network powerline questions

firehawk · 8 Nov 2013 at 10:26

Hi all.

given my current living situation and circumstances, I have to make do with things.

I have a room which will have my main computer. I also have a wireless router of mine.

in another room is the cable modem which is also wireless. I don't want to use that router due to features etc... and because I do a lot of technical stuff, my own router is set up the way it needs to be.

there is no way I can move the cable modem into my room unless it get rewired.

I was thinking of using a network powerline adapter which:

- will plug into the room which has the cable modem
- will plug into the room where my computer is and have that plugged into the wireless router I have

the main computer must be wired so that will be plugged into my wireless router in the room.

questions:

how fast are these network powerline adapters in comparison to a direct wired connection to the router?
how secure are they?
which is recommended?
what about interference?

HeX · 8 Nov 2013 at 12:08

I find them to be great.

I've got 4 of the TP-LINK 200mbps adaptors in my house, they all average around 170-190mbps (half-duplex). With the slowest being on the end of a 5m power cable reel.

Ping on all devices is as if they were on a normal ethernet wired network.

Security wise they all have built in hardware 128bit encryption that is set up automatically, or you can manually configure through the powerline software.

I'd reccomend the TP-LINK adaptors, i've got them in my house, and i've set up powerline networking in a few of my relatives houses using them, and they've all been a doddle and solid as a rock. You can pick up a pair of the Nano 200mpbs ones for under £20.

As for interference, the only big 'no no' is don't plug them into surge protectors. The surge protectors filter out what they think is 'noise' which is actually your network data, and so you either won't get a connection or you'll get severely degraded performance. I've not experienced any other interference. My furthest adaptor is in a cupboard under the stairs which we converted to the wifes office, so it's at the opposite side of the house from the router, then at the end of a 5m reel, and it's still 170mpbs+.

firehawk · 8 Nov 2013 at 12:33

So should they always be plugged in the mains rather than the extension power cables? I just wonder how much it can download from the internet compared to directly wiring the Ethernet cables to the computer from the modem.

in comparison, if it were wired to the modem and using the powerlink adapters, what is the difference in speed?

Orcvader · 8 Nov 2013 at 17:23

You can find the TP-LINK TL-PA411KIT for around £20 as well, which is a pair of 500mb homeplugs. As for speed compared to ethernet, it heavily depends on the quality of the wiring in your home and as mentioned, the extensions used.

I have mine on an extension on both ends due to the lack of power sockets, but it syncs fast enough to give me the maximum Virgin Media 60mb speed. I'm not sure how fast they're syncing together though as the TP-Link software doesn't seem to be compatible with Windows 8.

HecFam · 8 Nov 2013 at 17:30

If you're happy to pay the premium, you can get Powerline adapters with built in wireless, i installed a devolo kit recently, i think it cost about £70. Gave good wifi speeds also.

The virgin download speed was 30mbs, and a speed test from the powerline wifi gave out a solid 28/29, so there isn't a great loss. It was also configurable from a random app on my phone which was different i suppose, but easy.

You can always string together adapters as well, can add another down the line. As long as your internal wiring is alright, you shouldn't drop much at all.

firehawk · 8 Nov 2013 at 17:56

Thanks.

IM going to pickup the netgear 500mbps which has the piggy back socket.

Not a fan of Netgear but lets see

Phreaky · 8 Nov 2013 at 18:08

HeX said:
I find them to be great.

I've got 4 of the TP-LINK 200mbps adaptors in my house, they all average around 170-190mbps (half-duplex). With the slowest being on the end of a 5m power cable reel.

Ping on all devices is as if they were on a normal ethernet wired network.

Security wise they all have built in hardware 128bit encryption that is set up automatically, or you can manually configure through the powerline software.

I'd reccomend the TP-LINK adaptors, i've got them in my house, and i've set up powerline networking in a few of my relatives houses using them, and they've all been a doddle and solid as a rock. You can pick up a pair of the Nano 200mpbs ones for under £20.

As for interference, the only big 'no no' is don't plug them into surge protectors. The surge protectors filter out what they think is 'noise' which is actually your network data, and so you either won't get a connection or you'll get severely degraded performance. I've not experienced any other interference. My furthest adaptor is in a cupboard under the stairs which we converted to the wifes office, so it's at the opposite side of the house from the router, then at the end of a 5m reel, and it's still 170mpbs+.

Its physically impossible to get those speeds on 200mbit adapters, especially given they only have 100mbit ethernet ports, and could only achieve 'perfect' throughput in completely unrealistic lab scenarios. The average max attainable is between 30-40mbit (Homeplug AV standard)

Please don't give people advice if you don't understand what you are talking about.

firehawk · 8 Nov 2013 at 18:16

this is the one I will be picking up shortly:

http://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/netwo...-500-mbps-powerline-adapter-13212955-pdt.html

bledd · 8 Nov 2013 at 19:27

Phreaky said:
Its physically impossible to get those speeds on 200mbit adapters, especially given they only have 100mbit ethernet ports, and could only achieve 'perfect' throughput in completely unrealistic lab scenarios. The average max attainable is between 30-40mbit (Homeplug AV standard)

Please don't give people advice if you don't understand what you are talking about.

Indeed, use lanspeedtest to get a real speed reading.

http://www.totusoft.com/lanspeed1.html

neodude · 8 Nov 2013 at 20:33

Phreaky said:
Its physically impossible to get those speeds on 200mbit adapters, especially given they only have 100mbit ethernet ports, and could only achieve 'perfect' throughput in completely unrealistic lab scenarios. The average max attainable is between 30-40mbit (Homeplug AV standard)

Please don't give people advice if you don't understand what you are talking about.

What he said.

(With the slight exception that mbit ≠ Mbit

)

Orcvader · 8 Nov 2013 at 20:46

firehawk said:
this is the one I will be picking up shortly:
snip

Remove the link, it's a competitor and goes against forum rules. Also, it says:

Single adapter

For nearly £90, you're only getting one adapter. You need two for this to work.

If you really want a pair of 500mb with the extra power socket, consider these: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=NW-071-TP&groupid=46&catid=1604

The very same TP-Link kit is cheaper on the rainforest as well (search TL-PA551KIT).

You'll be saving money and getting two adapters compared to the purple shirt people.

HeX · 9 Nov 2013 at 18:28

Phreaky said:
Its physically impossible to get those speeds on 200mbit adapters, especially given they only have 100mbit ethernet ports, and could only achieve 'perfect' throughput in completely unrealistic lab scenarios. The average max attainable is between 30-40mbit (Homeplug AV standard)

Please don't give people advice if you don't understand what you are talking about.

That is the internal sync speed given in the TP Link software. I didn't just pluck a number from my anus. They are 200mbps internal, half duplex.

I've just plugged the netbook into a random socket upstairs and this is what I get:

The wife's PC reads 11mbps because it's turned off, but usually sits at the same 170mbps-ish internal sync speed.

And I'm certainly getting much higher than 30-40mbps, taking I am on 60mbps with Virgin and get the max download speed attainable through powerline.

I'm giving advice based on actually using them, right now... but hey, carry on.

firehawk · 9 Nov 2013 at 18:39

Orcvader said:
Remove the link, it's a competitor and goes against forum rules. Also, it says:

For nearly £90, you're only getting one adapter. You need two for this to work.

If you really want a pair of 500mb with the extra power socket, consider these: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=NW-071-TP&groupid=46&catid=1604

The very same TP-Link kit is cheaper on the rainforest as well (search TL-PA551KIT).

You'll be saving money and getting two adapters compared to the purple shirt people.

my apologies about the link.

well i bought it. it DOES came with 2 - not 1.
I just literally plugged it in... and works nicely.

Amp34 · 9 Nov 2013 at 21:13

HeX said:
That is the internal sync speed given in the TP Link software. I didn't just pluck a number from my anus. They are 200mbps internal, half duplex.

I've just plugged the netbook into a random socket upstairs and this is what I get:

The wife's PC reads 11mbps because it's turned off, but usually sits at the same 170mbps-ish internal sync speed.

And I'm certainly getting much higher than 30-40mbps, taking I am on 60mbps with Virgin and get the max download speed attainable through powerline.

I'm giving advice based on actually using them, right now... but hey, carry on.

That's not the speed you're actually getting though, that's the sync speed. Chop that by a third and that's about the throughput you'll actually get.

For example I've just set up a triple Powerline system and get 337Mbps and ~150-190Mbps. I can transfer at 10MB/s with the 337Mbps synced unit and about 5MB/s with the one syncing at ~150-190mbps. As another example I was playing around with the second one today and it halved my internet speed (BT Infinity at 38Mbps) when connected through a Powerline connected at ~150Mbps, as soon as the router was connected by an ethernet cable it shot back up to 38Mbps.

I have to say I got the TPLink 500 GBit powerline adaptors and am very disappointed. At max theoretical speeds you're only looking at around 150Mbps (15MB/s) transfer speeds and I'm not even getting that on the fastest one. This houses wiring appears to be abysmal as so far the only connection I've got about 200Mbps is the 337MBps connection on the other side of the house, all the other sockets give me connections between 50Mbps and about 200Mbps (at best), even ones in the same room as the computer with the Powerline software.

So to the OP, yeah, its ok but don't expect miracles, even with the Gigabit Powerline adaptors (which come with Cat 5 cable by the way, not even Cat 5e), it may very well not even give you full speed internet it its reasonably fast and your wiring isn't perfect.

Sighn · 10 Nov 2013 at 04:06

^ That's unfortunate.

I'd have thought the whole point of the plug's sync speed is to make sure it far exceeds 100Mbs to avoid impacting a 100mbs-based network.

My 200Mbs Devolo kit allowed existing plugs on different sides of the house: one upstairs connected to a network switch and the other downstairs connected to a router. Synced at 150-170mbs, they always allowed full use of the 100mbs Ethernet standard with transfers from computer to computer being over 12MBs.

The only minor drawback I saw is the added latency of 3ms and sync is half duplex by nature. There's also the price (Devolo), although at the time I bought mine they were pretty much an industry secret and were very cheap compared to now.

Spudgun · 10 Nov 2013 at 09:26

Sighn said:
^ That's unfortunate.

I'd have thought the whole point of the plug's sync speed is to make sure it far exceeds 100Mbs to avoid impacting a 100mbs-based network.

My 200Mbs Devolo kit allowed existing plugs on different sides of the house: one upstairs connected to a network switch and the other downstairs connected to a router. Synced at 150-170mbs, they always allowed full use of the 100mbs Ethernet standard with transfers from computer to computer being over 12MBs.

The only minor drawback I saw is the added latency of 3ms and sync is half duplex by nature. There's also the price (Devolo), although at the time I bought mine they were pretty much an industry secret and were very cheap compared to now.

My experience of my devolo AV200 homeplugs is identical to this. They sync between 175 and 185 and I can send files from my PC upstairs to my xbox downstairs at 100Mbs (12 meg a second) which is right at the limit of the port on both the xbox and the homeplug, so the 30-40 Mbs maximum crowd are most certainly wrong.

I too see some small additional latency of 2ms as i've tested speeds pings via ethernet cable and via the homeplugs, but I can live with a small delay like this