Garden Railway

[sovietspybob]

If this isn't the right place please feel free to move - my justification for putting it here is that it has 4 wheels and a motor.

Don't know if this will be of any interest to anyone here but thought i'd share my latest project which is a garden railway. I've been wanting one since i was probably about 6 as i've always loved railways and my dad has always been either working on them or visiting them with me, I had an epiphany this Christmas just gone on a day out in Betws-y-coed after seeing the little railways there again of "i'm old enough to do what i want now!" so started looking at building one.

Settled on 7 1/4" gauge (or 184mm if you prefer) as it's the smallest gauge you can ride in or on rather than being dragged along behind and the smaller the gauge the tighter turns it will go round. I've not got a massive garden, it's around 1/2 an acre but it should be enough for a decent run, if i ever get to it i could have a run of around 250-300 metres but going to do 75m to start with and see where i go from there.

This whole thing is going to be done on a very tight budget, the first thing i noticed on looking in to this is how much money some 'old boys' seem to have to throw at this hobby so you have to be a bit creative to do it on a normal persons budget.

First off i decided on the engine i was going to build, it's called a Scamp and can be bought as a kit of laser cut steel parts, a shopping list of extra bits and some instructions. The reason in going for this is as mentioned above i really wanted something i sat on and not behind and this is by far the cheapest way to go about it apart from making it entirely on your own from scratch.

So i ordered a kit and a wagon to go with it, the lead time is about a month. Then put in a huge ebay order of all the other stuff you need which started turning up in drips and drabs for about the whole month while the kit was being laser cut. Stuff like bolts, bearings, electric motors, chains, switches etc etc.

I cleared some space in the garage and it looked like this before the kit turns up

This is maybe half of the laser cut bits

Once you get your head around the way it goes together it doesn't take long to make some progress

Think it took me just over a month - 6 weeks to go from box of bits to a painted working loco.

This engine can be run either from a 98cc petrol engine or from batteries, i bought it with the intention of using the petrol engine but cobbled together a battery pack from some UPS batteries to test it and much prefer the silent running on batteries so i'll make a box for them to look neat and probably use them instead. it's only a 30 second job to switch between as the engine just lifts out so the option is always there.

This is the first test run on cobbled together track before the seat arrived.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/8FVSJiHfNuPzC25y6

This is the extent of my track currently, just out of the garage and about 10m onto the drive.

My daughter seems interested in it so far

For my track i'm using 10x20mm steel bar for the rails into recycled plastic chairs on recycled plastic sleepers, it's much more cost effective than using proper rail, about 1/3 of the cost if not cheaper. I'll be making my own points as again the prices are rather eye watering, maybe £600 for a single set of points. I can buy a lot of steel bar and welding rods for that.

So that's where i'm up to, just need to keep bending the rail and making up the track now. Next bit will have to be laid through the driveway so will need digging in and i'll probably weld the whole thing out of 10x20 bar to make it more sturdy with cars driving over it.

 

[sovietspybob]

Thanks for the responses guys i really didn't think anyone would care

To add a bit more this is the plan i have in my head, red will be the first bits i'll do, then the blue at some point and lime green would be a nice to have but would require a lot more work so will probably never happen. I have about 180m of 20x10 steel bar which will make 90m of track which will do all the stuff in red, got a load of assorted other steel delivered at the same time for other projects.

The garden is quite steep going from the top where the drive is down to the right hand side as you look at the map, it drops maybe 2.5-3 metres so the gradient will be quite steep which i'm a bit worried about as it'll have a short bit of about 1 in 15 which is extremely steep for a railway but i can't think of any way to lessen it without doing some major civil works. I did some tests the other day by packing some wood under a bit of track and found the engine with 1 wagon full of old car batteries would go up a 1 in 10 slope, as i only have brakes on the engine itself when you get off it did start to slide down the rails. Seemingly a large part of its tractive effort relies on the drivers weight as it weighs about 70-80kg on its own so the drive almost doubles the weight.

Also made a few more fishplates which is how i'm joining the pieces of rail together, there's lots of schools of thought on the best way to do this but this is my solution. They're made out of 20x3mm flat bar with 6mm holes drilled and i'm using M5 bolts with nyloc nuts done up fairly loosely so there's some movement for expansion.

And this is how it looks when fitted

As for other future plans, i need to build some more wagons. I'm not 100% on what i want yet so i'll probably just make it up as i go along, the most expensive bit is the wheels as there just isn't anywhere that is cheap but they are pretty chunky solid bits of steel so they probably can't be made any cheaper, you're looking at around £90-100 ish for a set of 4 wheels then another £30-40 for some bright bar for the axles and bearing & holders, the rest i can knock up out of stuff i have in the garage bar maybe a few sheets of ply or some wooden planks.

Then i'd love to build another loco from scratch myself this time, i really want something with a vintage engine in it like a Lister D as they just sound right to me. My dad has a Ruston & Hornsby PB stationary engine in his garage which he may donate if we can figure out how to mount it as they're longitudinal so might be a bit of a challenge on small track, plus figuring out how to get drive to the wheels in both directions is an interesting problem.

Then maybe a steam engine if i ever win any money as they're bonkers money, you could get a very nice 2nd hand car for the price of a fairly entry level steam engine in this size!

And yeah if any of you are ever on sunny Anglesey when all this nonsense is over you can have a ride

 

[sovietspybob]

When it comes to locomotives braking is all about the weight of the loco. When the early diesels and electrics started replacing steam loco's on unfitted freight trains (only the engine did the braking on most) there were quite a few instances of runaway trains as the diesels were so much lighter than the steam loco's they replaced they lacked the brake force. To counter this they came up with the idea of diesel brake tenders. These were mostly made from old steam locomotive tenders or old carriage chassis and filled with ballast. For further information see here and here.

Simplex used a lot of Lister Diesels in their little loco's.

That's interesting i'd actually never come across them!

I'm undecided what to do about brakes, i know i probably should fit a vacuum pump to the engine and have a couple of vacuum braked wagons but that gets expensive fast but would future proof me if i ever did get a steam engine.

Other option is to just have manual brakes fitted which can be pegged down when i'm going down the steep section which would be a lot more cost effective but means stopping at the top each time. Which in a way i wouldn't mind as having the line be a bit more of a challenge to operate would keep things interesting.

 

[sovietspybob]

Hows it progressing?

Not done much really, got some more rails drilled and bent to do another couple of 6m track panels so just need some time to fire up the welder and stick them together. Then i'll lay it all out on the grass to see how it all lies before getting the shovel out and digging into the lawn.

This is currently a full run of the line

 

[sovietspybob]

I'd love a steam engine but for the most part they're more money than i've ever spent on a car do don't think its a realistic goal any time soon

I really like the look of these but they're £15,000! https://www.stationroadsteam.com/feldbahn-0-6-0---7-14-inch-gauge-0-6-0st-stock-code-fb060/

 

[sovietspybob]

Yeah i've been looking, you can get 2nd had stuff from about £7 grand for a smaller loco but a lot wont have a boiler certificate and without being a member of a model engineering club it looks a bit of a hassle to get one, i need to look into that after lockdown.

Then there's the issues of a lot i've seen are at least 15+ years old and who really knows the condition of the running gear or boiler. I don't have the tools or skills to re-tube a boiler in the garage or refresh the cylinders etc also a lot of the older ones seem to only have 1 injector which seems less than ideal. I believe a lot of clubs will require you to have 2 for insurance purposes, plus i wouldn't fancy running with only 1 myself.

 

[sovietspybob]

Yeah i think doing stuff yourself would be the only way really, luckily my dad has all the skills on full size stuff, he was a boilersmith at the Llangollen railway until he retired a few years ago so i'm sure he would be able to figure it out but it would mean getting all the tools. Saying that you could probably do a lot at this size with those mini lathes which are pretty affordable and don't take up the whole shed.

As for the rails they're just held in my friction in to the chairs, if you've got your levels right they seem to be OK. Once you screw them down they're meant to pinch the rail by design, you can remove them by hand but it takes a fair bit of force.

 

[sovietspybob]

I think an electric one would be best for general use. I always wanted to build a mamod garden setup. I have a mamod steam engine that runs on meths. I used proper steam oil on it and the flywheel flew off when it was running flat out!

Ah i've got a mamod too mines quite old though, i got it from as a present from the general manager at the Snowdon railway when i was little but it still seems to run nicely for what it is, that's what started my on this journey! I was going to build a small track for that but then things got out of hand...

 

[sovietspybob]

Right time for an update

Decided to neaten up the battery install on my loco, the wife suggested putting the batteries in the seat which was a really good idea. It's still got the petrol engine there mostly acting as ballast currently but it can be used to drive the wheels when needed.

Fitted a re-settable breaker to the outside to act as a fuse and also an isolation switch, there is also a charging plug i added just after this. All held in place professionally by stick back foam to stop any rubbing and blocks of wood.

Then was in the local shop chatting to the owners who happen to be my next door neighbours, the chap said he's got a digger on hire but has finished his job early but he's got it for another day and did i want him to send his mate round to dig a trench for the railway, so obviously i said yes.

So a man in a digger turned up this morning and did this for me, was a bit of a faff for him as I've got a robot lawn mower with a boundary wire around the entire lawn so had to keep clear of that (which we didn't as you can see in the pic below... but that was the only place we broke the wire)

That's saved me a huge amount of manual labour which is a bit of a god send as i think i had Covid earlier in the year and am still really suffering from it's long term effects, i get breathless doing pretty much anything nowadays and get spells where i'm completely wiped out and can't do anything which is pretty pants and frustrating for a normally fit and active 34 year old so no idea how long it would have taken me to do this otherwise. It'll take me long enough to lay the track in it with how i feel currently but hey ho.

 

[sovietspybob]

Decided i needed to rig something up so my robot mower could keep working as the grass was starting to look untidy, so laid a temporary boundary wire until i can lay the track down the trench that's been dug so the mower won't keep falling in.

Then made up the section of track to go across the driveway, made it up out of 10x20mm steel bar cut up, made 1 side first in the garage and carried it out, it bent in its own length to shape there without much force and then welded the other rail in situ.

Time will tell how it holds up to us driving over it.

Then laid 1 more section beyond

Then did a small test of filling it back in with the turf so the mower can go over it, seems to work ok

And that's where i'm up to now, need to spread a bit of gravel under the sleepers to level it all out and then start filling it back in with turf and rinse and repeat down the garden now.

Ordered 2 sets of pressed steel wheels which should hopefully turn up later in the week so i can make up 2 more wagons, think i'll make 1 more flat wagon and then a plank wagon for carrying other stuff around in.

 

[sovietspybob]

Thanks for the kind worlds all.

I should have some more wheels arriving today, still undecided what to make with them. Kind of fancy making a bogie wagon something like these https://www.stationroadsteam.com/pair-7-14-inch-gauge-bogie-wagons-stock-code-7897/ as you could put a plank of wood across at each end and have something to carry passengers but it'd also be a really useful wagon for general moving stuff around.

Other option is to make up 2 normal wagons, maybe 1 flat and 1 smaller plank sided wagon. I'll see how much engineering i feel like doing when i get out to the garage again i guess.

 

[sovietspybob]

I'll give a bit of an update, not done a huge amount due to my health (long Covid sucks) but started to feel a bit better lately so fingers crossed that'll continue.

Managed to get 2 sets of wheels off eBay for a decent price, they're quite big at 7" so they should be good for what i need, going to build a nice big wagon first so started cutting the steel for it. For reference the wheels on my existing loco are a bit less than 5".

I need to figure out if i want to add some form of suspension before i start welding things up so i can make sure the couplings are at the right height, it's currently just using plummer block bearings bolted directly to the frame on a 450mm wheelbase, It's overall 1200mm long and 600mm wide.

I've also welded up and painted my hopper wagon, really pleased with how it looks in the end.

The next thing i've done is buy one of these:

It's a 1950 1.5hp Lister D stationary engine, i've fancied one of these for ages and been on the look out for 12 months or more and this one came up really locally last Christmas so i spun over in the works van and collected it, they're chuffing heavy so had to use my block and tackle to lowered it down, I think including the trolley it'll be north of 200kg! This one's a fairly rare radiator cooled model which should be ideal for what i'm planning next which is...

Another loco powered by the above using the other set of wheels i got

I'll use the Lister to drive a hydrostatic transmission unit form Eaton via a belt and then gear it down via a layshaft to both sets of wheels with chains. The benefit of going hydrostatic is you have 1 leaver which is speed and braking all combined, so just push it in the direction you want to go and if you want to go faster just push it further, same for braking just push it the other way.

Otherwise not done much on the railway itself, just added a couple more 6m sections and filled in this bit so the mower can drive over it and it should grass over nicely.

 

[sovietspybob]

Look great, electric looks the way to go imo.

I actually have a steam engine that my granddad built many years ago, used to run it in the local park and give passenger rides etc (the track still gets used by the model club and they do open days some times for passenger rides)

It hasn't been out of it's box in god knows how many years though, the maintenance to get it up and running (if even possible) just isn't something I've got the budget or apatite for.

What size is that engine? I'm guessing as you say box it must be fairly small maybe 3.5" gauge?

Anything steam does come with a huge commitment really which is why even though i'd love it i don't think i'd ever go down that route. You really need to be either a full on engineer yourself or be an active member of a local model engineering society to have a chance with one.

I think for my gauge of 7 1/4" it's a boiler test every 2 years if its made of steel and 4 years if made of copper, then you've got to have some form of public insurance for it and then if anything goes wrong it's not like you can take it to Halfords as almost everything is custom made.

There is an active buying and selling scene though if you'd like to see it used again, as with most hobby's things are getting snapped up left right and centre for healthy prices at the moment. https://www.steamworkshop.co.uk/ seems to be one of the go to places along with stationroadsteam

 

[sovietspybob]

A musical friend of mine asked me if i could play Thomas the tank theme song while under way on my train as soon as he found out i built one, so here it is

 

[sovietspybob]

Thought i'd do a little update, not a huge amount has been achieved with life being so busy and still really suffering with long covid so not done any more track laying to speak of just stuff in the garage.

Finished the wagon i posted about, added suspension which works really well, think they're about 100mm die springs, my back of an envelope calculations about spring rate seemed to be about right which i'm quite surprised about but it works well, you need a bit of 'sag' in the springs so the axels can move to take up any vertical movement in the track. Seem to be getting my eye in with my Arc welder now as i've done all of the hopper wagon, the new red one and now 2 sets of points.

I'll let the pictures do most of the talking, suspension:

The bits of my welding i'm willing to show off..

finished (bar painting) wagon, the top section is removable and just lifts off to leave you with a flat wagon.

Bought this around Christmas time, I've been fancying one for ages and this came up on Facebook marketplace, it looked in a right old state and didn't turn on which is how i got it cheap but after a bit of messing around it works really well.

For clarity it's a Clarke ML500 combined Lathe and milling machine, they're very much on the lower end of lathes and the milling it can do is quite limited but it should enable me to do what i want to do.

And this is one of the jobs i wanted it for, making points

I've used the milling head to create the 'blades' of the points as you can see here, they need to be tapered to guide the wheels. As the flanges are only 6mm on the wheels i'm using i've only gone down 10mm as it makes it easier to mill and quicker to do.

This is the finished product, they're a very tight radius as in a very sharp curve but taken slowly they work fine for the garage.

As i'd got my eye in i did another set straight after for out in the garden with a bigger radius, the first set took me a couple of months of doing them on and off, the 2nd took me about a week and a half of doing an hour every other night.

Next job is to start on my new loco powered by my Lister stationary engine, here i'm turning the axles down. They need to be 25mm at the ends of the bearings then 1" for the wheels then 28mm in the middle for the sprockets so that was a really enjoyable task learning how to do that on the lathe.

then i bored out some 8mm steel to 25mm, they'll be welded onto the axles and drilled and tapped to hold brake disks.

I got some 50x100 steel channel again off Facebook marketplace for a good price so cut that up to mock up the frame, it'll be 1300x600 with a 500mm wheelbase.

Need to machine the 2nd axel next and then drill the frames for the horns which hold the take up bearings before i can weld it all up.

Scored a 2nd Eaton 7 hydrostatic unit the other day too so if i have enough steel channel left i may make another loco after this one to sell on as that should hopefully fund both with some change left over.

The grass has taken nicely where i'd laid it and turfed over it too

 

[sovietspybob]

Great stuff! Though your project does make my hobbies look like not being hobbies at all

It's a blessing and a curse, sometimes i wish i could get interested in more normal normal hobbies rather than ones that need big garages full of equipment, life would be easier if i could be happy sitting in the house painting figurines or whatever. Everything i seem to want to do that holds any interest for me is expensive and time consuming, my other main hobby is music and guitars aren't cheap either but at least i've stopping buying old cars and doing track days so that's something...

Missed this thread before but just read through and caught up, this is amazing so far and hope to see it finished when you're feeling better.

Have any of the neighbours said anything?

No one has really said much to be fair, i try to keep it fairly low key as my current loco is battery powered so pretty quiet, might be a bitter different when i'm zooming up and down on my Lister powered one thumping away though.. I do get a few people leaning over the wall to have a chat about it but It's mostly people delivering stuff to the house that talk about it as you have to drive over the track to get onto our driveway.