NAS Drive Reccomendations

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I'm also on the hunt for a decent NAS drive.

It will basically be used for storage, which will then back up to the cloud. Ideally, not wanting to spend more than £400, can push it a little further if it really is worth it.

Synology still the way to go?
 
I switched from Synology to QNAP as you get more CPU grunt for your money and IMO better built boxes. I do however think the Synology OS is a little bit slicker. You wouldn't go wrong with either.

Or build a HP microserver with unraid.
 
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That has a half decent CPU in it for the price. Usually with Synology you'll get an ARM chip which is good for file sharing but no serious usage such as Plex etc.
 
beware of HP microserver as most of the cheapy ones have 4TB drive limit. the ones that can handle 8TB drives are enterprise grade and are expensive.

build you own is a great option, you have have a PC with semi decent processor virtualised to do firewall/media server/network backup server/download server etc and all of that can be individual machines which means you are not putting all the eggs in one basket in terms of security. but the flaw of this is that if the machine that hosts the VM fails then all of you servers are down.

also if you are going to get a NAS box from Synology or QNAP make sure you get a CPU that is 64bit. otherwise the max raid strip will be limited to 16TB only.
 
beware of HP microserver as most of the cheapy ones have 4TB drive limit. the ones that can handle 8TB drives are enterprise grade and are expensive.

build you own is a great option, you have have a PC with semi decent processor virtualised to do firewall/media server/network backup server/download server etc and all of that can be individual machines which means you are not putting all the eggs in one basket in terms of security. but the flaw of this is that if the machine that hosts the VM fails then all of you servers are down.

also if you are going to get a NAS box from Synology or QNAP make sure you get a CPU that is 64bit. otherwise the max raid strip will be limited to 16TB only.

Probably want to do some fact checking...

1. I run 8TB drives in an N54L and N36L, you won't find anything lower than an N36L, it's the first gen Microserver and cost me under £90 all in after cash back.

2. Virtualisation is great, but host security is generally not its strong point, pointless having a secure VM if it's stupidly easy to break host security.

3. Vt-d and iommu support is kind of important for a virtualised environment on a self build if you actually want to pass hardware direct to the VM. Generally K series CPU's lack Vt-d as intel views overclocking and virtualisation as mutually exclusive (unless you're willing to pay more for an X CPU) and IOMMU support as well as Vt-d is hit and miss on consumer grade boards, Supermicro is the usual choice, Asrock if you're cheap, Asus not so much, despite its historic links to Asrock. AMD IOMMU support just got better with the latest update from AMD, but it's not suitable for a production environment (says the man with a Ryzen 1700/32GB on an Asus motherboard - feel free to laugh).

4. Array size is not a CPU limit on Synology, it's a software limitation afaik. Synology have some questionable software practices where hardware capabilities are ignored in favour of company policy - hardware that it's company policy to EoL may be more capable than hardware currently being sold, but it won't be given a DSM upgrade once it's timed out, paid or otherwise.
 
Probably want to do some fact checking...

1. I run 8TB drives in an N54L and N36L, you won't find anything lower than an N36L, it's the first gen Microserver and cost me under £90 all in after cash back.

2. Virtualisation is great, but host security is generally not its strong point, pointless having a secure VM if it's stupidly easy to break host security.

3. Vt-d and iommu support is kind of important for a virtualised environment on a self build if you actually want to pass hardware direct to the VM. Generally K series CPU's lack Vt-d as intel views overclocking and virtualisation as mutually exclusive (unless you're willing to pay more for an X CPU) and IOMMU support as well as Vt-d is hit and miss on consumer grade boards, Supermicro is the usual choice, Asrock if you're cheap, Asus not so much, despite its historic links to Asrock. AMD IOMMU support just got better with the latest update from AMD, but it's not suitable for a production environment (says the man with a Ryzen 1700/32GB on an Asus motherboard - feel free to laugh).

4. Array size is not a CPU limit on Synology, it's a software limitation afaik. Synology have some questionable software practices where hardware capabilities are ignored in favour of company policy - hardware that it's company policy to EoL may be more capable than hardware currently being sold, but it won't be given a DSM upgrade once it's timed out, paid or otherwise.

Not sure how you managed to get 8TB disks in there but the following is direct from spec sheet of HP N54L

"Internal Drive Support: o 4 Internal HDD Support o Maximum internal SATA storage capacity of up to 8.0TB (4 x 2TB 3.5" SATA drives)"

You can get 8TB but not 4 lots of 8TB i.e. 32TB or any combination of raid setup

I didn't specify k cpus you would better off old gen Xeon or even pentium CPUs that are specific as servers for virtualized environment. So no need to be pedantic.

I agree with your assessment on security but a VM firewall should be as secure as a dedicated firewall that firewall will be the first port of call for any hack. So host system's security setup follows that. Its fair common practice.

On array size, it is dependant on the CPU. On qnap arm chips arent equipped with 64bit environment meaning the total raid stripe is limited to 16tb. I suspect Synology will have similar issue. Some qnap systems do have x64 CPU and the QTS system supports more than 16TB strip.

Fact checking done. Thank you.
 
"Internal Drive Support: o 4 Internal HDD Support o Maximum internal SATA storage capacity of up to 8.0TB (4 x 2TB 3.5" SATA drives)"

You can get 8TB but not 4 lots of 8TB i.e. 32TB or any combination of raid setup

Spec sheet says one thing but reality is another thing. I have an N54L using 3x3TB drives with no messing needed. Just connected and worked.

Your fact checking needs to move further than spec sheets.
 
Not sure how you managed to get 8TB disks in there but the following is direct from spec sheet of HP N54L

"Internal Drive Support: o 4 Internal HDD Support o Maximum internal SATA storage capacity of up to 8.0TB (4 x 2TB 3.5" SATA drives)"

You can get 8TB but not 4 lots of 8TB i.e. 32TB or any combination of raid setup

I didn't specify k cpus you would better off old gen Xeon or even pentium CPUs that are specific as servers for virtualized environment. So no need to be pedantic.

I agree with your assessment on security but a VM firewall should be as secure as a dedicated firewall that firewall will be the first port of call for any hack. So host system's security setup follows that. Its fair common practice.

On array size, it is dependant on the CPU. On qnap arm chips arent equipped with 64bit environment meaning the total raid stripe is limited to 16tb. I suspect Synology will have similar issue. Some qnap systems do have x64 CPU and the QTS system supports more than 16TB strip.

Fact checking done. Thank you.

You call that done :D

If by pedantic, you mean I pointed out you were wrong, shouldn't be offering incorrect advice on a platform you clearly have no direct experience with, then yea, I'll take that. Once you get over the 2TB limit then it's rare you'll encounter a hardware limit on drive size that isn't down to software, simply put HP won't devote resources to HCL'ing current gen hardware on a previous hardware generation it stopped selling two generations ago (Microservers skipped Gen9) at the time 2TB drives were about as big as it got - people have been using 3TB drives in them since 3TB drives launched, I currently have 6x2TB and 1x128GB SSD inside an N36L, according to the spec sheet that's not supported either, my N54L is running 8TB drives and yes I really do know the difference between a drive and an array.

As to the processor point, do you even English? I wasn't being pedantic, I provided a general overview of what was required and why. You didn't qualify your statement with Xeon, or for that matter 'old Xeon's' let alone Pentiums (the 4 series 46x0 are nice efficient little chips that support vt-d/x/ECC/HT and nice low TDP), if you suggest a self build, then have the sense to make sure that you qualify it with the basic requirements, which brings us on to 'old Xeon's'.

Power hungry, hot, inefficient and noisy are the terms I associate with 'old Xeon's', ex corp. pulls generally don't make for a good choice for a home user unless you're hard of hearing, need to heat a room/house, don't pay for your power or generally don't like life. 1366 or newer is about the limit, anything else in the current UK market rarely hits a low enough price point to make any real sense, even if it did they're not home friendly. LGA 2011 boards are relatively cheap, Xeon v2/3 (the latter being LGA2011-3) chips are reasonably priced and they run cooler/have much better long term prospects.

Firewall wise virtualisation is considered bad. It'll work, but it's not best practice or 'fair practice' as you state. Home users do it, production environments generally don't.

As to Synology (I did specifically qualify my statement by mentioning them), the CPU architecture isn't the reason for the array size limit they impose. It's a legacy software limit which should be removed in the next major DSM release. Qnap wise, the humble Marvel 5182 in the entry level kit is ARM 64 based, that would suggest it's instruction set is not the issue, it being prehistoric in the world of ARM is a different matter.
 
So the QNAP Seems fine for what i need it to do.

Only question i have is:

I have it sat next to my PC in my bedroom at the moment and the router is downstairs. Its connected Via Ethernet to a Switch, which is then connected to a Powerline. The powerline at the other end goes straight into the Router.

Speeds are slow, copying from the NAS to my Laptop is roughly 2MB/s.

Is there anyway of speeding this up without having to move the NAS so it next to the router?
 
File copy on two devices connected to the same switch ignores the router, if your switch (or either device) is 100mbit then your maximum theoretical transfer speed over a single link is 12.5mb/s, gigabit can support up to 125mb/s.

2mb/s is slow, the kind of slow you normally only see if you are doing multiple reads/writes at the same time or have a poor link between them. That said you mention laptop, are you using a wired connection to the same switch for the laptop? If it's connected via wifi then that's the furst thing I'd change.
 
Here's the setup

Router -> Powerline -> Switch -> Nas

The laptop i'm using is connected to the main router via WIFI. To be fair, i was copying a lot of files at once, folders that contained files that were a couple of KB too. The laptop itself doesn't have a LAN port, i did try a USB to LAN adapter but the results where the same.

The switch is a Gigabit.
 
Wifi and small file sizes is a bad combo, try connecting via a wired gigabit connection to the switch on a suitable device for maximum throughput.
 
Wifi and small file sizes is a bad combo, try connecting via a wired gigabit connection to the switch on a suitable device for maximum throughput.

that is poor advise as your previous statements. if people are limited to wifi access to their devices why asking them to have gigabit link. horses for courses.
Spec sheet says one thing but reality is another thing. I have an N54L using 3x3TB drives with no messing needed. Just connected and worked.

Your fact checking needs to move further than spec sheets.
I did. i actually asked the HP guy over the phone and they said it was limited to 2TB and I wasn't going to get a piece of hardware just to find out.

to OP, using wifi to transfer files will have speed issues such as what your wifi sync rate is and if your hardwares are the latest AC.

if you are running A/B/G wireless then your maximum speed is going to be very limited. if you run N it is a little bit better but it really depends on the reception. I had AC1900 router and AC1200 dongle and that can sync and transfer at 30MB/s but soon as you start trying to go through a couple of walls the rate drops. typically i had 10MB/s

also on qnap i believe there is a limit the device can write to the disks (depend on your HDD setup - raid).

But i think your slow speed is mostly down to a) poor wifi sync b) small files (small files more seek time involves)
 
I did. i actually asked the HP guy over the phone and they said it was limited to 2TB and I wasn't going to get a piece of hardware just to find out.

Absolute twaddle. So to answer an Internet forum question you phoned the manufacturer to check the specification and confirm the technical documentation?

I know you'll answer yes but I won't believe that either.
 
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