Has anyone connected their HTPC to their LCD via HDMI?

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Hi guys.

I have a samsung N73 and it states in the manual that you shouldnt connect a pc to the ldc via hdmi...However...has anyone done this?

The tv only has a vga input and I was wondering if I could get a better picture going through hdmi.

Cheers.
 
I think this is due to an "overscan" problem - certainly is true in regards to my samsung tv , (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overscan for a definition) but basically the desktop area is smaller through a hdmi connection due to every edge overlapping the physical screen edge, so on my screen there is no start bar apart from the very top pixel and the first row of icons on desktop were missing off the edge

I believe if you call Samsung you can get an update cdrom and a comms cable (but this requires a pc with that connection which is pretty rare, not sure Samsung provide usb >>comms type cable)

VGA works fine but yes it is an annoyance to say the least
 
Just buy a cheap DVI -> HDMI cable and test it. Im sure a lot is also down to video card drivers too, and not just the TV firmware.
 
Yeh mine works with DVI -> HDMI but it is a little flakey.Picture is fine but it constantly loses the picture,not worked out why yet :confused:
 
Lanz said:
Just buy a cheap DVI -> HDMI cable and test it. Im sure a lot is also down to video card drivers too, and not just the TV firmware.

I believe its wholly to do with the hdmi firmware in the tv , after testing with nv and ATI cards and several variety of drivers for each.
 
YUP

I've got a AGP 6800LE connected to LG 37" LC2DB via a DVI - HDMI cable (generic) at 1360 X 768 with 1:1 pixel mapping. Extremely sharp picture for reading

sid
 
james.miller said:
its a 1366x768 panel isnt it? not much of a difference but it isnt 1:1 if thats the case lol

The other 6 pixel lines aren't mapped because 1366 X 768 isn't 16:9 resolution.

1360 X 768 is and so is 1368X768.

obviously only the former can work, so yes you do loose the pixel lines. but its 1:1 mapped because its not putting a 1360 lines over all of ther 1366 lines avaliable which would obviously blur the screen.
 
james.miller said:
its a 1366x768 panel isnt it? not much of a difference but it isnt 1:1 if thats the case lol

My 1366x768 LCD allowed you to use non stretch mode, so you only lose 6 pixels width, and it doesn't stretch, so it is 1:1.
 
squiffy said:
My 1366x768 LCD allowed you to use non stretch mode, so you only lose 6 pixels width, and it doesn't stretch, so it is 1:1.

yeah its just the extra 6 pixels will just be black

so you get a very very thin border on the edges
 
squiffy said:
My 1366x768 LCD allowed you to use non stretch mode, so you only lose 6 pixels width, and it doesn't stretch, so it is 1:1.

yes i know no stretching = 1:1 lol. i didnt know whether his display had that ability
 
Last edited:
CS||nuTs said:
Yeh mine works with DVI -> HDMI but it is a little flakey.Picture is fine but it constantly loses the picture,not worked out why yet :confused:

Ps3 had the same problem as well because it has hdmi 1.3 I think, apparantly it's because of the display not the output device.
 
MrLOL said:
yeah its just the extra 6 pixels will just be black

so you get a very very thin border on the edges

The border blends into the black of the bezel so its not really noticable once you are sitting far away any ways

sid
 
sid said:
The other 6 pixel lines aren't mapped because 1366 X 768 isn't 16:9 resolution.

1360 X 768 is and so is 1368X768.

obviously only the former can work, so yes you do loose the pixel lines. but its 1:1 mapped because its not putting a 1360 lines over all of ther 1366 lines avaliable which would obviously blur the screen.

Actually 1366x768 is the closes to 16:9, BUT most computer graphics cards will only allow resolutions with a horizontal that's divisable by 8. In the old days of text mode, character sets were 8 pixels wide, and it seems both Nvidia and ATI still follow that, even in graphics modes. Or it could just be that anything which is a multiple of 8 is very easy to store and access in 8/16/32/64bit memory without waste.

I believe its 'best' to use 1368x768, and then carefully tune the timings to make the tv display 1366x768 1:1 mapped, with 1 column of pixels on each side of the screen simply ignored. Alternativly use 1360x768 and get a very slightly black bar on each side of the screen, just 3 pixels wide so not noticeable anyway.
 
Pinched off of AVForums

Overscan:
The TV has some optical overscan, so you wont get 1280x720 1:1 without overscan. However, if we can get 1280x720 with overscan, then we can use Powerstrip to create a resolution slightly smaller than 1280x720 that wont overscan. Im pretty sure the TV overscans optically, because i have achieved 1:1 mapping vertically(ie the 720 lines map correctly) with overscan. So unless we can adjust the lens some of the 1280x720 pixels remain hidden. Overscan applies to all inputs, as on most TVs.

1:1 pixel mapping(VGA)
VGA at 800x600 in mode "Pixel x Pixel" gives a 1:1 pixel mapping, naturally causing massive underscan. The input will also accept 1024x768 and 1280x768 but unfortunately here the pixel x pixel mode doesnt do what its name suggest. It shows the display without overscan and without stretching, causing vertical scaling instead of overscanning the extra 768 -720 = 48 lines. I have seen one owner of the american version mentioning that he can get 1280x768 to pixelmap correctly, using the "Zoom" mode which i would assume corresponds to the "Pixel to Pixel" mode, sadly it seems the EU and US versions have different VGA input controllers as the Zoom mode is not even available when using the VGA input. *If* we could get 1280x768 with massive overscan and 1:1 it would be great as we again could use powerstrip to circumvent the overscan. Im planning to write Sony and ask why the Pixel x Pixel mode doesnt act the way the name suggests.

1:1 pixel mapping(DVI-HDMI)
First off, the TV enables Sharpness and Noise reduction on the HDMI input for some unfathomable reason. With sharpness set at any level above min you will se edge artifacts in the shape of light shadows on all lines, giving a horrible desktop image. If sharpness is turned to min. then it goes away on horizontal lines but remain on vertical lines. Im not entirely sure whether or not the remaining vertical shadows are due to scaling or sharpness, but for now im betting that its mostly from scaling.

The TV gives 2 timings for 1280x768, 50 and 60Hz. Both give a decent display that seems to be scaled on the x axis(assuming its not the sharpness as mentioned above) and pixel mapped correctly on the y axis.

If the vertical shadow problem is due to sharpness we are ****ed, otherwise we might with the right graphics card be able to achieve a 1:1 pixel mapping over DVI-HDMI. I have tried playing with powerstrip but so far havent really gotten anywhere.

You can see how all this looks on the desktop here:

You can see it here iN DVI-HDMI(click for larger image):


And then compare to VGA 800x600(1:1) ( not too good this one, but shows that the image is much sharper, the geometry problem is due to the camera)


HOWEVER, when playing a DVD, watching TV or looking at a GUI designed for TV(like MCE,Mediaportal etc) then you cant really see this effect(i mean many people use sharpness on their TV which introduces the same artifacts).
My use is solely for HTPC, but not for gaming or browsing im leaning towards accepting this even if it cannot become better(but i havent given up!)

Furthermore, enabling cleartype and larger fonts make the desktop quite usable, but its still not pretty

I have a photo here showing that the y axis is 1:1 but that there are weird light shadows on the vertical lines:


Using NVIDIA DVI-HDMI:
I tried connecting my Geforce 4600 and it worked just as well as my ATI x550 and 9700Pro(yes i have a lot of computers). In fact it seemed that i could fiddle more with the settings without losing the image on the TV.

Desktop photo

Full desktop in DVI-HDMI(y axis 1:1, x axis nearly so)99 with overscan.
You can judge the amount of overscan from this, in test images i think it was the standard 5% on edge edge. THe background image is a 1:1 test pattern.


A closeup of some icons:


Service Mode:
I have looked in the service mode options, but without a manual its impossible to guess at all those parameters. I have the US service manual which says vey little on the servce menu(its probably differnent anyway), and some chinese guy offered to sell me the UK version for 7$, but im not entirely inclined to trust him as i think one can get the serivce manual pretty cheap from Sony if one is persistent enough(please someone go ahead and try!).


Photos needed?
If there is something specific you want me to photo, just tell me.

THE GREAT PLAN:
I hope for one of the following:
1. Im going to try to buy one of the newer ATI's (X1300/X1600/X1800) and see if they can help with this.(Of course ordered online so i get 14 days to return it in
2. Im going to keep pestering RIik Wang on the Powerstrip forums ( http://www.entechtaiwan.net/forums/index.php ) until he magically comes up with a 1:1 timing.
3. Im going to play with the powerstrip settings myself, "backporch" and "syncwidth" seem to have some small effect.(especially on the nvidia card).
4. Someone else is going to solve the problem.
5. Sony or a hack will make VGA pixel x pixel mode work correctly so we can use 1280x768 in 1:1.
6. Someone will find a 1280x720 timing that the VGA input will actually accept(unlikely)
 
Dunno whether it's any use but here are the powerstrip settings I use to get 1360x768 running correctly over vga on my 32" lcd tv.

pstriprp8.jpg
 
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