HiFi sounds better with CH on

BallisticGT3 · 3 Mar 2019 at 08:33

Here's a strange one for all of the electrical experts on here.

I live in a 20 year old house and have my decent hifi system plugged into the lounge ring main with everything being connected via a Surgex SX2213-RL power conditioner.

I mostly listen to music late on a Saturday afternoon and I always thought it was just my imagination, or the system having warmed up, that everything seemed to sound better after the system had been on for about an hour. I always switch everything on and let it all warm-up for at least 30m before listening to anything.

Yesterday, midway through a session, suddenly everything moved up a gear, it was like flicking a switch and there was a noticeable improvement in sound quality, which remained present for the rest of the session. I looked at my watch and it was 18.00pm. Now the only event I can think of that happens at that time is when the central heating is set to come on. How strange.
Does anyone have any idea as to why this should be the case and what do I need to do to make this change permanent?

kitfit1 · 3 Mar 2019 at 09:17

There could be any number of reasons you are hearing a difference, but by far the biggest is Solar Panels. If you or any of your near neighbors have them fitted they will input RFI into the mains and ruin most sound reproduction. Apart from your CH coming on at 6pm, it could also be that your or your neighbors Solar Panels stop contributing to the national grid at that time as well ?

BallisticGT3 · 3 Mar 2019 at 18:38

I do live on a large, modern estate where some of the houses have solar panels, but not any of my near neighbors.

How can I check if mains RFI is the issue and if it is, what steps can I take to reduce/eliminate it?

kitfit1 · 3 Mar 2019 at 19:39

RFI has been an ongoing issue within the recording industry since it was born. All commercial recording studios use Balanced Power Supplies to eliminate it. I suffered with it when i moved into my current house, 3 houses opposite and one behind me have Solar Panels. Those panels supply the nation grid, so of course i use that power as well because like them and you, we are all connected to it. I know my issue was RFI because i did not suffer from it in my previous house (no solar panels for miles). I bought an Airlink 3Kva balanced power supply, my amp, cd player and power supply are plugged into it. The difference was immediately obvious and my system sounds as good now as it did before i moved.

BallisticGT3 · 3 Mar 2019 at 20:05

Many thanks for your input so far Kitfit1

So your thoughts are that the issue is RFI, rather than the effect of loading, impedance, grounding introduced by the c/h?

I need to find a way to have it demonstrated what the issue is, so that I can decide on the most effective way to eliminate it.

In your opinion will I be better off buying a decent balanced p/s, such as the one you use, or having a dedicated ‘clean’ ring main installed, just for the hifi.

kitfit1 · 3 Mar 2019 at 20:14

You can easily eliminate your CH by turning it on manually when you switch you hi fi on. I never turn my hi fi off and do use it at all sorts of times during the day and evening. A dedicated hi fi supply back to your consumer unit may help but it won't eliminate inherent RFI coming in through your mains supply.

BallisticGT3 · 10 Mar 2019 at 08:21

I tried switching the CH on/off at a different time and couldn't detect a difference, so that's now ruled out.
I couldn't detect any difference in sound quality around 6.00pm yesterday, so whatever the event was at the same time last week, may just have been coincidental.
I'm thinking of getting myself one of these https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Monster-...m4b5fc92208:g:8yMAAOSw3GlcWzZo&frcectupt=true to investigate how noisy the ring main that the hifi is plugged into is, with a view to getting a balanced isolation transformer.

kitfit1 · 10 Mar 2019 at 08:35

If you live anywhere near to me, i'd have no issue bringing my balanced supply round and seeing if it makes a difference on your system.

BallisticGT3 · 11 Mar 2019 at 07:48

Many thanks for the offer - I live 10m NE of Derby.

kitfit1 · 12 Mar 2019 at 18:38

BallisticGT3 said:
Many thanks for the offer - I live 10m NE of Derby.

That's a bit too far to just pop round lol.

theone8181 · 12 Mar 2019 at 19:48

Do you get interference when it's dark outside or not?

kitfit1 · 13 Mar 2019 at 15:49

theone8181 said:
Do you get interference when it's dark outside or not?

Is the question for the OP or me ?

JasonM · 13 Mar 2019 at 15:50

BallisticGT3, it sounds like there is some mains interference. It's possible there is a ground issue with the CH, and when it's activated the ground issue is not effected the same.

What I strongly recommend is a Tacima mains conditioner , I own 3 of these, I have also set them up for other people and I swear they work to improve sound quality. One person I set one up it removed clicking into his HiFi from his fridge. There about £30, I can't link due to forum rules but just search 'Tacima mains conditioner'.

This is the one i'm referring to.

https://www.whathifi.com/tacima/cs947/review

Also this video from PS audio explains the importance of clean power
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FD_2RKpWkYw

Quartz · 13 Mar 2019 at 15:57

How can mains interference be an issue if he's using a power conditioner?

JasonM · 13 Mar 2019 at 16:01

Quartz said:
How can mains interference be an issue if he's using a power conditioner?

But he's not using a mains conditioner, at least I can't read he is using one, and i'm telling him to use one.

Quartz · 13 Mar 2019 at 17:07

JasonM said:
But he's not using a mains conditioner, at least I can't read he is using one, and i'm telling him to use one.

Second paragraph of the OP: he's using a Surgex SX2213-RL power conditioner.

mmj_uk · 13 Mar 2019 at 17:34

I'm not an electrician but it sounds like a ground loop?

JasonM · 13 Mar 2019 at 18:22

Quartz said:
Second paragraph of the OP: he's using a Surgex SX2213-RL power conditioner.

Well that's Dyslexia for you, managed to get a Computer Science degree had to read all my exam papers at least 3 times, read the OP's post at least twice but missed it.

BallisticGT3 · 13 Mar 2019 at 18:31

theone8181 said:
Do you get interference when it's dark outside or not?

What ‘interference’ are you referring too? I’m not aware of it being light or dark making any difference to the sound quality.

JasonM said:
BallisticGT3, it sounds like there is some mains interference. It's possible there is a ground issue with the CH, and when it's activated the ground issue is not effected the same.

What I strongly recommend is a Tacima mains conditioner , I own 3 of these, I have also set them up for other people and I swear they work to improve sound quality. One person I set one up it removed clicking into his HiFi from his fridge. There about £30, I can't link due to forum rules but just search 'Tacima mains conditioner'.

This is the one i'm referring to.

https://www.whathifi.com/tacima/cs947/review

Also this video from PS audio explains the importance of clean power
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FD_2RKpWkYw

As per my last post, I think I’ve ruled out the CH being the guilty culprit, as I tried manually switching it on/off at a different time of day and couldn’t tell a difference.

I am already using a Surgex surge eliminator - power conditioner.

Whatever is going on with the Mains supply remains a mystery and on most Saturdays, late in the afternoon, I do notice a step-up in the sound reproduction of my hifi.

I am using ethernet over mains to communicate between my iPad and streamer and have read that these can introduce a lot of interference, but if this was the case why would it change at different times of the day?

BallisticGT3 · 13 Mar 2019 at 18:33

mmj_uk said:
I'm not an electrician but it sounds like a ground loop?

From my experience of ground loops, they result in a audible mains hum, and this is not what I’m experiencing - but thanks for the suggestion and to everyone else that has responded so far.