Intermittent freezing (including in BIOS) - I built my daughter a gaming PC (Z690, Intel i9, GeForce RTX 3080) was fine for a year, no changes made.

steams

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Hi All, I'm not sure where to go to and hoping someone on the forum could help or recommend someone who could.

I build my daughter a relatively high end gaming PC last summer and it was fine until a couple of months ago when it started freezing when stressed in games. I re-seated all of the components and even replaced the heatsink paste on the CPU which helped for a while but then it slowly got worse to the extent now it won't run for more than a couple of minutes. Even when off for a long period of time, when I look at temperatures in the BIOS everything looks good other than the chipset temperature which is well over 60 degrees.

My current suspicion is either the motherboard is faulty (I have seen a recall but it seems to be related to water-cooling the chipset which I'm not doing) or the power supply isn't sufficient (but I would expect that would have caused issues from day one).
I don't really want to start buying parts to change out without knowing what the cause is so I'm a bit stuck and could use some advice.

The build is as follows:
  • ASUS ROG MAXIMUS Z690 FORMULA, Intel Z690, S 1700, DDR5, PCIe 5.0, SATA3, M.2, 10GbE/ax WiFi, USB 3.2 Gen2x2/TB4, ATX
  • Intel Core i9 12900K, S 1700, Alder Lake, 16 Cores, 24 Threads, 3.2GHz, 5.1GHz Turbo, 30MB Cache, 125W, Retail
  • 32GB (2x16GB) Corsair DDR5 Vengeance White, PC5-44800 (5600), Non-ECC Unbuffered, CAS 36, XMP 3.0, 1.25V
  • 1TB Samsung 980 PRO, M.2 (2280), PCIe 4.0 (x4) NVMe SSD, MLC 3D V-NAND, 7000MB/s Read, 5000MB/s Write, PS5 Compatible
  • ASUS ROG Strix GeForce RTX™ 3080 V2 White OC Edition 10GB GDDR6X with LHR
  • Lian-Li UNI SL120 Addressable RGB White 120mm Fan x 10
  • Corsair iCUE 5000T RGB Tempered Glass Mid-Tower ATX PC Case — White
  • Corsair CX-F RGB Series CX750F RGB 80 PLUS Bronze Fully Modular ATX Power Supply White
  • NZXT Kraken Z73 RGB AIO CPU Water Cooler with LCD Screen White - 360mm
Picture of build below (during it's better days) if anyone's interested:

53123564845_28ff615b47_m.jpg


Thanks,

Stephen
 
First thought reading did you apply the firmware fix for the Samsung SSD a while ago? Hi and welcome hope ya get it fixed I'm no expert. :) Download Samsung magician just to rule it out drives will cause freezes even in the BIOS. Loving the colours of the build though reminds me of the refreshers sweets years ago. Mmmmm
 
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If it's freezing even in the BIOS try process of elimination.

Remove components from mobo one by one, and boot up and see if it continues to freeze
 
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steams said:
Hey both, thanks for the speedy replies. @SpartaP - sounds like a great idea, will give that a go tomorrow and see what happens.
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You could try the scare tactic.... Browse better components on the PC.... and hope it plays again :D Sorry I know its serious Its just hard not having it in my hands. But the Samsung issue could be a shout ball gotta start rolling somewhere. That's the first thing I read probably wrong though.
 
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Haha, I like your style, keep it on its toes :cry:. Will definitely start with the SSD though, and if that proves to be the issue hopefully I can get it to stay up for long enough to flash the firmware. A quick search confirms similar symptoms, would have been the last place I would have looked TBH.
 
steams said:
Haha, I like your style, keep it on its toes :cry:. Will definitely start with the SSD though, and if that proves to be the issue hopefully I can get it to stay up for long enough to flash the firmware. A quick search confirms similar symptoms, would have been the last place I would have looked TBH.
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That's what she said! Good luck! Teraflops crossed. :D
 
steams said:
I build my daughter a relatively high end gaming PC last summer and it was fine until a couple of months ago when it started freezing when stressed in games.
Click to expand...

Has absolutely nothing changed, even including external devices?

Freezing is a real pain to diagnose, since it can be anything, but with a relatively new PC, I wouldn't expect any of the parts to have degraded that fast.

The SSD is a known 'bad' component, so I'd definitely start there, as already advised. If the firmware doesn't help, I'd suggest you check the smart data and run a long scan with magician.

Have you had a look in the event viewer? Sometimes that can give hints.

You could also try downclocking the CPU (e.g. turn off the turbo) and the graphics card.

steams said:
My current suspicion is either the motherboard is faulty (I have seen a recall but it seems to be related to water-cooling the chipset which I'm not doing) or the power supply isn't sufficient (but I would expect that would have caused issues from day one).
Click to expand...

The power supply is not the best, honestly, but it's better than most and has a 5 year warranty, so I'd be surprised if it is dying within just one year.

steams said:
I re-seated all of the components and even replaced the heatsink paste on the CPU which helped for a while but then it slowly got worse to the extent now it won't run for more than a couple of minutes.
Click to expand...

There's a few possibilities I can think of there:
1. Just a coincidence and it didn't do anything.
2. Something is loose, maybe the graphics card is sagging (you could test that by laying the case flat, or supporting the card underneath, but your watercooling may be impacted by changing the orientation).
3. The CPU mount isn't right and there's uneven contact or too much/too little pressure pushing the CPU into the socket.

The graphics card isn't on a riser, right? You could try changing the PCI-E mode.
 
Have you cleaned windows up?
If it's not overheating then first thing that springs to mind is malware, any suspicious or unnecessary tasks running in task manager?

Alternatively I could be a faulty PSU... Pre built 'gaming systems' often come with bargain basement PSUs as most people who buy pre-built only look at the cpu and GPU specs.

It could be anything really but I'd rule out a software issue in the first instance.
 
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Drives are dirt cheap at the moment. I would buy a cheap one, take out the current one and try a fresh install of Windows. That will rule out a lot of issues. One stick of RAM at a time to check for a dodgy one. Spare GPU? The worst thing would be if there's an issue with the motherboard, fingers crossed it's the drive.
 
Thanks for all the useful replies everyone. So here’s where I am:
  • Setup the pc in a different room with my own power cable, monitor, keyboard and mouse, no additional peripherals - still freezes.
  • Removed the GPU (motherboard has onboard graphics) - same frequency of issues but instead screen freezing where it is and mouse not moving it goes blank.
  • Removed the SSD (kind of eliminated the Windows install early on as it was still freezing in the BIOS menus) and it still freezes. Initially downloaded Samsung Magician to install but unfortunately PC doesn’t stay up long enough.
  • Removed each RAM stick and ran with a single one but in both cases still froze.
Kind of running out of options without buying something to swap out.

Quick question, can I unplug the AIO cooler and all the fans to eliminate them without anything overheating? At this stage the longest I’ve had it on without freezing is probably less than 5 minutes.
 
Have you set the motherboard back to defaults? Power supply issue, aging components? All cable connections checked? Is the pump in the cooler working correctly? CPU temperature ok?
 
I set to defaults and disabled turbo and it didn’t help.
Temperatures look okay, I left unplugged overnight and went straight to BIOS first thing this morning and it still froze in less than 5 minutes, but I managed to check temps first.

My gut feel is still the power supply, when I built the system the quick calculations I did were just under 750W and I went with a 750W bronze supply because my daughter wanted more of that RGB goodness! Now regretting not going to 850W. Saying that, just removing the GPU should have significantly reduced the load, but I guess if the damage is done the supply could still be unstable.

I’m considering buying this as my first test - hopefully that will be more suitable:
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/asus...plus-gold-modular-power-supply-ca-05l-as.html
 
steams said:
I’m considering buying this as my first test - hopefully that will be more suitable:
Click to expand...

That's an old pre-ATX 3.0/PCIE5 design, though admittedly from a decent Seasonic platform. If it was me, I'd pay £10 for the Toughpower GF3 1000. It is not white though.
 
Thanks, glad I asked first. Really hope it’s that, what is the minimum I need in the motherboard to get into the BIOS menus? Will it work without CPU? It’s difficult not having spares to switch out, if I have to replace something I’d like to know it’s the faulty part. I always felt the power supply was the weakest link of the build anyway so can kind of justify to myself changing it even though it may not fix the issue.
 
steams said:
What is the minimum I need in the motherboard to get into the BIOS menus? Will it work without CPU?
Click to expand...

For BIOS you need CPU and RAM.

steams said:
Quick question, can I unplug the AIO cooler and all the fans to eliminate them without anything overheating? At this stage the longest I’ve had it on without freezing is probably less than 5 minutes.
Click to expand...

AIO without power (or without fans) usually has a weak passive cooling effect, but I wouldn't want to run much that is intensive, though the CPU should throttle itself if necessary.

It sounds like you've ruled out everything except:
- Both sticks of RAM are faulty.
- Motherboard.
- CPU.
- PSU.
 
So I changed the power supply and the problem still persists - so much for my gut feel. And my wallet. At least I was able to do a much better job of cable routing as the 1000W supply I got had far more outlets and cable choices than the 750W one I replaced.

My next point of call was to remove the CPU as @d_brennen suggested (yes, I should have done that first but I’d already placed the order by then).

Now the PC isn’t freezing anymore for the short bursts I’ve had it on (promising) but according to the BIOS the CPU temp is 100 degrees so I‘m reluctant to keep it on. There seems to be a good distribution of heat paste and I tightened the screws slowly in the order the AIO manual recommended. In case I’m doing something stupid, I’m attaching photos below:

Motherboard socket:
https://flic.kr/p/2oXaeZA

CPU bottom:
https://flic.kr/p/2oX9d8F

CPU top:
https://flic.kr/p/2oX55iZ

AIO Cooler bottom:
https://flic.kr/p/2oX88F3

BIOS temps:
https://flic.kr/p/2oX55jR

AIO temp:
https://flic.kr/p/2oX9d9N

I’m scared to run it for too long as is if that temperature readout is correct, surely from cold only going into BIOS it can’t get that hot in less than 30 seconds? I’m wondering if I caused anything else when recabling.
 
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