Need help with GTX 570 SLI overheat issue

[phil777776]

Hi. I'm having an overheating problem since I've set up a GTX 570 configuration. I've put this question to another forum and gotten zero replies so far, so I'm hoping the OCUKers will show prove they know their stuff But seriously, I'd just appreciate some advice from anyone who has an informed opinion as to what my best options are from here.

In short, I'm getting critical overheating on gpu intensive games to the point that the PC either reboots or the screens goes black and the system hangs. I'm certain the problem is due to my motherboard (asus P6X58D-E here ) which has the only two usable PCIe 2.0 slots so close together that the first gtx 570 has no space to draw air in for cooling the card (it has a third slot, but stupidly it's unusable as critical board slots become blocked if I put the 570 in). If I swap the cards, the same thing happens so it's not either card, definitely just the lack of space/airflow affecting the card in the first slot. I've measured the temps as rising to over 102 degrees after about 5 to 10 mins of gameplay before the system crashes, and have read that these cards shouldn't run over 97 degrees max so that's absolutely what's going wrong as far as I'm concerned.

I have a Cooler Master Wave Master case ( here ) and really have no understanding of how good/suitable the cooling is as it stands and whether it can be improved enough to compensate for the poor motherboard sli slot design. I have run the same game benchmark with the side case off and a 7" desk fan blowing directly onto the two GPUs, with all fans on 100% and the temp of the first card rises to and fluctuates between 97 and 98 degrees (the second card is usually at least 10 to 20 degrees cooler as it has enough space to draw air in) What I'm curious about is if I cut into my case side and install one or two decent intake fans right over the GPUs, is that realistically going to be sufficient to cool things down, or would I be wasting my time. Would such a setup be better or worse than the test environment 'desktop fan'? In my head, I reason that it needs to be better than the test environment or it wouldn't be worthwhile as the 97/98 degrees seem too close to the max temperature for the card, so unless I can be certain of setting up some case fans that will drop the temps down to at least sub 95 degrees it won't work.

The thing is, I've just spent a lot of money and pretty much my entire budget on what would be the perfect setup for my needs. I have a new 1920x1080 120Hz monitor, Nvidia 3d kit, and the 570 sli was to ensure 3d gaming frame rates remained high on high settings, and it works perfectly until the GPU overheats. It's frustrating to have spent so much money and be so close to what I want, and I'd hate to be faced with replacing my mobo as it's less than 6 months old, and I can't afford the cost of a new one.

So from my limited research, this is what I think my options are, and how realistic they are. I'd appreciate any advice on whether there are additional options, or whether my assessments are off.

1. Replace the mobo to one where the PCIe 2.0 slot are further apart. Cost of this is realistically out of reach until maybe Xmas and so something I'd prefer to avoid.
2. Install extra case fans over the GPUs. I think I could afford this, and my father in law would be well capable of modding the case side. Don't know if it would work though, and would hate to have spent the extra and gone to the trouble to find it didn't work, so would need to be certain this would solve the problem before I'd go ahead.
3. Water cooling. Know nothing about this, but it always strikes me as expensive and trickier to install than I'd be comfortable with. I really don't see this one as an option unless someone can really prove my concerns are unfounded.
4. Sell the two 570s and buy a 590. I think I'd probably end up making a notable loss on the 570s and then have to shell out further on the 590. Also, while I'm not an expert, I think I've read that 570 SLI is better performing than a single 590, so again the thought of spending extra to 'downgrade' is not something I'd be comfortable with.
5. Sell a single 570 and accept that I'll have to run games at lower settings if I want to play them in 3d. Would be frustrating if I have to do this.

As this is my first post here, I apologise if this is in the wrong place or I've been unaware of any commonly accepted posting guidlines. If I can provide more info to help your recommendations, just let me know.

TIA

Phil

 

[Surveyor]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

One possibility would be to try and push he cards as far apart as possible to try and give the top card a bit of room to breathe.

Push the top card up as high as the rear bracket will permit and push the bottom card as far down as the bracket will permit. I've seen some people then use a sort of wedge to ease the cards apart particularly towards the rear as this tends to be where they come closest together without the brackets to hold them.

Using an internal fan to blow cooler air between the cards, once you've got a bit of a gap, can then help.

A lot of people use the Antec Spoot Cool or you can try and rig up your own solution.

 

[mp260767]

could try a bit of a ghetto mod and setup a 120/140mm fan to push air down between the gap of the 2 cards feeding the one thats blocked off.

might not be cool air, but at least if its getting an air flow that should help cooling.

the link for the case says it has dual 80mm front fans,have you got 2 fans fitted ?

 

[robin66]

could try a bit of a ghetto mod and setup a 120/140mm fan to push air down between the gap of the 2 cards feeding the one thats blocked off.

might not be cool air, but at least if its getting an air flow that should help cooling.

the link for the case says it has dual 80mm front fans,have you got 2 fans fitted ?

I'd try the above advice, and maybe look at adding one of these when stock is back in. http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=HS-007-AN&groupid=701&catid=57&subcat=399

Cheap and should make a difference to your temps.

 

[Diggsy]

I would bet that airflow within the case is the biggest issue here tbh.

Your case has 2 x 80mm intake fans. Is there any way to mod it to allow you to replace these with 120mm fans for a little more airflow? Also, it has an 80mm exhaust fan, which I would seriously doubt is anywhere near enough to deal with the heat dump within.

Personally I wouldn't bother with adding side fans. I've done this before and it made little to no difference.

I would suggest that a new, more modern case with better airflow would help a hell of a lot.

If you don't want to spend on a case (which I think you need to) then all you can do is make the best of what you have, but bottom line is you will not improve the cooling performance much in a cramped case with poor airflow.

Things you can do if you're not changing the case...

Cables - get as many of them out of the way of airflow within, tie them off with cable ties where possible.

HDD's - where are they installed? Are they between the intake fans and the GPU's? If so, try to move them up top into the 5.25" bays, out of the way of the airflow, or as near as possible.

Intake fan - you could ghetto mod a 120 / 140mm fan on the motherboard side of the drive bays (attach it with cable ties or something) and have it blowing air straight at and in between your GPU's.

But all of these suggestions will only make minimal differences really. I know from experience as I tried to run an 8800GTX setup in a Jeantech Phong case - complete disaster, ended up selling one of the cards as I just couldn't keep them cool enough.

EDIT - can we see a couple of pics of the inside of your case?

 

[robin66]

I was going for a low cost alternate, but I have to agree with Diggsy also, a new case will make a big difference to cooling everything inside your case, not just your graphics cards.

But then that will cost more and thats something you weren't keen on.

 

[phil777776]

Really appreciate the number of replies I've gotten already. Taking the suggestions in order ...

Pushing Cards apart: I think they are as far apart as the brackets will allow, but I'll recheck this evening. At this moment in time, they cards sit about 2-4mm apart due to the size of the fan casing on the top card. I've never considered trying to wedge them apart, but if it's something that can be done without damaging the cards, I'll try it, thanks.

Antec Spot Cools: I've not seen those before but I can see how they would likely help alright, so thanks for the suggestion. My question (as touched on by mp260767) is whether blowing hot air around would be cooling enough for the extreme temps I'm dealing with?

Existing front case fans: They are there alright. I don't really notice them as drawing in significant airflow though. My guess is it's sufficient intake generally, but not enough air is getting in between the cards when they are stressed and it wont as the gap between fans and cards is too far.

As there seems to be a fair amount of 'fan experience', would modding the case side to install an intake fan directly over the GPUs definitely work well in conjuction with say the Spotcools? I'd be happy to go that route if someone had prior succesful experience which fans lowering similar temps significantly. I guess what I'm asking is, how realistic is a 10 degree temp drop if I place fans suitably? The open cased desk fan test dropped temps by about 5 degrees, but was that solution better or worse than the ones I'm looking at implementing? I have no benchmark for what to expect from fans, and so I don't know if I'm expecting too much asking for at least a 10 degree drop.

Just seen Diggsy's response ...

I was curious about whether I needed to upgrade the front fans myself. At this moment in time, I don't know if it's possible as the front fans are not easy to access without dismantling the entire case.

I do think it's likely the case isn't helping, but I feared the proximity of the GPUs was the key factor and even if I got an airy new case, I still would be no better off and still be faced with replacing the mobo, or ditching SLI. Regarding your queries about my current case ...

Cables: I've tried to tidy them, but in the cramped case they are certainly affecting airflow.

HDDs: I had 2 disks between fans and gpus alright, but I moved one up as you suggested and left the other out for now. It didn't seem to make a huge difference.

Ghetto Mod Intake Fan: This seems to be my best bet for a cheap solution. Would something like this be one suitable to try? Not saying I think that's best, but just the first one I saw that seemed to match my interpretation.

I'll deffo post pictures seeing as the interest is there. I'll try get them up tonight or else tomorrow.

Thanks again,

Phil

 

[mp260767]

RMy question (as touched on by mp260767) is whether blowing hot air around would be cooling enough for the extreme temps I'm dealing with?

the way i look at it, is as long as the air being used is cooler than the parts its trying to cool it will help.

if you were looking at a side case fan on i'd also look at running a duct/funnel from the fan to just above the gfx cards to focus the air flow.

also have a look for fan adapters, will allow you to use a 120mm fan in place of your 80mm if you can fit them in your case.

 

[phil777776]

the way i look at it, is as long as the air being used is cooler than the parts its trying to cool it will help.

if you were looking at a side case fan on i'd also look at running a duct/funnel from the fan to just above the gfx cards to focus the air flow.

also have a look for fan adapters, will allow you to use a 120mm fan in place of your 80mm if you can fit them in your case.

Sounds reasonable. I'll keep all of that in mind, thanks.

Two extra questions to throw into the mix.

1. I have an old dvd drive that I'm not using sitting in the case as I didn't have a blanking plate handy and thought it best to leave it there to prevent dust entering. Is that the right thing to do, or would an open drive bay actually assist air flow in my situation?

2. What cases would be suitable if my attempts for a cheap fix fail? I may consider a purchase with xmas money if it appears a new case is my only option.

Thanks again

 

[Virt]

2. What cases would be suitable if my attempts for a cheap fix fail? I may consider a purchase with xmas money if it appears a new case is my only option.

Thanks again

Hi phil.

I have a GTX 570 sli setup, and I'm using an Antec 1200 case. The highest temperature I've seen my top graphics card reach is 72 celsius, while playing Bad Company 2 on the highest settings.

I can vouch for that case

Edit:

I imagine the Cooler Master HAF X would be a good choice too. Plenty of room to route cables, and tons of cooling.

 

[Surveyor]

Hi phil.

I have a GTX 570 sli setup, and I'm using an Antec 1200 case. The highest temperature I've seen my top graphics card reach is 72 celsius, while playing Bad Company 2 on the highest settings.

Just as important though what motherboard are you using?

It might have better spacing of the PCI-E slots than the OP's.

 

[robin66]

Yeah about £200 to £300 I'd guess on a good case and motherboard, then all your heat issues should go away. Better over all air flow, and better spacing on the cards.

Just one thing, not sure if you mentioned this, but have you tried both cards on there own, as in tested each card signally in your case. Just incase the card in question has a fault of some sort?

 

[phil777776]

Yeah about £200 to £300 I'd guess on a good case and motherboard, then all your heat issues should go away. Better over all air flow, and better spacing on the cards.

Just one thing, not sure if you mentioned this, but have you tried both cards on there own, as in tested each card signally in your case. Just incase the card in question has a fault of some sort?

Sadly, there's no way I can justify spending that much extra on my setup even if I can find the cash. I had a budget, I've blown it and now I'm trying to get it working as cheaply as possible. I appreciate that a new case and mobo would sort me, but I just can't afford that solution. I *think* I may be able to stretch to about £100 around xmas but only if I knew it was going to fix it once and for all. If there was significant doubt, I probably wouldn't risk it, and maybe I'd just sell one 570 and give up on SLI.

And apologies, I thought I had indicated originally that each card works fine on their own. No over heating occurs to the point where the system shuts down or anything like that. The problem is always the top card overheating even when i swap them. I doubt it matters much but my 'benchmark' app has been Witcher 2 with settings maxed and 3d enabled. Everything running great until the card overheats and the system dies or reboots. I tried running FIFA 12 on high with 3d and while the temps get high it doesn't overheat. I expect that's just cause W2 puts more stress on the GPUs, but correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[ChrisGTL]

Any pics of inside your case for us to look at? Might give us some better ideas.

 

[Diggsy]

Take some good pics of the internals from several different angles, as this will really help making suggestions to you.

I am fairly sure you will be able to get rid of those crappy 80mm intakes and get something with a little more muscle in there, then ghetto mod another just before the GPU's, hence creating a nice wind tunnel effect.

You might as well give replacing one or two fans a shot and see if it helps much. If it doesn't, nothing much lost as you can use them in any new case you get

Will keep an eye out for the pics later and try to help out when I see them.

Oh, and to try and answer your q's above, the DVD drive is prob not making much difference. It would be better out and a blanking plate there, but since you don't have one, leave as is for now.

EDIT - one other thing, please list your full system specs, including model and wattage of PSU.

 

[phil777776]

Take some good pics of the internals from several different angles, as this will really help making suggestions to you.


EDIT - one other thing, please list your full system specs, including model and wattage of PSU.

I'll take a few pics either later tonight or tomorrow. If there are specific angles anybody wants to make sure they see, let me know.

You have my mobo, case and gpu details, my CPU is an i7-965, PSU is Corsair GS800 , Memory is 2 x 4GB Patriot DDR3 but I can't be more specific off the top of my head. Do you want drive specifics? Anything else?

 

[Diggsy]

I'll take a few pics either later tonight or tomorrow. If there are specific angles anybody wants to make sure they see, let me know.

You have my mobo, case and gpu details, my CPU is an i7-965, PSU is Corsair GS800 , Memory is 2 x 4GB Patriot DDR3 but I can't be more specific off the top of my head. Do you want drive specifics? Anything else?

Nah, that should be enough for now, will wait for the pics before commenting further.

Take some shots looking directly in, looking towards the rear, looking towards the front, and if possible, a close up of the intake fans and how they attach.

 

[phil777776]

Possibly not the reply anyone was expecting but I think it's worth updating as follows.

Took a chance and went to a PC component shop on the way home and picked up two artic f12 fans to see if they would help. I also discovered when i got home that I was able to part the cards some more at the bracket side, gaining 3-4mm and now the smallest gap was 10mm. I also wedged a thumbscrew between the cards to the front and managed to widen the gap to 20mm there (still 10mm close to the brackets). I then placed the f12 literally on top (tower on its side) of the gpus, and ran TW2 like that with the case side off (so all the heat was rising straight out) and all fans on 100%. Success! temps in the high 70s! Fans set to auto and the temps rose to a safe low 80s. However if I put the case side back on, temps rose significantly again to mid to high 90s. This was pretty eye opening for me. It meant that as has been suggested in this thread, a better case would help tremendously and ultimately the mobo isn't quite the problem.

Now I expect I could spend 'x' amount on fans and ghetto mod things to a degree where I would manage with what I have, but I'm currently thinking instead would I be better off investing a bit more and getting a low-mid range case with better 'natural' airflow. I would still likely need to 'wedge' the cards as I have done but reducing temps would be much less of a struggle.

I noted today that in the shop they had a Xigmatek Midgard, and Antec Six Hundred, both on sale, and if I returned the fans I bought today, thanks to my wonderfully understanding wife, I could part exchange for one of those cases tomorrow. As things stand, unless I purchase tomorrow, I wouldn't have time swap out components again for a week or two, so its VERY tempting to just take the plunge, but I only want to do that if one of the cases would really help the cooling situation. So I have two blunt questions.

1. would either of those cases offer the type of cooling improvement over my current case that would be worthwhile. Please note, I can't really afford the type of case that's been recommended on here (Antec 1200).

2. Is wedging the GPUs apart an extra 10mm ok? It's not forcing anything on either the cards or the mobo? I didn't have to use a crowbar to put in the thumbscrew or anything, but is that size of 'wedge' ok for a permanent solution if it proves to be necessary?

I'm expecting a lot, but if I could get opinions before 10am tomorrow, it would be fantastic, as that's the latest I could go and pick up the case and then spend the day swapping everything over and testing.

Finally apologies but I don't have time to take and upload pics this evening. I'm sorry if that makes giving advice more difficult.

 

[Diggsy]

Good to hear you've came to your senses about the case.

Now, to answer your questions....

1 - If those 2 cases really are your only options then out of the 2 I would go for the Xigmatek. Review here btw... http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Xigmatek/Midgard/

The main thing that bothers me about it, and to be fair it's the same for both, is that the front intake fan will be largely restricted by the HDD bays.

That said, there is a space for a fan on the side panel directly above the GPU's, and also one on the floor directly below them, which would probably help a lot.

And it appears to me that the HDD rack is held in with rivets so I guess if all else failed you could always remove it.

One other thing is it appears not too great for cable management, but if you take your time and make good use of some cable ties, I am sure it is workable.

The main thing though is that it is a lot more spacious than your current case, and it has lots of options for airflow - 7 fan spaces from what I can see!!

2 - I would doubt that will cause any problems, just be sure not to put any undue strain on the PCB, and DO NOT use anything conductive!!! Make sure whatever you are using is plastic, as anything metal is risking a short.

Good luck, and let us know what you choose, and how you get on

 

[Havana_UK]

Personally I would spend the money on a more expensive case. A good case is a really worthwhile investment, and since everything is standardised from a size perspective (no matter what happens with CPU sockets and the latest graphics cards etc) a good case will last you years and years through many upgrades.