Is it worth getting a vive pro now?

breadturbo

breadturbo

breadturbo

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I was wanting a nice Index but they are currently out of stock, and someone I know has said he has a delivery email of March!

So i was wondering if the controllers are really that big of a deal? I was looking at this on OCUK (though I have no idea what 'HMD' means)

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/htc-...T9nEF-5prIAttkq677UMF5RgZXvzJZuxoC-LsQAvD_BwE

Is it still worth going for one of should I just wait for the Index?
what do you guys think ? :)
 
HMD = Head Mounted Device.

As far as I know the only advantage of the Vive Pro over the Index is the screens are OLED rather than LCD. That leads to more vibrant colours but due to the subpixel layout this will seem less sharp than the Index. In most other respects - FOV, refresh rate, comfort, audio, etc. the Index is superior from what I've read.
 
If anything I'd get a cheap secondhand Vive (make sure it includes the basestations and controllers) and then upgrade piecemeal when the index stuff is back in stock.
 
well I did something rather silly and bought a 2nd hand cosmos a guy local was selling for 500, but that turned out to be a big 'foo foo'

My carpet is black and my walls grey and the cosmos sees this as totally black so doesn't work at all in the room with my pc, works fine downstairs but i cant be relocating an sli'd triple 360 rad watercooled pc in a caselabs sm08 every time, it'd kill me :( so back to the drawing board and a 'told ya so' for me being too impulsive :)

On a side note, would the pro have avoided this using the lighthouses inside of the cameras?
 
No no no no no no. A used vive pro dependant on the price is potentially a good deal because it give you the light houses.
But otherwise just no if talking about new.
and if ur going used, the reason ur going vive pro is for OLEd AND wireless.

the £899 OC are charging can get you near enough give or take a few quid:
1. A full Valve Index package with HMD, base stations 2.0s and next gen controllers
2. A pimax Artisan HMD + 2.0 light houses + next gen index controllers
3. A Rift S (399) AND a Quest (399) + KSC75 headphones for the Rift S + Mamut grips for both devices

I'd take any of those 3 over a used Vive Pro.

Your options should be:
1. Oculus Quest (same Vive pro panel but clocked at 72hz and uses Oculus Link software to encode vidoe data which introduces a hit to clarity and can cause some artifacts)
2. Rift S (bargain basement headset IMO with low refresh rate, the worst of the VR headsets LCD panels but a GREAT price and great clarity per £, however lacks audio, physical ipd and uses the same controllers as the quest despite them now being a generation old, no improvement in fov etc..)
3. Index (main con being its an LCD panel rather than OLED I doubt we'll see a return to OLED for a while; main issue being the valve customer support and QA is simply not good enough)
4. Pimax Artisan (probably the best value headset on the market, combining a next gen field of view with most of the features of the Index, its main cons being its from a chinese company which are still very new and have crap customer service relatively, will require more tinkering than the other 2 headsets and no good enough audio solution (basically like the rift s)
5. Pimax 8KX (very expensive, £1000 for the HMD but it has image quality that has been described by MRTV as the BEST in consumer class, that means its overall better than XTAL and Acer Varijo headsts which are much much more expensive so for your money you're getting an AMAZING deal.. in native dual 4k mode ur capped at 75hz and you don't have a good audio solution for it other than headphones, BUT it can downscale down to 8K+ and deliver 120fps I believe and definitely 90hz)


I'd say the best option is the Index as you have a clear upgrade path to the 8KX or Artisan if you fancy a wider field of view. The base station technology seems here to stay and I can't think how Oculus will better the Index controllers in 1-3 years so they're all good investments as far as technology goes.

the Index headset is the only headset which IMO combines audio and visual fidelity as a complete high end premium package which is sad.

If you are a tinkerer, I'd go for the Artisan.
If you love the high end best of the best products, then the 8KX.

If you have a budget, I'd go for the Quest as portable VR is fun and the OLED panels via Oculus Link make some games REALLY nice.
If you have a budget and find the Quest uncomfortable, then your choices are a used Vive or a Rift S. I'd opt for a used Vive if your IPD is not in range as again you have a clear upgrade path, but otherwise the Rift S is a really nice entry level point into VR.


The issue with VR is it can get expensive once you buy the headset. aka buying headphones, wrist supports for controllers, presception lens adaptors, cases, charging cables... you can end up paying an extra 100-200 or even in some people's cases 300 pounds... I feel its important people don't spend more than their headset is worth. buying £100 audio solution for a Rift S for example is silly IMO.
 
If you can find a secondhand Vive Pro HMD in good condition for around the £400 mark, I'd get one (and in fact I did :)). As for controllers and basestations, get the Index ones. The whole package then puts it in the same price category as the full Index package (maybe £50-£100 more expensive) - you just have to decide whether you like OLED with its vivid colours and awesome blacks or LCD panels with slightly better FOV, pixel density and refresh rate.

I'm extremely happy with my Pro. My only criticism would be the lacklustre audio compared to the DAS for the original Vive (and I'm sure the Index audio would blow it out the water as well).

Since all the Index gubbins are out of stock, you may just be better off waiting and getting the complete Index in one go.
 
ArmitageShanks said:
If you can find a secondhand Vive Pro HMD in good condition for around the £400 mark, I'd get one (and in fact I did :)). As for controllers and basestations, get the Index ones. The whole package then puts it in the same price category as the full Index package (maybe £50-£100 more expensive) - you just have to decide whether you like OLED with its vivid colours and awesome blacks or LCD panels with slightly better FOV, pixel density and refresh rate.

I'm extremely happy with my Pro. My only criticism would be the lacklustre audio compared to the DAS for the original Vive (and I'm sure the Index audio would blow it out the water as well).

Since all the Index gubbins are out of stock, you may just be better off waiting and getting the complete Index in one go.
Click to expand...


*Better audio, better SDE, better refresh rate, much better vertical FOV, better hoziontal FOV, magnetic face gasket, next generation audio solution, FOV slider with great glasses support, better clarity, warranty
Worse black level, contrast, glare.
 
aoaaron said:
No no no no no no. A used vive pro dependant on the price is potentially a good deal because it give you the light houses.
But otherwise just no if talking about new.
and if ur going used, the reason ur going vive pro is for OLEd AND wireless.

the £899 OC are charging can get you near enough give or take a few quid:
1. A full Valve Index package with HMD, base stations 2.0s and next gen controllers
2. A pimax Artisan HMD + 2.0 light houses + next gen index controllers
3. A Rift S (399) AND a Quest (399) + KSC75 headphones for the Rift S + Mamut grips for both devices

I'd take any of those 3 over a used Vive Pro.

Your options should be:
1. Oculus Quest (same Vive pro panel but clocked at 72hz and uses Oculus Link software to encode vidoe data which introduces a hit to clarity and can cause some artifacts)
2. Rift S (bargain basement headset IMO with low refresh rate, the worst of the VR headsets LCD panels but a GREAT price and great clarity per £, however lacks audio, physical ipd and uses the same controllers as the quest despite them now being a generation old, no improvement in fov etc..)
3. Index (main con being its an LCD panel rather than OLED I doubt we'll see a return to OLED for a while; main issue being the valve customer support and QA is simply not good enough)
4. Pimax Artisan (probably the best value headset on the market, combining a next gen field of view with most of the features of the Index, its main cons being its from a chinese company which are still very new and have crap customer service relatively, will require more tinkering than the other 2 headsets and no good enough audio solution (basically like the rift s)
5. Pimax 8KX (very expensive, £1000 for the HMD but it has image quality that has been described by MRTV as the BEST in consumer class, that means its overall better than XTAL and Acer Varijo headsts which are much much more expensive so for your money you're getting an AMAZING deal.. in native dual 4k mode ur capped at 75hz and you don't have a good audio solution for it other than headphones, BUT it can downscale down to 8K+ and deliver 120fps I believe and definitely 90hz)


I'd say the best option is the Index as you have a clear upgrade path to the 8KX or Artisan if you fancy a wider field of view. The base station technology seems here to stay and I can't think how Oculus will better the Index controllers in 1-3 years so they're all good investments as far as technology goes.

the Index headset is the only headset which IMO combines audio and visual fidelity as a complete high end premium package which is sad.

If you are a tinkerer, I'd go for the Artisan.
If you love the high end best of the best products, then the 8KX.

If you have a budget, I'd go for the Quest as portable VR is fun and the OLED panels via Oculus Link make some games REALLY nice.
If you have a budget and find the Quest uncomfortable, then your choices are a used Vive or a Rift S. I'd opt for a used Vive if your IPD is not in range as again you have a clear upgrade path, but otherwise the Rift S is a really nice entry level point into VR.


The issue with VR is it can get expensive once you buy the headset. aka buying headphones, wrist supports for controllers, presception lens adaptors, cases, charging cables... you can end up paying an extra 100-200 or even in some people's cases 300 pounds... I feel its important people don't spend more than their headset is worth. buying £100 audio solution for a Rift S for example is silly IMO.
Click to expand...


excellent advice - i own a vive and would not recommend a pro.
 
breadturbo said:
well I did something rather silly and bought a 2nd hand cosmos a guy local was selling for 500, but that turned out to be a big 'foo foo'

My carpet is black and my walls grey and the cosmos sees this as totally black so doesn't work at all in the room with my pc, works fine downstairs but i cant be relocating an sli'd triple 360 rad watercooled pc in a caselabs sm08 every time, it'd kill me :( so back to the drawing board and a 'told ya so' for me being too impulsive :)

On a side note, would the pro have avoided this using the lighthouses inside of the cameras?
Click to expand...

have you been able to take it back.
 
aoaaron said:
*Better audio, better SDE, better refresh rate, much better vertical FOV, better hoziontal FOV, magnetic face gasket, next generation audio solution, FOV slider with the great glasses support, better clarity, warranty
Worse black level, contrast, glare.
Click to expand...
The SDE of the Pro doesn't bother me, it's pretty fine-grained compared to the OG Vive and pleasing to my eyes.

FOV slider? Not really, it just adjusts the distance from your eyes to accommodate glasses...which both HTC headsets have always had. Sure, the Index lenses can get closer to your eyes...if you don't mind seeing the hard edges of the display panels.

Warranty? Really? Compared with Valve adding all sorts of new clauses to attempt to absolve themselves of thumbstick defects?

Better audio and overall design, sure, that I'll agree with completely. Build quality though....no. The Vives and their controllers (for all their faults) are built like tanks compared with the Index and its flimsy controllers. I dread the day I inevitably smack a wall with my Index controllers.
 
breadturbo said:
On a side note, would the pro have avoided this using the lighthouses inside of the cameras?
Click to expand...
The proper SteamVR headsets (Vive, Pro, Index, Pimax) don't use cameras at all for tracking. The lighthouses emit IR laser beam sweeps that are picked up by photo-diodes on the headsets and controllers to supplement orientation and provide position. They would not be affected by the colours of your walls (unless you had mirrors or other highly reflective surfaces in the room).

The cameras on the headsets themselves are used mainly for passthrough video to allow you to see the real world. At some point they might be used for hand tracking like the Quest, but I doubt it (at least for the Vive and Pro - the Index might be capable of doing it).
 
ArmitageShanks said:
The SDE of the Pro doesn't bother me, it's pretty fine-grained compared to the OG Vive and pleasing to my eyes.

FOV slider? Not really, it just adjusts the distance from your eyes to accommodate glasses...which both HTC headsets have always had. Sure, the Index lenses can get closer to your eyes...if you don't mind seeing the hard edges of the display panels.

Warranty? Really? Compared with Valve adding all sorts of new clauses to attempt to absolve themselves of thumbstick defects?

Better audio and overall design, sure, that I'll agree with completely. Build quality though....no. The Vives and their controllers (for all their faults) are built like tanks compared with the Index and its flimsy controllers. I dread the day I inevitably smack a wall with my Index controllers.
Click to expand...


The SDE on the Index is miles better than the Vive Pro. Compared to the Vive (and CV1) anything is better so I struggle to see the point of using a Vive as point of reference.

FOV slider, yes. As in the ability for the lenses to be closer to your face and therefore have a bigger FOV. However you want to dress it up, its slicker and better implimented on the Index.

So we're comparing the warranty of Valve to HTC now? HTC have the worst warranty out of everyone and I thought that was universally accepted. I'm not a fan of Valve at all but I'd rather deal with them than HTC. Do I think Valve's customer service is phenomenal? No. Do I think its good enough? I actually think not. Is it better than HTCs? Yes. Is it better than Oculus? No. Is it better than buying from a retailer like the Rainforest? No.


Regardless, I don't see sense in this discussion as ultimately I think its fairly obvious that the Index is the much safer bet to put your money unless you MUST have Wireless & OLED and you're prepared to forfiet increased clarity, increased FOV vertically, increased FOV horizontally, better refresh rate options, magnetic face gaskets, a much better audio solution, much better controllers, second gen base stations etc. etc.

If the Vive Pro was bundled with Index controllers and base station 2.0's, I could semi-understand people thinking about it.




I can tell by your post you quite like your Vive Pro though, and don't really want to poo on a product you're happy with. Have you used an Index for an extended period of time? I can understand someone not liking the Index, its definitely not perfect and nor are Valve.
 
breadturbo said:
well I did something rather silly and bought a 2nd hand cosmos a guy local was selling for 500, but that turned out to be a big 'foo foo'

My carpet is black and my walls grey and the cosmos sees this as totally black so doesn't work at all in the room with my pc, works fine downstairs but i cant be relocating an sli'd triple 360 rad watercooled pc in a caselabs sm08 every time, it'd kill me :( so back to the drawing board and a 'told ya so' for me being too impulsive :)

On a side note, would the pro have avoided this using the lighthouses inside of the cameras?
Click to expand...

Use 15m extension cables or something
 
aoaaron said:
I can tell by your post you quite like your Vive Pro though, and don't really want to poo on a product you're happy with. Have you used an Index for an extended period of time? I can understand someone not liking the Index, its definitely not perfect and nor are Valve.
Click to expand...
I've got nothing actually against the Index - in fact I regularly recommend getting it to VR newcomers if you don't already have an existing Vive setup. The Pro is only really a feasible upgrade option if you have the rest of the kit.

I was on the fence on which HMD to get. In the end my Pimax made me realise I value colour depth more than FOV or resolution. It's not the same for everyone though, and that's fair enough.
 
ArmitageShanks said:
I've got nothing actually against the Index - in fact I regularly recommend getting it to VR newcomers if you don't already have an existing Vive setup. The Pro is only really a feasible upgrade option if you have the rest of the kit.

I was on the fence on which HMD to get. In the end my Pimax made me realise I value colour depth more than FOV or resolution. It's not the same for everyone though, and that's fair enough.
Click to expand...


I personally don’t see the vive pro as an upgrade personally.

Its the case of OLED and wireless versus better refresh rates, lower persistence panels, higher clarity, less SDE, better audio, better comfort, magnetic face gaskets, better build quality, arguably better customer support etc.

The next big setup for HMDs after the Index IMO comes from the 8KX pimax are releasing.

Have you used a Pimax? What’re your thoughts? I’m really really eyeing up the Pimax 8KX as I feel it the comfort is on point, it could potentially replace my projector for use-cases where it doesn’t quite replicate as well as a screen. For example, I found RDR2 on my projector just doesn’t look right for some reason.
 
aoaaron said:
I personally don’t see the vive pro as an upgrade personally.

Its the case of OLED and wireless versus better refresh rates, lower persistence panels, higher clarity, less SDE, better audio, better comfort, magnetic face gaskets, better build quality, arguably better customer support etc.

The next big setup for HMDs after the Index IMO comes from the 8KX pimax are releasing.

Have you used a Pimax? What’re your thoughts? I’m really really eyeing up the Pimax 8KX as I feel it the comfort is on point, it could potentially replace my projector for use-cases where it doesn’t quite replicate as well as a screen. For example, I found RDR2 on my projector just doesn’t look right for some reason.
Click to expand...
Horses for courses I guess. I've used the Oculus Go and own a Pimax 8K. Neither have impressive LCD screens in my opinion. The Go had a very faded look to it. The Pimax 8K hits you with impressive FOV, but that soon wears off (at least for me) due to the lack of contrast (and I had it as good as I could get it via the infuriating PiTool).

Note that the original 8K like I've got has a pentile pixel arrangement - it's still impressively clear, on a par with my Vive Pro I'd say, but without the vivid colours and blacks. I'm sure an RGB stripe panel would look a bit sharper - if the 8KX has one of those in an OLED variety, I might be similarly tempted. The overall build quality and flimsiness of my Pimax leaves a lot to be desired though and mine lacks a decent headstrap and built-in audio. On the plus side, it's damned light compared to my Vives. Hopefully they'll manufacture the 8KX with better materials.
 
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