Is this a GPU or VRAM limitation?

[Inaharry]

I'm doing a lot of testing at the moment to try and fix some problems with 2 x KFA2 GTX 670 EX OC cards in SLI.

Something completely unrelated to the other problems I've been having, but have noticed is that when I run Heaven 3.0 on extreme settings, which are:

API: DirectX 11
Tessellation: Extreme
Shaders: High
Anisotropy: 16x
Stereo 3D: Disabled
Muilti Monitor: ON
Anti-aliasing: 8x
Full Screen: ON
Resolution: SYSTEM (5760 x 1080)

...that as expected, even with SLI it's very slow when benchmarking. However, at various stages, the FPS will drop to around 2, although when watching it, it looks more like 1 frame every 1-2 seconds, (like a slideshow). This will last for 8-10 seconds before the FPS return to normal at around 15-30 depending on the stage it's on.

I left GPU-Z running in the background and noticed that maximum memory usage when running at 1920 x 1080 was between 850MB to 1GB, but with multi-monitor, 5760 x 1080, it shows 2046MB.

I'm not sure whether these random and considerable drops in FPS are caused by a lack of GPU power or VRAM. It's difficult to tell whether the 2046MB showing in GPU-Z was used just because 'it's there' or whether that's how much is actually required at this detail level and resolution.

Has anyone else that's running 2GB GTX 6xx cards seen a similar thing in Heaven 3.0 using 5760 x 1080 or more importantly, do users with 4GB cards and the same multi-monitor setup see this as well, especially the maximum memory use under GPU-Z?

Thanks!

 

[Marine-RX179]

Em...I think you are simply overestimating your SLI GTX670.

I doubt it can run Heaven at 5760 res, AND 8xAA, AND extreme tessellation smoothly. Your set up probably would handle 5760 res with 4xAA fine for games in general, but throw in another extra 4xAA and extreme tessellation would pretty much guarantee to cripple it. May be try running the bench again with 4xAA and slightly lower tesselation?

 

[Yaayuh!]

Is this a GPU or VRAM limitation?

2 x KFA2 GTX 670 EX OC cards in SLI.


API: DirectX 11
Tessellation: Extreme
Shaders: High
Anisotropy: 16x
Anti-aliasing: 8x
Resolution: SYSTEM (5760 x 1080)

Both. You are throwing A LOT at those cards. Ideally to get good results from those settings you'd be needing at least 2x HD7970 or 3x670/680 4Gb cards

 

[Rusty0611]

The stuttering to 0 FPS looks like VRAM especially as you're getting 2046MB VRAM reading. But as above the 7970 is better for benchmarking in Heaven whereas the 680 is generally better for gaming so you're probably hitting a GPU limit in heaven as well.

 

['Wes]

You're asking a lot from those cards.

 

[Inaharry]

Thanks for the feedback. I think I might've worded the question badly. I'm absolutely not expecting Heaven to run smoothly at those settings and I'm very happy with the normal performance of the 670s especially with SLI.

What I was trying to understand was why one stage could move smoothly, (or as smooth as any card could at those settings ) at around 20FPS, but then during the same stage could suddenly plummet to 0-1FPS for a few seconds and then continue the stage normally. I also noticed that when the FPS returned to normal, the scene would suddenly speed up like it was running at 2x speed for a second or two, (a bit like a catch-up). That's why I was wondering whether it was running out of VRAM at those stages and while loading in the next lot of textures, it was having to swap causing the frame drop.

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I don't want anyone to think I'd expect any card on the market to run Heaven at any decent frame rate using those settings, at least not for some time to come....

 

[Rusty0611]

As above - looks like VRAM in that case.

 

[Yaayuh!]

In that case, a sudden drop in frame rates to 0-1fps would indicate lack of VRAM.

 

[bee]

uncheck the multi monitor tick box and try again, also disable visual themes and desktop composition for heaven

 

[Helios1234]

Try playing actual games and see?

 

[andybird123]

uncheck the multi monitor tick box and try again, also disable visual themes and desktop composition for heaven

so your solution to multi monitor performance issues is to not run multi monitor?
genius

 

[Yaayuh!]

so your solution to multi monitor performance issues is to not run multi monitor?
genius

LOL!

 

[Inaharry]

As above - looks like VRAM in that case.

In that case, a sudden drop in frame rates to 0-1fps would indicate lack of VRAM.

Thanks, that seems to make sense.

uncheck the multi monitor tick box and try again, also disable visual themes and desktop composition for heaven

It doesn't do this when running a single 1080p monitor resolution and the maximum memory usage is between 850MB and 1GB which is why I wasn't sure whether it was a lack of VRAM when running multi-monitor or whether the GPUs just didn't have the power to run using multi-monitor at that detail level. Thanks for the suggestion of disabling Aero because I know that frees up around 300MB, so I'll try that tonight to see whether it still drops the FPS or not and also what GPU-Z shows as the maximum memory usage.

Try playing actual games and see?

I have tried some . The reason I'm doing a lot of testing under Heaven isn't for benchmarks, it's more to try and identify the cause of BSODs, game lock-ups and application crashes in Heaven since the cards were installed, particularly when using 3D Vision and odd problems with the 3rd monitor, (attached to the second card) which again, appears sometimes if using 3D Vision. It gives me an easy way to make changes and see if anything is making the instability worse. The cards aren't overclocked, (beyond the KFA2 default OC).

Additionally, I noticed that when I tried Max Payne 3, (couldn't use in 3D because the first attempt corrupted the 3rd screen on the main menu and although the second and third attempts didn't, the game froze within 5 minutes, but this could be a driver issue with 3D Vision Surround and the game because it seemed ok with 3D turned off), when the detail levels were set between a medium to high range and running multi-monitor, it would show that the VRAM required would be around 2.5GB - this is displayed at the bottom of the graphics options menu before applying the changes. A single monitor configuration at the same settings showed well under 2GB. It didn't seem to affect the game with obvious frame drops like Heaven did though.

 

[andybird123]

there was an article written by an EVGA rep who said that the 6** series is better at handling VRAM requirements than previous generations, so a 2GB 6** is equivalent to a 2.5GB 5**... so the guesstimate that max payne shows you might still be sneaking just under the amount of VRAM you need without it too adversely affecting performance, where as heaven is busting through it

 

[bee]

so your solution to multi monitor performance issues is to not run multi monitor?
genius

sorry "genius" but if you had any experience of multi monitor and heaven AT ALL you would know that it runs in triple screen without the box checked aswell and in my case at least leaving the box checked causes it to run horrendously, where as without it checked i average 56fps at 5760 x 1080

so yeah pretty good suggestion if you ask me, thanks for your reply

 

[Gregster]

sorry "genius" but if you had any experience of multi monitor and heaven AT ALL you would know that it runs in triple screen without the box checked aswell and in my case at least leaving the box checked causes it to run horrendously, where as without it checked i average 56fps at 5760 x 1080

so yeah pretty good suggestion if you ask me, thanks for your reply

Good answer and people should know what they are talking about before making stupid comments.

Have you disabled Aero? If you have not, right click the Heaven icon/properties/disable desktop compostition.

This will free up a little VRAM (not sure to how much) but should be enough to put you under your limit. This way you will know if it is VRAM or just grunt that is being hammered.

 

[Rusty0611]

This will free up a little VRAM (not sure to how much) but should be enough to put you under your limit. This way you will know if it is VRAM or just grunt that is being hammered.

150-200MB IIRC

 

[andybird123]

Good answer and people should know what they are talking about before making stupid comments.

so everyone wants the forum to be completely devoid of any humour whatsoever?

and no, I wasn't aware that heaven had a self crippling option box, thankyou for enlightening me

I was asking an honest question, albeit in a slightly sarcastic manner, I see no problem in recieving a sarcastic response

 

[Gregster]

so everyone wants the forum to be completely devoid of any humour whatsoever?

and no, I wasn't aware that heaven had a self crippling option box, thankyou for enlightening me

I was asking an honest question, albeit in a slightly sarcastic manner, I see no problem in recieving a sarcastic response

Sorry for missing the humour...

 

[Inaharry]

Thanks for all of your help and suggestions.

in my case at least leaving the box checked causes it to run horrendously, where as without it checked i average 56fps at 5760 x 1080

Thanks for that tip bee! You're absolutely right. Although my first test from power on completely locked up the system at stage 7 with a black screen(s), (which is one of the problems I'm trying to identify / resolve), with the Multi monitor box ticked, running at 5760 x 1080 and everything at the highest settings, I had these results:

FPS: 15.9
Scores: 400
Min FPS: 2.5
Max FPS: 39.5

Whereas, following your suggestion of leaving that box unticked and using exactly the same settings, not only could I visibly see straight away that it made a difference, but the figures were around double:

FPS: 31.8
Scores: 801
Min FPS: 3.5
Max FPS: 88.0

So, thanks again, it's very much appreciated because I wouldn't have thought about doing that!

Have you disabled Aero? If you have not, right click the Heaven icon/properties/disable desktop compostition.

This will free up a little VRAM (not sure to how much) but should be enough to put you under your limit. This way you will know if it is VRAM or just grunt that is being hammered.

Yes, I disabled Aero, both through Windows and the shortcut properties. Although I could see the current usage drop by around 150MB at the desktop, it didn't affect the maximum memory usage under Heaven - it still showed 2046MB used, so I think it's just taking whatever's available. However, it did increase the Max FPS by around 5-6FPS and increased the overall score by 14.

150-200MB IIRC

That sounds about right. As mentioned above, at the desktop with Aero disabled, the current GPU memory usage was around 76MB. After I enabled Aero again, this immediately went up to 234MB.