Micro four thirds -Lumix GF1 vs Oly EP-1

ashatron · 17 Jan 2010 at 23:43

ive decided to take the plunge and just straight over an advanced compact camera and go for a micro four thirds camera.

Giving me dSLR quality, without the size.

Olympus EP-1 - built in image stabilization, better lens compatibility? no flash, slow focus (1 second), 14-42mm compact zoom lens

Lumix GF1 - quick focus, small pancake lens making it compact (but i think the oly with the 14-42mm lens isnt much bigger), no zoom function at all!

And which lens? EP1's 17mm? or the GF1 20mm??

Your thoughts and recommendations would be helpful, thanks

Mr Jones · 17 Jan 2010 at 23:54

The Olympus E-P1 comes with a free FL-20 flash gun till the end of the month IIRC.
I did have a look a week ago to see what's available and if I do have money to spare, the Olympus E-P1 body (with free Flash) + the Panasonic 20mm f1.7 (nice and bright) would be my choice. The Panny is a great camera but the lack of IS is a big no no for me - especially when any lens that's to come which offers O.I.S. would cost more than an Olympus equivalent.

The body of the Panny is also not compatible with many other lenses due to it's contrast based focusing, where as the Olympus is compatible with ALL m4/3 and 4/3 lenses when matched with the right adaptor. Again, to top it off, the IS in body works with ANY lens attached. Even if it's an Asanuma 100mm f2.8 manual focus lens or a 800m mirror lens. The E-P1 is also selling cheap due to the release of the E-P2 (which you might be interested).

Shoei · 18 Jan 2010 at 08:07

As mentioned umpteen times i went from a D80 to the GF1/20mm combo.
Haven't really looked back since.
Lack of IS doesn't bother since i never had any IS lenses for the D80 any way.
I was after something i can carry round every and the GF1 fits the bill nicely.
Still learning what it can do functions wise.

Try one, you'll be pleasantly surprised.

ashatron · 18 Jan 2010 at 13:44

Thanks guys!

Mr Jones said:
The Olympus E-P1 comes with a free FL-20 flash gun till the end of the month IIRC.
I did have a look a week ago to see what's available and if I do have money to spare, the Olympus E-P1 body (with free Flash) + the Panasonic 20mm f1.7 (nice and bright) would be my choice. The Panny is a great camera but the lack of IS is a big no no for me - especially when any lens that's to come which offers O.I.S. would cost more than an Olympus equivalent.

The body of the Panny is also not compatible with many other lenses due to it's contrast based focusing, where as the Olympus is compatible with ALL m4/3 and 4/3 lenses when matched with the right adaptor. Again, to top it off, the IS in body works with ANY lens attached. Even if it's an Asanuma 100mm f2.8 manual focus lens or a 800m mirror lens. The E-P1 is also selling cheap due to the release of the E-P2 (which you might be interested).

You make very good points, cheers dude. the lens compatibility issues and lack of IS on the GF1 is a massive negative. But wouldn't i have to buy lens adapters for both anyway? if i were to use more lenses? so is it THAT much of an issue?

Ive yet to see how the EP-1 performs with the Pancake 20mm G Vario. i would like to know how it effects the focus times. Focus time being a main drawback on the EP-1.

Shoei said:
As mentioned umpteen times i went from a D80 to the GF1/20mm combo.
Haven't really looked back since.
Lack of IS doesn't bother since i never had any IS lenses for the D80 any way.
I was after something i can carry round every and the GF1 fits the bill nicely.
Still learning what it can do functions wise.

Try one, you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Great! glad to get some feedback from somebody with one!
How do you find the pancake lens? do you miss the zoom function? Does it perform well in low light? Do you have any photos uploaded??

Also the major error ive noticed with the GF1 is that its colours arent great, the EP-1 has much more accurate colours, as seen here -
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/PanasonicGF1/page32.asp

Which pancake lens do you think is better? the 17mm olympus one or the 20mm G vario one?

I could buy a kit and sell the lens that it came with and buy the one i'd rather have.

Thanks guys, its exciting times, nearly got me a new camera?!?!?!!

bigredshark · 18 Jan 2010 at 13:51

Lens wise I'd be tempted by the 20mm as it's significantly faster than the 17mm. I've only handled the E-P1 and it's a lovely camera but I can't face the lack of a view finder myself (otherwise I'd likely have bought one by now). The GF1 is talked about as a superior camera in most respects though.

I'd have the e-p1 if I had to choose one myself but I think both are too much of a compromise compared to an SLR unfortunately.

ashatron · 18 Jan 2010 at 14:10

bigredshark said:
Lens wise I'd be tempted by the 20mm as it's significantly faster than the 17mm. I've only handled the E-P1 and it's a lovely camera but I can't face the lack of a view finder myself (otherwise I'd likely have bought one by now). The GF1 is talked about as a superior camera in most respects though.

I'd have the e-p1 if I had to choose one myself but I think both are too much of a compromise compared to an SLR unfortunately.

Cheers dude!

So then, how limited do you think the micro 4/3rd cameras are compared to an dSLR? What would i be missing out on in buying a GF1/EP-1 instead of an SLR?

Shoei · 18 Jan 2010 at 14:57

ashatron said:
Great! glad to get some feedback from somebody with one!
How do you find the pancake lens? do you miss the zoom function? Does it perform well in low light? Do you have any photos uploaded??
Also the major error ive noticed with the GF1 is that its colours arent great, the EP-1 has much more accurate colours, as seen here -
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/PanasonicGF1/page32.asp

Which pancake lens do you think is better? the 17mm olympus one or the 20mm G vario one?

I could buy a kit and sell the lens that it came with and buy the one i'd rather have.

Thanks guys, its exciting times, nearly got me a new camera?!?!?!!

Ive just got the Panny 20mm, havent seen or tried the olympus 17mm.

Colour wise i tend to shoot RAW + jpg, but only cos the in camera film modes are applied to the RAW and im having fun experimenting with the dynamic B&W film mode.

This is processed from the raw with LR2.5

This is straight from the camera with a crop only. Dynamic B&W film mode.

Its a great camera, you can point at people with out the feeling your invading their space like you some times get when you point a dSLR at them.

As for zoom, i mainly used the 30mm or 18-70 in the D80 so dont miss it to much.

syke · 18 Jan 2010 at 14:59

Just went to have a look at a few cameras, interested in the two you are too. The EP1 with the small zoom lens is definitely not small! Nice camera though. Still undecided now. With the 14-42 (I think?) lens it's still fairly hefty.

ashatron · 18 Jan 2010 at 15:20

Shoei said:
Ive just got the Panny 20mm, havent seen or tried the olympus 17mm.

Colour wise i tend to shoot RAW + jpg, but only cos the in camera film modes are applied to the RAW and im having fun experimenting with the dynamic B&W film mode.

Its a great camera, you can point at people with out the feeling your invading their space like you some times get when you point a dSLR at them.

As for zoom, i mainly used the 30mm or 18-70 in the D80 so dont miss it to much.

Thanks for the images mate!! much appreciated. really nice photos.
i think its safe to say weather i get he EP-1 or GF-1, i should get the 20mm G Vario pancake.

syke said:
Just went to have a look at a few cameras, interested in the two you are too. The EP1 with the small zoom lens is definitely not small! Nice camera though. Still undecided now. With the 14-42 (I think?) lens it's still fairly hefty.

Yeh mate!! join the debate!!

yeh the olympus has the 14-42mm compact zoom or 17mm pancake.
the lumix gf1 has 14-45mm compact zoom or 20mm pancake (G vario)

Im so torn between. I think the better colour on the EP-1 jpegs might clinch it. But ive yet to hold both so that is probably a bigger factor - which feels nicer and more natural to use.

dmsims · 18 Jan 2010 at 15:21

http://www.dpreview.com

bigredshark · 18 Jan 2010 at 15:32

ashatron said:
Cheers dude!

So then, how limited do you think the micro 4/3rd cameras are compared to an dSLR? What would i be missing out on in buying a GF1/EP-1 instead of an SLR?

Well I'm in a slightly different place to you as I have a D200 and expensive glass already, I just wanted something smaller to carry round day to day which was better than a traditional compact.

It wasn't so much the loss of features compared to a DSLR as the feeling it was a bad middle ground. It does have all the features of an entry level SLR (all the ones most people use anyway) but the lack of a viewfinder in combination with the size put me off the handling a bit - holding such a large camera out and looking at the LCD feels odd. It's actually difficult to put into words but having handled it I just wasn't convinced, my heart wanted to buy one because it's a lovely bit of kit but my head just couldn't justify it.

Big pinch of salt because I already have a decent DSLR of course. I can't help thinking though that for the price of the GF1 + 20mm lens you could get a D3000 body and Sigma 30mm lens - two roughly equivalent packages in terms of spec (20mm 4/3s is 40mm equiv, 30mm DX is 45mm equiv) and I think the SLR kit is going to handle better and give you more use.

Other things to note, the e-p1 screen isn't as good as the GF1 I hear (I believe the GF1 is higher res). How easy using either will be in direct sunlight is questionable.

The e-p1 has some good art modes though, I have a friend who shoots loads with it's built in 'grainy b&w film' mode and it looks great straight off the camera.

End of the day my opinion is slightly skewed because what I actually want it a Leica M9 without spending £4k

I'd say in reflection it's not sufficiently better than, say, the Canon S90 to justify it's price (or size for that matter) and not quite good enough handling and flexibility wise to compete with an SLR. I wish it was but for me it just isn't.

IMO of course, your mileage may vary and all other caveats. Both are lovely camera's but I wouldn't spent my own money on them as it stands.

syke · 18 Jan 2010 at 15:51

ashatron said:
Yeh mate!! join the debate!!

yeh the olympus has the 14-42mm compact zoom or 17mm pancake.
the lumix gf1 has 14-45mm compact zoom or 20mm pancake (G vario)

Im so torn between. I think the better colour on the EP-1 jpegs might clinch it. But ive yet to hold both so that is probably a bigger factor - which feels nicer and more natural to use.

Definitely go see them both, I hadn't looked at them in person, and was thinking they were very similar size wise, but they're not.

ashatron · 18 Jan 2010 at 16:03

syke said:
Definitely go see them both, I hadn't looked at them in person, and was thinking they were very similar size wise, but they're not.

oooooooooooo which is bigger?? do tell!!
or have i missed interpreted you and you have yet to see them?? :O

found this, image stabilization on the EP-1 looks great -
http://www.photographyblog.com/reviews/olympus_ep1_review/image_quality/

the GF1 has no image stabilization, it must be built into the lenses. i dont think the kit lenses have any image stabilization built in also.

ashatron · 18 Jan 2010 at 16:04

bigredshark said:
IMO of course, your mileage may vary and all other caveats. Both are lovely camera's but I wouldn't spent my own money on them as it stands.

Cheers for all the help mate!

Mr Jones · 18 Jan 2010 at 16:05

IMO, the IS is very important if you're going to be using the video function often. It really helps with the shakes, even at 40mm.

ashatron · 18 Jan 2010 at 17:12

Mr Jones said:
IMO, the IS is very important if you're going to be using the video function often. It really helps with the shakes, even at 40mm.

V V good point.

What do you think of the HD quality between the GF1 and EP-1?
The GF1 has HD AVCHD, but i dont actually know how much better that is...
seen here - http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/DMCGF1/DMCGF1VIDEO.HTM

i also realised i threw out your nuggets of knowledge as my own, just a minute ago! -

ashatron said:
the GF1 has no image stabilization, it must be built into the lenses. i dont think the kit lenses have any image stabilization built in also.

sorry lol, all truth though!

Mr Jones · 18 Jan 2010 at 17:20

No worries dude, I also learnt that from watching the reviews on camera labs.
I personally would stick the video with motion JPEG, much easier to edit. Have you tried editing AVCHD? I tried it and it's heavy on the CPU!

I really should go have a hands on these 2 camera this weekend - just worried I'd like it and then buy one! (Not likely come to think of it, viewfinder is VERY important for me and no matter how good LV is or EVF from the E-P2, nothing beats a good clear mirror for now.)

Shoei · 18 Jan 2010 at 18:15

Only the 20mm and 7-14mm are with out IS, all the rest of the lenses have IS.
14-140 is optimised for shooting video. The autofocus has been quietened down so it cant be heard from the microphone.

I changed as using a dSLR was becoming painfull due to weight. The GF1 is so much easier to handle.
Tend not to find myself holding it out at arms length like most people using compacts, to much shaking.
Its the fact i can carry it everywhere, never did that with the D80.

Deo_volente · 18 Jan 2010 at 18:27

this is the exact same question i have been pondering over for the last week or two.

seems that some of the pana lenses do have IS called mega O.I.S although from looking at panasonics website it doesnt seem to be on the 7-14 or 20mm.

price wise the best i have seen is £531.99 for pen with 14-42 and £549.99 for GF-1 with 14-45.

still,none of the above really helps with my decision between the two :confused:

ashatron · 18 Jan 2010 at 18:34

Shoei said:
Only the 20mm and 7-14mm are with out IS, all the rest of the lenses have IS.

Cool, cheers dude.

Shoei, how do you find the flash on the GF1?
Its a big factor in deciding between the two, but id like to know if it is just put there to tick a box on a specification sheet, or if it is actually any good.

The additional flash for the EP-1 is very expensive, but it appears to be a more serious flash.

I can imagine i would only use it in the evenings having a meal with friends etc, when im just wanting general night shots, not ones for photography purposes.

Also would you miss your flash it if it was gone?

Check this out!!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/markosaar/3850499099/
Ep-1 Is going to work, how truthful it is, i dont know.

Mr Jones said:
I personally would stick the video with motion JPEG, much easier to edit. Have you tried editing AVCHD? I tried it and it's heavy on the CPU!

great point! the motion jpeg is still great quality isnt it?
i would burn to DVD anyway, puresly pc screen based viewing.

Mr Jones said:
(Not likely come to think of it, viewfinder is VERY important for me and no matter how good LV is or EVF from the E-P2, nothing beats a good clear mirror for now.)

i can totally see that point