Monitor Upgrade... Samsung S27A950D

RedvGreen · 4 Sep 2011 at 14:23

I currently have an ever-dimming HP LP2475W Monitor which has seen me well over 4yrs.

I am considering upgrading to 27", however am also tempted by a 3D screen.

Since I have an ATI 6990 card this limits my choices to basically the Samsung range as the Acer's utilise Nvidia 3D Glasses which is antithesis of ATI.

My concerns however are:

1. Brightness - My current monitor is 400cd/m and I find it dim at times (due to failing parts no doubt). The Samsung range of monitors are only 300cd/m. Having played on a mate's 23" Samsung, when 3D is being used, the monitor darkens significantly.

2. Resolution - My current 24" monitor is at 1920x1200, the 27" Samsung monitors are at 1920x1080. This essentially means small resolution therefore less pixels and less detail over what I am currently experiencing on a smaller monitor?

3. Display concerns - On the whole, the reviews for the 27" 950D are positive, but every so often there are folks who complain of ghosting and input lag.

4. Glossy Screen - I have several glossy laptops but my main desktop has always been the dull surfaced matte screen. Are there any serious issues with reflections?

clippa · 4 Sep 2011 at 16:39

There are massive issues with reflections.
Don't know about 3d ghosting but the response time of the 950 on "fastest" overdrive settings is brilliant, pretty much the only good thing about the monitor.
1080p at 27" is surprisingly good, I was expecting it to look naff but no, it looks great, you'll have no problems there. Going from 16:10 to 16:9 on the other hand is a downgrade, you will notice it and you will miss the screen real estate. Takes some getting used to.
I wouldn't worry about the brightness, it's plenty bright enough and you won't have it anywhere near 100% brightness unless you constantly wear shades.
Input lag is too high, in my opinion, but everyone's threshold is different. If you're a serious gamer and you notice things like input lag (the fact that you mention it at all shows that it's a concern), this monitor will be no good to you.
There are other issues with the monitor that you haven't touched upon, it has backlight bleeding, bad screen uniformity and washed out colours. When buying a new monitor recently, I had 5 different monitors that went back to the shops I bought them from, the samsung, out of them all was the worst by far.

It's starting to look like I have a vendetta against samsung here

I don't, their monitors are usually brilliant, it's just that I've had this model and want to let you know because it's a hell of a lot of money to be throwing at tat.

PCM2 · 4 Sep 2011 at 17:41

Casting everyone's mind back to Clippa's early impressions here - http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18279602&highlight=username_clippa&page=18 (pay particular attention to pages 18 and 19 and also my responses to Clippa) it seems that it was decided that his unit was a duffer. He seemed increasingly sure of this as further user experiences ran contrary to his own. I am not one to talk as I still haven't got around to testing the S27A950D or S27A750D (thanks, Samsung!) but if it is anything like the T27A950D when it comes to colour reproduction (and it's highly likely that it is) then I have no doubt whatsoever that Clippa got a broken or at the very least rotten egg. Other user impressions and discussions I have had through my own website also affirm this deep suspicion. He may be onto something regarding input lag (everyone does indeed have different thresholds and I haven't seen any accurate measurements of this on the Samsungs yet) but I know as a seasoned monitor reviewer that that certain factors which displease you about a monitor can easily cause everything else to become blown out of proportion. This is especially true as you try to affirm in your own mind that you are absolutely disgusted with a product and will send it back - especially the case with something as expensive as this. It is quite clear that a glossy screen was a poor choice in Clippa's viewing environment.

I have provided a T27A950D review on my website (click my name for a link if you must) which compares the Ultra Clear panel of the 950 series to other 'typcial' glossy anti-reflective screens. It does a much better job but you certainly have to be more particular about the lighting conditions - still hoping to add the 750 series to the comparison shortly. If the SA950 is anything like the TA950 when it comes to colour reproduction then as somebody with a lot of experience in this I absolutely outright reject Clippa's criticism regarding 'washed out colours' as applying as a blanket to the majority of SA950 units. We have established his view of this as a lack of distinction between colour shades rather than a lack of vibrancy - which can confuse a lot of people as they take 'washed out' to mean drab and dull. The TA950 was anything but and showed outstanding shade distinctions for a TN panel monitor - and I should know, I've tested hundreds. But as explored in the calibration section it did take quite a bit of fiddling about with the settings - in particular contrast, gamma mode, and colour balance. This was made easier by a well-trained eye and various measuring devices. Again, I doubt the SA950 is any different in this regard and a well set up 'good' unit in an appropriately lit room should provide a very pleasing gaming experience indeed. It's only a matter of time now before I get my hands on the S27A750 for a completely unbiased and thorough review - so I can hope bring some closure to this for many people, either way.

clippa · 4 Sep 2011 at 20:13

I don't want this to turn into an argument, so I'll just defend myself, give my opinion and leave it there. We'll agree to differ. I'd imagine the poster is none the wiser and we're not really helping him decide

"He seemed increasingly sure of this as further user experiences ran contrary to his own."

To be brutally honest, no, I don't think I did get a duff unit, when a lot people are telling you that you do, it's far easier to just go with the flow. I don't have the time to sit here and argue with a whole forum

I would effectively have to call them all liars for starters.

The flaws like the highly reflective screen, banding, high gamma and high input lag are there on every unit, it just depends on whether you notice them or they effect you.
When it comes to sidelight bleeding and screen uniformity, of course it's the luck of the draw, there will be sidelight bleeding on every unit of this monitor to some degree because of the technology used, and the uniformity will always be off, again, partly because of the sidelighting.
I actually think I was dealt a good hand in this department, it could have been far far worse, so if anything, no, I didn't get a duff unit, I got a good, well above average example of the monitor and as you know, you can only review the monitor you're given and it would be a waste of time for your site if they were cherry picked and perfect.

"certain factors which displease you about a monitor can easily cause everything else to become blown out of proportion"

No, I've said before that I have no vested interest either way and I'm very honest, I'll talk about the good and the bad points of a monitor without any bias whatsoever.
I admit that input lag is very high on the agenda for me, I'm very sensitive to it and it's the thing that is most important to me when choosing a monitor which I will, not predominantly, but most importantly use for gaming.
and I'll admit that if a monitor has high input lag then, yes, if everything else is great about it, then it still would be no good to me but I'd be brutally honest about that.
I'd say, this monitor is amazing in every regard but it's sadly let down by the high input lag. There's no way I'd start finding faults that weren't there and I'm a little insulted that you would accuse me of that.

The response time of the samsung was brilliant, way better than the monitor I'm currently using which can get quite blurry when the action gets fast. but without the low input lag to back it up, it's just window dressing.

I'm using the lg w2363d now for example, look at my review here

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=19762647&postcount=19

The cons outweigh the pros, I freely admit that this monitor is not great but, weighing everything up, making compromises, for me, for my personal needs, it's the best of the monitors that I've tried.
Until something better is on the market, it'll do me fine.

"It is quite clear that a glossy screen was a poor choice in Clippa's viewing environment."

No, this isn't correct. I talked about using the monitor at night, with the curtains drawn, I had to even turn my dim overhead light off or I was still getting distracting reflections in dark colours.
The screen is unbelievably reflective, no matter what your lighting is like. The only way of having no reflections is to literally only use it at night in pitch black darkness with no lights on at all.
of course whether you notice reflection or find them distracting is another thing entirely, again, I can only talk about my own experience and opinions.
I'll admit, I hate glossy screens. This monitor was sold to me as having an "ultraclear" screen coating that would be halfway between glossy and matte and have all the benefits of both.
I was very very shocked when I saw the first picture of the monitor, it is the most reflective glossy screen I have ever seen.

To clarify, I didn't notice that this monitor had high input lag and then start talking myself into sending it back. The monitor performed poorly in almost every department, that's why it went back.

"We have established his view of this as a lack of distinction between colour shades rather than a lack of vibrancy"

One can establish what one likes

The banding on this monitor was already too high, correcting the gamma via software to give deeper colours would introduce even more banding. A 500 quid monitor should have a default gamma of 2.2, no matter what type of panel it is, it should at the very least allow you to adjust the gamma via the osd.
Like I said, this monitor performed badly in every department. I hooked up my cheap 5 year old 245b alongside it to compare, the monitor I was upgrading from. It was a downgrade in every way possible.

Out of the five monitors I tried when buying a new one, this was the bottom of the pile, like I've said, it'd be overpriced at £150.

PCM2 · 4 Sep 2011 at 21:32

I was really trying to address the main issue you raised (in my mind) which was colour reproduction as a whole. This seemed to be where a lot of your understandable negativity seemed to stem from - 'washed out colours'. So you are now saying that your unit was just fine and they are all like that despite your clear indications to the contrary in the other thread? :confused:

Actually it is quite conceivable from what you've said - banding, gamma issues, colour, that your unit was not set up well and/or was a bad unit. The weight of evidence from other users and your own thoughts (no hiding them now) suggest that you did get a poor unit. You shouldn't have to do any software-based adjustments and if you are doing this without using a colorimeter you are likely compromising the image quality further. Even with a colorimeter the misinterpeting of ICC profiles makes this less than ideal as far as gaming concerned. When I do get around to reviewing the S27A750/950D alongside some other keen eyes I will certainly be able to assess your thoughts - there is nothing wrong with being particular but I am experienced enough to know that in all likelyhood a good SA950 that is set up properly is an excellent monitor by any TN panel standards.

I'm sorry if this sounds a bit boorish and self-righteous. I'm still quite knackered and jetlagged from my travels so my brain's not quite in gear. If these monitors really are that different to the T27A950 then I would be beyond surprised. I and some other experienced individuals compared this with others against various reference standards pretty damn comprehensively including a visual comparison with very well calibrated high-end CRTs, VA panels and the U2412M. And if they really are that different then sobeit. I'll have some harsh words with Samsung and buy you a beer.

clippa · 4 Sep 2011 at 21:58

Like I say, I don't want to have a to and fro about it, you're clearly experienced in reviewing monitors and know a lot more than me. I could well be wrong and may have received a faulty monitor. I don't think that I did and overclockers said that it wasn't faulty and refused to replace it if that counts for anything.
I'm on the wagon, but thanks for the offer

I did take a few comments personally and probably shouldn't have. No hard feeling mate

PCM2 · 4 Sep 2011 at 22:11

clippa said:
I could well be wrong and may have received a faulty monitor. I don't think that I did and overclockers said that it wasn't faulty and refused to replace it if that counts for anything.

It doesn't really count for anything - that's sod's law with buying monitors.

Unless there is something really obvious as a fault (like the thing not turning on or huge lines across the screen) retailers will almost always insist there is nothing wrong. Even if 9/10 monitors of a given monitor were actually 'better' they wouldn't claim anything was wrong as they don't want to be losing their money unless it's totally necessary. As I say - nothing personal against OcUK either it's pretty standard across the industry. I remember reviewing an XL2410T that everyone was really keen on - I couldn't help but be flabbergasted by how poor the image quality was. I obviously had to balance this out with its good points - but then I had people breathing down my neck as lots of shining reviews came through that ran contrary to everything I'd seen myself. Equally I had a shining example of an EW2420 when many others got much rustier units.

A bit of a lucky dip which BenQ seem no stranger to.

clippa said:
I'm on the wagon, but thanks for the offer I did take a few comments personally and probably shouldn't have. No hard feeling mate

Nah I understand why. I even ended up editing my post a bit because even reading some of it back to myself made me cringe.

In truth it is all partly because I am annoyed with having not been able to test this monitor myself yet. I am seriously considering buying one, doing a relatively quick review and playing the DSR card. If the manufacturers or their PR teams aren't giving the goods I am usually able to source monitors through 'favours' from people I know in retail. This one isn't currently available through that route either.

clippa · 4 Sep 2011 at 22:16

I wouldn't order from here then, you might get the one I returned

I'd certainly be interested in reading your review if you ever get hold of one.
The glossy screen and input lag is enough for me not to buy one again but I'd be interested to see if I did actually get a bad egg as far as image quality is concerned.

PakJai · 4 Sep 2011 at 22:54

To get a better overall idea of this panel, you may want to take a look into this thread:

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18279602

RedvGreen · 5 Sep 2011 at 02:24

Ah, I see it doesn't work with the HD6990 card. That's killed that idea then!!