. So concentrate on getting the SSD, GPU, case, power and cooling stuff first? Does that make sense?

You'll get more value for money overall buying at the same time, or picking out deals within a short space of time. Prices tend to come down, with a few exceptions. New tech, etc. AMD Navi graphics cards might be available in 8 months time. You could ask OcUK about Finance options.

Does the 56 support crossfire?

Yes. The problem with SLI/CrossFire is that most games/apps don't support it well, or at all. It's dying out. AMD have stopped marketing it as "CrossFire". They now have mGPU for DirectX 12. Recommend you look more into the subject before making plans for it. You'd also need a very beefy 1000W PSU (quality not cheapo "1000") for Vega CrossFire.

It won’t be the first time someone’s questioning the true worth of both these technologies. And there is a good reason for it as well. Despite some really tall claims, neither Nvidia SLI nor AMD CrossFire has been able to live up to expectations. And now there is even a doubt over their future given a few indications we will discuss below.

Not The Potential You’d Expect
It made sense, buying one mid-range GPU that you can afford, wait a few months for its price to go down and then buy a second one. This should achieve one of two things: create unshakable value by making the overall deal cheaper, or offer a super high performing multi GPU setup. Sadly, there has hardly been a time when either SLI or CrossFire was able to actually double the performance or cut the price so low.


Not only that, the value of improvements offered by the multi GPU technologies isn’t the same now. There are hordes of new graphics cards, and the tech isn’t tailored the same for newer models. So in other words, you do get a performance boost but it is a long-shot from what multi GPU setups used to be marketed for.

Game Developers Aren’t Even On Board
Well, they are, but not the majority. You need to understand that in order for Nvidia SLI or AMD CrossFire to work, the video game developers first need to offer CrossFire and SLI support. And you know what happens when money gets involved, right? The developers need to first be sure that the extra cost of implementing the feature is justified.

And apparently, that isn’t the case. There is a large number of game developers who shy away from the expense because making a AAA game has never been as expensive as it is these days. Which means devs aren’t really pushing for it right now. And also consider that they will still need a potential chunk of their customers who would actually benefit from multi GPU computers. So there’s also a question on the potential number of multi GPU users.

What About Nvidia And AMD Themselves?
Sometimes, a good idea can die a natural death (there will be a better replacement every time) and it looks like a change of preferences has resulted in the same. For instance, AMD has said before that their level of interest and investment in CrossFire technology is highly dependent on the interest and investment that game developers are willing to put into it. Not only that, the company has even made it clear that down the line only new API types will multi GPU support.

So it is all but clear in their minds that SLI and CrossFire like technologies require more effort that they deserve. From the technology developers’ side as well as from the game developers’ side. Moreover, Nvidia has also shown indications that the time is up since they ditched SLI support for GTX 1060 – one of their more popular graphics cards. Also, dynamics have changed with the introduction of DirectX 12 as the API allows explicit multi GPU programming.

https://segmentnext.com/articles/multi-gpu-sli-crossfire-worth-it/

In summary, I'd either buy everything in 8 months, or look at Finance options to buy everything when the new AMD chips come out in 1-2 months.