High-revving, noisy internal combustion engines?

[stockhausen]

Christian Horner wants to see the next generation of Formula 1 engines go down the route of sustainability, but wants to ensure they are high-revving and noisy. The current hybrid engines are in place until 2025, but meetings have begun between the sport and manufacturers to discuss what the next power unit regulations should be. (LINK)

I don't know what the future is for Honda and Red Bull, I was rather under the impression that Honda are pulling out of Formula 1 (again).

Whilst one might miss the days of 2.4-litre turbocharged V8s, the reality is that the engine manufacturers want to promote their current and future technology; this pretty much means that the Hondas, Mercedes, Renaults and even Ferrari are likely to be ever more interested in energy recovery and electric power.

Somehow I just can't see a return to noisy, fuel guzzling sewing machines, evocative though they may be - perhaps the future is Formula E?

 

[Quartz]

A noisy engine is an inefficient engine.

 

[stockhausen]

A noisy engine is an inefficient engine.

Whilst that is not really the point here, I am not convinced by your claim. I believe that Dr. Gordon Blair of QUB proved years ago that a decent exhaust system is more effective that an "open" exhaust - and I don't think that he was talking about "quiet" - I may well be wrong; if so, sorry

 

[Quartz]

Noise is energy. Energy that should be going to the wheels. Given the way internal combustion engines work you aren't going to get a silent engine since it works off explosions but compare the noise a well-tuned engine makes to the same engine badly tuned.

 

[Feek]

Screaming V10s please

 

[this_is_gav]

Whilst one might miss the days of 2.4-litre turbocharged V8s, the reality is that the engine manufacturers want to promote their current and future technology; this pretty much means that the Hondas, Mercedes, Renaults and even Ferrari are likely to be ever more interested in energy recovery and electric power.

I don't think we've ever had 2.4L turbos in any configuration. The 80s turbos were of a similar size to the hybrids introduced in 2014 (1.5L then vs 1.6L now). The only V8 turbo ever used in F1 I believe was the Alfa Romeo unit introduced in 1983.



Personally I hated the V8 era that preceded the current hybrids. They were just noise and had little in the way of the character that the V10s did. While the hybrids weren't great when introduced (thank you Bernie for doing your best to make them sound as bad as possible), they at least sounded different to each other and were much better in person.

We'll see what they come up with, but "fuel-guzzling" they certainly won't be, even with bio fuels. Hopefully they can genuinely add some of the noise back in, but not at the volumes they were pre-hybrid.

 

[Alibaba99]

Whilst that is not really the point here, I am not convinced by your claim. I believe that Dr. Gordon Blair of QUB proved years ago that a decent exhaust system is more effective that an "open" exhaust - and I don't think that he was talking about "quiet" - I may well be wrong; if so, sorry

You're forgetting the turbocharger / MGU-H. The speed of the turbo is predominantly controlled by the load on the MGU-H so most of the exhaust gases pass through the turbine so things are quietened down. The wastegate, which is open to atmosphere is the secondary control system.

 

[Greboth]

Seemingly an unpopular opinion but I prefer the hybrid noise over some of the more recent NA engines especially the V8's. The hybrids aren't as loud but they're hardly silent and volume isn't everything. The hybrids make all sorts of noises depending on braking and accelerating and whether they're harvesting or not which makes a far more interesting sound than the V8's screaming away.

The hybrids compared to the V12's though, that's a whole different story. There's some great videos of the Ferrari 412 lapping Imola and that is a noise I can get behind.

 

[cuke2u]

There are looking at bio fuel to start with then possibly hydrogen to power the cars...

 

[Hotwired]

There are looking at bio fuel to start with then possibly hydrogen to power the cars...

Refuelling with hydrogen mid race sounds like it would have to be different. Maybe swapping out a prefilled cylinder would be preferable.

Hmmmm

Average of 7 minutes to refuel a (different) hydrogen race car that Toyota made: https://www.forbes.com/sites/peterl...-car-to-promote-alternative-to-electric-cars/

 

[PinkFloyd]

Seemingly an unpopular opinion but I prefer the hybrid noise over some of the more recent NA engines especially the V8's. The hybrids aren't as loud but they're hardly silent and volume isn't everything. The hybrids make all sorts of noises depending on braking and accelerating and whether they're harvesting or not which makes a far more interesting sound than the V8's screaming away.

The hybrids compared to the V12's though, that's a whole different story. There's some great videos of the Ferrari 412 lapping Imola and that is a noise I can get behind.

I'm with you, the Hybrids are pretty interesting to listen to. Whilst the old V8s were just high pitched and loud without any real tune unlike older engines. We're never going to go back to the old days, so should embrace what we have currently and continue to tune the engines and microphones to pick up the intricacies of the Hybrid engines.

 

[cu3ed]

I prefer the hybrids, you hear so much more going on etc, and you sometimes get that great sou d of the turbo going through the roof.

 

[TrueCrazyLion]

I think I was blessed to have started watching F1 in 1989. The engines that year sounded glorious.
I know I might be biased, but I don’t think any era of F1, before or since, has epitomised the classic sound of the cars quite like the field did in that first year or so after “going atmo” again after the first generation of turbos got banned.
V12 Ferraris and Lamborghinis, V10 Hondas and Renaults, V8 Ford DFVs and Judds.

Wouldn’t mind having those back! LOL

 

[Nasher]

A noisy engine is an inefficient engine.

Not really, it's mostly the exhaust which produces the noise. Muffling it makes it LESS efficient as then it's storing all the excess energy as heat.

 

[Quartz]

Muffling it makes it LESS efficient

Who said anything about muffling?

 

[BuffetSlayer]

Not related to the future of motor racing but I have always had a soft spot for the normally aspirated 2 litre Honda vetc engines.

Great fun in an affordable and reliable package.

 

[mattyg]

Not related to the future of motor racing but I have always had a soft spot for the normally aspirated 2 litre Honda vetc engines.

Great fun in an affordable and reliable package.

D/B16 and B18 all the way. Proper engines

 

[Housey]

I think I was blessed to have started watching F1 in 1989. The engines that year sounded glorious.
I know I might be biased, but I don’t think any era of F1, before or since, has epitomised the classic sound of the cars quite like the field did in that first year or so after “going atmo” again after the first generation of turbos got banned.
V12 Ferraris and Lamborghinis, V10 Hondas and Renaults, V8 Ford DFVs and Judds.

Wouldn’t mind having those back! LOL

I think the flat 12 Ferrari, Matra V12 and Alfa were the most melodic.

 

[this_is_gav]

I think the flat 12 Ferrari, Matra V12 and Alfa were the most melodic.

Matra V12 certainly. BRM V16 (50s) was pretty special too if we're going back to before most of us were born.

The infamous BRM H16 (66 and 67) probably sound great too, yet it's hard to find a decent clip of one being driven at speed, as they were so fragile and very few probably remain, with those that do being restricted to low-speed demo runs.

 

[413x]

Not related to the future of motor racing but I have always had a soft spot for the normally aspirated 2 litre Honda vetc engines.

Great fun in an affordable and reliable package.

My s2k was absolutely bullet proof. Before it got written off it never missed an mot, never had a mechanical problem. I had it for 9 years, 70k miles I added and it was 20 years old.

What a screamer!

I joke (but I'm partly serious) longest. Most. Successful relationship I've had!