Help with CPU options

Footyslayer · 22 Jan 2013 at 21:34

Hello everyone,

this is a thread for me to figure out if I should learn to overclock my CPU or look at a new one. I upgraded my Ram and Graphics card recently and the CPU is next on my list

Current setup:

OS - Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit
Motherboard - GIGABYTE GA-MA790X-DS4 (with latest BIOS)
Processor Name - AMD Phenom II X4 920 (2800.0 MHz)
Graphics Card - gigabyte ati radeon hd 7850 oc windforce 2x 2048mb gddr5
memory - 8gb ddr2
psu - ezcool atx650jsp (650 watts)

now i looked at overclocking the current processor and found that i cannot change the multiplier from the x14 it is already on, well i can go lower but that defeats what i want. also in the bios of my motherboard i struggled to figure out where i actually change anything.

now i have an option, i could buy a better cpu and i am guessing this is the better option in the long run but i am not sure of what cpu i should go for. my motherboard supports amd phenom / athlon series processors and has support for socket am3 / am2+ / am2 processors.

i was looking at the phenom 2 x4 black editions, maybe this but is there better, is this suitable etc?

So, should I overclock, buy a new one?

Thanks all

Bluntwrapped · 22 Jan 2013 at 22:36

I'd see if you can pick up a used AMD Phenom II X6 1100T Black Edition or similar and overclock it. You're probably going to need it for your graphics card.

troops · 23 Jan 2013 at 00:06

Apart from a mobo/cpu upgrade looks like your stuck with either a x6 or maybe a 960t

Footyslayer · 23 Jan 2013 at 00:39

Phenom II X6 1100T 'Black Edition' (3.3GHz, 125W, 3MB total dedicated L2 cache, 6MB L3 cache, 4000MHz HyperTransport™ bus, socket AM3)

or

Phenom II X4 970 'Black Edition' (3.5GHz, 125W, 2MB total dedicated L2 cache, 6MB L3 cache, 4000MHz HyperTransport™ bus, socket AM3)

I see the Phenom II x4 has a higher GHz but the Phenom II X6 1100T has more cores. I am happy to get whichever is better, I apologise for being a n00b here but the fact the Phenom II X6 1100T has 6 cores but less GHz still makes it a better option?

Footyslayer · 23 Jan 2013 at 00:50

I am actually really struggling to find a Phenom II X6 1100T Black Edition 3.3GHz anywhere online too

Although the AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition 3.2GHz is available strangely!

Superjeep4x4 · 23 Jan 2013 at 05:37

The 1090t is not a bad choice. The 1100 was just a refresh clocked slightly higher. Have you checked for a second hand 1100 or 1090?

passey89 · 23 Jan 2013 at 06:14

Footyslayer said:
I am actually really struggling to find a Phenom II X6 1100T Black Edition 3.3GHz anywhere online too

Although the AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition 3.2GHz is available strangely!

there all discontinued now so it will start to be hard to find new ones.

humbug · 23 Jan 2013 at 09:43

Are you able to set the memory lower with that motherboard?

If you set the Memory to a lower denominator you can use the HT Bus (The 200Mhz thing) to overclock the CPU.

The reason you would set a lower memory speed is that as you clock up the HT Bus the memory clocks up with it, if it gets to high it will become unstable.

let me know.

Edit, can you also adjust the vCore? (CPU volts)

Edit2- if you are looking for a way to upgrade i would do the whole (MOBO, CPU, RAM) as that Motherboard is DDR2 and you could really do with faster DDR3 memory.

Thats not going to be cheap tho, something like an unlocked 6 core FX CPU + Motherboard + 8GB DDR3 is going to be £200 but is much better than what you currently have.

Failing that. there is this. http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CP-244-AM&groupid=701&catid=1967&subcat=1943

Which will give you that unlocked multiplier, but your still stuck with DDR2, its not going to be much improvement.

MikeTheNative · 23 Jan 2013 at 13:28

Anybody else worried about that PSU? I have never heard of it and looking around I can't find much more information except for the amazon reviews which were all 1 star.

Footyslayer · 23 Jan 2013 at 20:26

Hey all,

firstly that PSU I believe to be fine, I have been running it for a few years now. Here is a better google search CLICK ME

Humbug - I am happy to overclock the current proccessor if you can get me through it, worst case scenario I'll buy the best I can for this motherboard as I don't really want to do too much more, I just want more out of this PC and for it to last about another 2 years. It does play all current games on recommended settings.

Here is a picture of the area of the BIOS you want info on too

humbug · 23 Jan 2013 at 22:58

Alight

i can see what you need to do there, i will write out some instructions for you tomorrow.

Footyslayer · 23 Jan 2013 at 23:44

humbug said:
Alight i can see what you need to do there, i will write out some instructions for you tomorrow.

Thank you ever so much

humbug · 24 Jan 2013 at 14:37

Ok, first you need to install this http://www.cpuid.com/softwares/cpu-z.html

This http://www.cpuid.com/softwares/hwmonitor.html

And you will need some stress testing software, normally i would recommend Prime95 but your Motherboard and PSU are not exactly high end (with respect)
those apps will put a massive amount of stress on those components and i don't want to be the one responsible for anything going pop.

So use this instead, its will stress the CPU and memory as much or more than any app you will ever use, so it will be stable if its stable in this.

Now before you go in to overclocking start up HWMonitor and AIDA, in AIDA on the left go to Motherboard and click on CPU, on the option bar at the top go to System Stability Test, that will open a new window, uncheck Test Local Disks and then click start at the bottom.

Now this is very important, keep your eye on the temperatures, on the attached picture i have highlighted in yellow what you need to watch in HWMonitor on the left.

If you see the #Core temperatures get to 53c stop the test, with the CPU temperature you need to stop the test if that gets to 64c.
Otherwise leave it running for 10 minutes and then stop it, let me know what your highest temperatures are for both readings.

Footyslayer · 24 Jan 2013 at 20:18

Thanks for that

However it seems my processor is overheating within 5 seconds!!! Here is a picture or two of the tower setup...

Also here is the test...

So based on that what are my options?

Ideally in about 2 years I will completely overhaul. For now I'd like to just make this tower have a bit more ooommppphhh. Maybe by spending £100 if needed. If I can overclock this processor and by getting away with a better heatsink or something that would be ideal. Worst case I buy the Phenom II X4 970 'Black Edition' with a heatsink and overclock that.

But if you know how I can stop this proccessor hitting those temps and I can overclock I would appreciate that, I am very grateful for your time

Avenged7Fold · 24 Jan 2013 at 23:42

I dont use CPU ID because oddly, it says [TRIAL] over the temps since i got windows 8

It looks like your hitting near your temperature limit. Lowering the Vcore a bit will drop the temps but the over clock wont be as stable, so you may need to drop the multiplier a bit if it isnt stable. A better air cooler isn't expensive and can prove to be useful still when you decide to upgrade everything else if you choose one that fits a variety of sockets(yours looks like the stock cooler, i cant tell because my phenom has so much dust on the heat sink it would be a health hazard if i opened up my case to have a look)

I see your multiplier is still x14 in your screenshot, did you find where to increase it or it still just showing a max of x14?

In my opinion, if you can afford it, i would get a new MOBO, RAM and CPU. Because DDR2 RAM is harder to find now, you might even get a decent buyer for it.

humbug · 25 Jan 2013 at 00:43

Its right on the limit, those stock coolers are completely useless.

Before spending money on a new cooler lets see if you can actually overclock with the Motherboard.

In the BIOS where it says "CPU Frequancy Mhz" set it to 21, (which should be 210Mhz)

Where it says "memory clock" set it to 333Mhz, you might have to do that in "DRAM Configuration" and / or set "set memory clock" to manual, i cant tell from that picture...

"system voltage control" set to manual and then CPU Vcore to 1.3600v, you might have to set "CPU voltage control" to manual.

If you have managed to do all that save it and boot into windows, open CPU-Z like pictured and show me what it says.

(You can open 2 CPU-Z at once, select memory tab on the second)

Avenged7Fold · 25 Jan 2013 at 01:11

The stock fan should be doing better than that. My phenom's with stock fan never ran that hot. Might be worth taking heatsink off, cleaning the dust, clean the TIC off and apply new one. Sometimes that is all that takes to drop 10+ degree's

Bluntwrapped · 25 Jan 2013 at 12:50

My Phenom II 940 BE was a good little chip. It did however bottleneck my GTX 480 even when overclocked. Max I managed to get out of it was 3.6Ghz which wasn't entirely stable but stable enough to play Skyrim with decent FPS

Footyslayer · 25 Jan 2013 at 15:46

Avenged7Fold said:
I dont use CPU ID because oddly, it says [TRIAL] over the temps since i got windows 8

It looks like your hitting near your temperature limit. Lowering the Vcore a bit will drop the temps but the over clock wont be as stable, so you may need to drop the multiplier a bit if it isnt stable. A better air cooler isn't expensive and can prove to be useful still when you decide to upgrade everything else if you choose one that fits a variety of sockets(yours looks like the stock cooler, i cant tell because my phenom has so much dust on the heat sink it would be a health hazard if i opened up my case to have a look)

I see your multiplier is still x14 in your screenshot, did you find where to increase it or it still just showing a max of x14?

In my opinion, if you can afford it, i would get a new MOBO, RAM and CPU. Because DDR2 RAM is harder to find now, you might even get a decent buyer for it.

I can't increase it from x14, that is it's maximum!

I am pondering an overclocked bundle based on all this.

humbug said:
Its right on the limit, those stock coolers are completely useless.

Before spending money on a new cooler lets see if you can actually overclock with the Motherboard.

In the BIOS where it says "CPU Frequancy Mhz" set it to 21, (which should be 210Mhz)

Where it says "memory clock" set it to 333Mhz, you might have to do that in "DRAM Configuration" and / or set "set memory clock" to manual, i cant tell from that picture...

"system voltage control" set to manual and then CPU Vcore to 1.3600v, you might have to set "CPU voltage control" to manual.

If you have managed to do all that save it and boot into windows, open CPU-Z like pictured and show me what it says.

(You can open 2 CPU-Z at once, select memory tab on the second)

It does appear to have worked, temperatures are up though!

Avenged7Fold said:
The stock fan should be doing better than that. My phenom's with stock fan never ran that hot. Might be worth taking heatsink off, cleaning the dust, clean the TIC off and apply new one. Sometimes that is all that takes to drop 10+ degree's

Yeah I guess the stock fan should be better, a little disappointed with that. Cleaning it is an option.

Anyway...

After all this info and ideas thrown at me I am pondering buying an overclocked bundle. I suppose I can overclock this with a better heatsink but I could just bite the bullet and but a new PSU and overclocked bundle. I'd like to be able to play games on very high - medium settings for the next 2-3 years, is this ideal?

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=BU-116-OE&groupid=43&catid=2384&subcat=

Overall thoughts on these options and the current overclock / overheat please

humbug · 25 Jan 2013 at 16:19

Building a new rig is best, you not going to get much more out of that one.

A, you need to be sure that the CPU cooler will fit in your case, some of them can be rather tall and just don't fit inside smaller cases.

And i can spec you better for the same money or less than that overclocked bundle.

The Motherboard in it is top notch, i have it myself and it is brilliant, but total overkill.

The CPU is a Bulldozer, Piledriver is better.

AMD Piledriver FX-6 Six Core 6300 3.50GHz £96

Asus M5A99X EVO AMD 990X £100

Cooler Master Hyper 412S CPU Cooler £29,
is use that cooler on my 1090T, have a look at the temperatures again to see how good it is, i swear by it, its really very good.
But you need to be sure it will fit in your case, and read the instructions on how to fit it, its not easy.

GeIL EVO Leggera 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 PC3-14900C10 1866MH £50

Total £275.

XFX Pro 550W Core Edition '80 Plus Bronze' £50
I have the 750 Watt version of that, again, very good.

That will see you through the next few years.