New build estates - why?

[Mekrel]

I was prompted to start this thread due to an article on the BBC regarding legislation to ban the sale of new leasehold properties.

There are a fair few comments from people moaning about the fact they have freehold homes, but still pay a service charge for upkeep of communal areas (and this practice needs to be stopped). Usually these are new estates where the council are not adopting the road or communal areas such as children's play areas. Some are saying "we should get a discount on our council tax".

I've never really understood the attraction to such estates?

I appreciate not every new estate is the same, but in general what I've found is
* You have a cookie cutter home
* A tiny garden, overlooked by other closely packed houses
* Pay a service charge that can spiral out of control
* Typically pay a premium (builders tax, they bank ~3 years of future house price growth)
* I understand the premium comes with a benefit of warranty, but there's stories of NHBC not being worth the paper it's written on

A friend of mine bought a house on such an estate and part of his service charge is the provision of a parking enforcement agency. What surprises me about this is the estate is literally in the middle of nowhere and each house has a big enough drive to park two cars and there's visitor parking lay-bys. I can understand if there's a train station, retail centre or offices near by and you need to discourage people using the estate as a car park.

Am I missing something here? Why don't developers just build the houses without all these landscaped areas that need maintaining? I appreciate the councils probably don't help as I believe sometimes they stipulate that retail, community and play spaces have to be included to grant the planning application.

 

[Mekrel]

Here we go.

What makes you say that? It's a genuine question and not an antagonistic one.

It seems strange to buy freehold, but have one of the downsides of leasehold.

 

[Mekrel]

Basically it comes down to local councils wanting the council tax revenue from the houses but none of the responsibility.

They make it a part of the planning process that they are or responsible for the communal spaces they require as part of the development and pass the Barton to the owners to deal with it. This isn’t a new thing but as you say, it’s a growing phenomenon and it’s an obvious was for the council to grow its revenue base but not its cost base. Job jobbed for a council who are basically broke like pretty much all of them are.

It's strange councils are so broke considering the number of these developments. Most seem to be claiming it's due to adult social care being passed onto them from the government? I appreciate there's some individual cases such as bad investments (was it Thurrock that invested in solar farms that were essentially a scam?)

Our council's (Bucks County) state doesn't seem to add up. It's £300m in debt but becoming a Unitary council was supposed to save costs...

 

[Mekrel]

I would have needed £300k more to buy somewhere more established, so I ended up on this estate through lack of choice/money. Presumably it's the same reason for everyone else.

I'd advise people against new builds for all the reasons you state and then some, I could rant all day about it. I'm lucky to have a freehold house and no service charge, but other houses on the same estate do, think it varies by developer.

Not saying you did it, but I guess HTB only being available on new builds meant people could easier access those properties and get a lower LTV as a result.

 

[Mekrel]

Because there are many reasons people buy a new build, and quite often they don’t have the choice to buy an older property. The charges are unfortunately something which is unavoidable at present the government intervene.

Genuine question (regarding the choice comment), but aren't older properties cheaper due to the markup on new builds? I assume HTB has finished, but do developers offer other incentives on new builds such as covering stamp duty?

 

[Mekrel]

As said, when granting planning the councils set a number of things, the house balance (social, 2 bed 3 bed 4 bed etc) things like parking restrictions, they refuse to fully adopt but don't give a rebate for the services they aren't providing.
(IMO they should withdraw these services from all if they cannot provide to all, none are statutory duties)
Adult care and removal of the block grant are the issue, nothing else has the ability to affect materially the balance for councils.

New builds have always had a bad rep since I can remember and yet 1980s new builds are very different from todays new builds.
I have lived in houses covering just about every decade from 1890s to 2010s and there is no perfect decade of houses, they all come with their challenges and stuff that sux.

Absolutely regarding your last point. My leasehold flat was poorly built (small independent developer), the house we bought is very well built as we're only the third owners, the first owner was a builder and built the house himself (I guess with contractors he knew/trusted).

Despite that, we have come across some bodge job repairs! I noticed the boiler flow and return are the wrong way around and the engineer who came to service it pointed out it must have been installed by the second owners, as the inspection date during production was 2019 or something like that.

 

[Mekrel]

Would you like to live in a concrete jungle with no open green spaces which are created by said landscaped areas you mention above?

Well the answer would be no, hence why I don't live in a city and I live in the Chiltern AONB.

However, I don't see how these landscaped areas are that beneficial? There's so many houses in one area, with the layout being optimised for # of properties, that you're surrounded by other houses more than greenery.

I don't see housing estates that are saying 30 years old with landscaped open spaces or children's parks in the middle of them. Perhaps councils are forcing these new estates to have mini parks in them as local ones become saturated as population grows.

 

[Mekrel]

There is so much contradiction in the above post its hard to know where to start.

You dont want to live in a concrete jungle. I think it would be fair to say that most people would want the same. Yet, in the next sentence you fail to see what benefits that open, landscaped areas within modern developments will have. So which is it? Have them as concrete jungles with no open areas, which people don't want, or have some open areas for people to relax in?

As for housing estates from 30 years ago not having open spaces/children's parks etc - Would it be fair to say that developers have learned that the concrete jungle estates you describe are not ideal hence why they changed to having open spaces within them?


Is it possible that, given you live in an AONB, you may have a bit of a blind spot in this discussion?

It's not contradictory at all, because a tiny bit of greenery in the middle of a densely populated housing estate isn't comparable to living in the country side. Especially when you've got to pay an uncapped service charge to maintain it.

I'm not sure why you keep referring to the only choices as open space and concrete jungle? Concrete jungles to me are cities, but there's also urban based houses on B roads that have perfectly adequate front lawns and drive ways that are a far cry from "concrete jungles".

No blind spot here. Intact I used to live on a Taylor Wimpey estate that used to be an old RAF base, but was occupied by the Americans before it closed. As a result, there was plenty of green spaces where the baseball and American football pitches were, and a kids playground and outdoor fitness area (that never opened within the two years I was the after the council u-turned on adopting it) and other spots of green spaces.

So I have experience of living in an urban area, on a new build housing estate and in a hamlet in the countryside. I found living on a 400 home housing was like living on top of other people, no matter if there were patches of greenery here and there.

I had sympathy for those who were annoyed by the council's U-turn and the resulting request to add maintenance of the play/fitness area to the service charge.

For reference:
I don't consider this to be a concrete jungle, it has no open green space near by and you're not packed in like a sardine.