HDMI Splitting & Distance

ashthekid

ashthekid

ashthekid

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20 Mar 2020
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I am in the process of designing and building a property and would like to setup a HDMI splitter directly from the Sky box so I can output in 4k to various outputs within the property like bedrooms etc. Approx 8-10 in total.
Are there any tips for doing this successfully? I understand that distance may become an issue with 2-3 of the outputs, can I ask if an already split HDMI signal be split a 2nd time? So in effect run one HDMI cable approx 30m and then split it again into 2-3 outputs? Would that be a good idea or terrible idea?
What HDMI cables are recommended for quality and price? Assuming it's best to have the cables not run to a HDMI socket on the wall but simply hanging directly out of the wall to avoid the signal being effected by having additional sockets etc.

Any help most gratefully appreciated.
 
you might be better with CAT5 - HDMI converter/cabling but as the previous poster stated it means all of the displays will show the exact same thing as the main display. Unfortunately the systems like hotels use are pretty expensive.
 
PiKe said:
Doesn't SkyQ required HDCP handshake else you get a blue screen?
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It does.

Sky Q Multiscreen is a one off payment for up to 4 mini boxes and then a single £14 monthly payment rather than £14 per Mini box. You can only have two mini boxes and the main box on at any one time though.
 
Aside from the distance concerns - which is why you use Cat cable and hang either HDMI Baluns or HDBaseT Baluns off the ends instead of long HDMI cables - the other two technical issues are HDCP and EDID.

HDCP you already know about. It's there to protect the film or program from being copied or displayed outside of a secure digital chain.

EDID is a digital handshake to establish hardware compatibility. This is where most ad-hoc/DIY systems fall down.

Mixing TVs and distribution gear and source devices is bound to involve different specs. For example, all your TVs could be 4K, but maybe only a couple of prime sets are ATMOS compatible, so now, without something to manage all the EDID signatures, your Sky box is seeing both ATMOS and non-ATMOS hardware in the system but can't serve both and so resorts to the lowest common denominator. You can also get ripples in the distribution system when TVs turn on or when the source selection changes to the HDMI for Sky. EDID can be a bit of a pain.

There are manufacturers who specialise in high bandwidth HDMI signal switching and distribution who have these EDID niggles nailed. The rub is the cost. It can run in to the thousands for something with almost guaranteed glitch-free performance.

Whilst you're picking yourself up off the floor, I would ask why you need to distribute 4K at all?

I'll preface the following by saying that I am a Sky customer too, and I think they've got the best PVR ecosystem around. However, IMO, their 4K offering is letting the side down.

There's very little real UHD 4K material broadcast live by Sky. Most of it is catch-up/download. What you're watching live is, for the most part, the same HD 1080i and SD 576i content that you've been watching from a standard Sky+HD box. The fact that a Q box can be set to output at 3840x2160p (UHD resolution) simply means that the box is upscaling 576i and 1080i to a UHD resolution. Your 4K TVs do that anyway, so why spend a huge chunk extra s=to pipe upscaled 1080i round the house?

That's not the biggest disappointment though; it's the lack of HDR and WCG.

If push came to shove, I'll bet you can't reliably tell the difference between upscaled 1080p and true 2160p based on resolution alone for the typical screen size-vs-viewing distance we use in our homes. The film company Paramount did blind testing to the same effect. Even those with better-than 20/20 vision couldn't manage it. It turns out that resolution alone isn't that important above 1080p. Unless you have a home projector with a true UHD imaging chip-set, or you sit incredibly close to a larger-than-average TV, then there's very little benefit.

What does make a huge difference is the bigger contrast range of High Dynamic Range, and less-so but also noticeable the bigger colour range of Wide Colour Gamut.

Compare UHD alone versus UHD with HDR and WCG; the difference is immediately visible regardless of screen size and viewing distance. Sadly though, Sky's UHD content doesn't yet support HDR or WCG; not even when watching Netflix which does have the full-fat-content versions via its direct service. The bottleneck for Sky is their 2TB Q box. It doesn't do HDR and WCG.

You might be better served keeping the Q box signal for the main TV and distributing the signal from a couple of mini boxes instead. At least that way it would be possible to watch some different Sky channels and box sets/films.
 
That is definitely some interesting points there, never thought about most of them.
My initial concern was to simply save money not having to have any of the Sky Q mini boxes subscriptions as I thought it was £14 per box but also if I had a DVD/Media player is one location next to the Sky Box and wanted to watch the same film on a few TV’s then I could do that.
If having the Sky mini boxes wasn’t an option what’s would you suggest? Am I definitely going to get issues with HDCP and EDID etc? I’m trying to future proof myself as much as possible while I have the chance to run as many cables now cheaply rather than not have that option in the long term. What do you recommend?
 
I can understand and appreciate the drives to keep costs down, and to try to future-proof. As an A.V. systems designer and installer myself then it's something I come across frequently with clients. Here's my thoughts based on seeing through projects from design to completion and servicing them once the clients have lived with them a few years. Please bear in mind that you haven't told us your family circumstances, so, some of these points might not relate directly to you if you haven't got kids in the house.

Future-proofing today for anything further than 3-5 years is a bit of an impossibility. Tech moves too fast. What you can do though is make it easier to adapt to new technologies as and when they arrive. What I advise my clients planning a new build or major refurbishment is don't try to flood the place with cables today just in case. Chances are you won't use them before they become redundant. Instead, put in pipework with a big enough diameter that will make it easy to run new cables in the future. Where you need to turn a corner, either put in two 45 degree bends rather than a 90 degree - it will make pulling cable easier. That, or fit an access cover at the 90 degree point. Put in draw strings too. Sometimes you'll be pulling out an old cable to replace with something of a later spec, in which case the old cable can be used as a pull cord. Other times though you'll be adding a new one, so cover both options.

Kids above junior school age don't watch much linear TV, so the idea that they'll want to watch the same channel as on the main TV, or watch the same movie but in their own room rarely reflects reality. The go-to services that kids gravitate towards are online streaming. YouTube vids - yes, Netflix/Amazon Prime/Disney+ - maybe. Linear TV doesn't figure highly unless it's a program that is trending and that can't be seen via catch-up. Hardware of choice is the phone, the tablet and the games console. Portable devices usually rely on good wireless, so cable up for WAPs in strategic points in the house. Other stuff such as consoles and smart TVs can go hardwired. The more stuff you can get off the wireless network then the better the wireless service will be for those devices where it is the only option. Put network cable points behind where TVs will live and behind where consoles will live. Don't waste your money putting a network point in the corner of the room. No-one wants to run Ethernet cable around the edge of a room and snake it up the wall to the telly. Waste of cash, even if your spark suggests it, just say no.

Ditto above for the idea that your kids will watch the same film as you in tandem but in their own room. If everyone is going to watch the same film, then watch it as a family. Make the lounge/TV viewing area the place to be for family viewing. Good TV, great sound, lots of comfy seating, good lighting. There are other solutions to making your film collection accessible around the house. Rip discs to a media server NAS drive. Use media players loaded with Kodi or Plex in the other rooms. Simple. Effective. Low cost display-end tech. Doesn't tie up the main system either.


Am I definitely going to get issues with HDCP and EDID etc?
Click to expand...
HDCP less-so unless you put something in the chain either deliberately or accidentally that stops the HDCP handshake. EDID issues are more likely, particularly when using so many (and possibly/likely different-spec) TVs. You can get EDID issues with the simplest 1:1 connections. Remember too, the system might work fine on installation, but what happens 5-10 years down the line when you've maybe changed three or four TVs. Will it work with the new hardware?


Ask yourself who really wants to watch the main Sky box in other rooms. Also, think about how you'll watch TV in the main lounge and kitchen-dining area. The chances are that Sky will be the go-to service; even if you have Freeview, most households with Sky use that almost exclusively, especially the non-tech inhabitants: Would you/they really be happy if some in a different part of the house hijacked use of the one Sky box?
 
I imagine it will depend on the quality of the cable, you'll know that it's too long if you start gettiing loss of signal or maybe pixelation?
 
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