New Champions League format next year - thoughts?

[Tombstone]

I might be a bit behind the curve on this but only just found out what the new format is for the Champions League from next year.

"For those that qualify for the group stage, an entirely new format will be awaiting them.

Instead of eight groups consisting of four teams, there will now be one league containing all 36 teams.

Each team will play 10 different teams across their games with five being at home and the other five away from home.

The top eight sides will automatically qualify for the round of 16 knockout stage."

Whats your thoughts on that? Sort of sound a little bit like a nod toward the Super League idea that some teams wanted a few years ago?

 

[Bigpig]

Does this new format affect the other two European comps? Or are they getting a mini revamped?

 

[bingham67]

Interesting format with a league its also two extra games being played then the normal.

 

[bazzabear]

How can a league format be fair if each team only plays 10 of the other 35 teams?

Presumably this is just a way of making sure the big teams don't play each other until later, and the minnows get sent home as early as possible?

 

[lemming3k]

Does this new format affect the other two European comps? Or are they getting a mini revamped?

To my knowledge the others are staying the same(for now). The 8 teams that lose the knockouts will drop down as usual.
Additionally teams that don't qualify via league position can still qualify as high co-efficient teams that missed out. In other words, big teams will never miss out on the champions league ever again.

It's beyond all ideas of fairness on so many levels and an obvious excuse to backdoor a superleague. It deserves to fail. Hard.

I'm sure my not watching it will just be a drop in the ocean though.

 

[lemming3k]

How can a league format be fair if each team only plays 10 of the other 35 teams?

Presumably this is just a way of making sure the big teams don't play each other until later, and the minnows get sent home as early as possible?

Pretty much. It will be seeded and there's less chance of a big team failing over 10 matches than over 6.

 

[BaZ87]

How can a league format be fair if each team only plays 10 of the other 35 teams?

Presumably this is just a way of making sure the big teams don't play each other until later, and the minnows get sent home as early as possible?

The bigger League format will probably result in a greater chance of the big boys qualifying as there's more games to get themselves out of trouble but this set-up should actually result in more bigger matches. Instead of the current system where there are 8 groups of 4 teams, there will now be 4 groups of 9 teams but the points will be collated in a single 36 team League table.

This set-up has been created so that there's more guaranteed games for everybody (this is as much to do with the smaller nations as the bigger ones) and to revamp what's typically a boring group stage of the CL.

Additionally teams that don't qualify via league position can still qualify as high co-efficient teams that missed out. In other words, big teams will never miss out on the champions league ever again.

It's beyond all ideas of fairness on so many levels and an obvious excuse to backdoor a superleague. It deserves to fail. Hard.

I'm sure my not watching it will just be a drop in the ocean though.

This is completely incorrect. Of the 4 extra spots created by this new set-up, one spot is going to the qualifying rounds for small nations, one spot is going to the 3rd place side in the 5th highest ranked league (who would normally only get 2 spots) and the other 2 spot will go to the Leagues that perform best in the preceding season. So for example if the PL were one of the top 2 performing Leagues then 5th place would qualify for the CL.

 

[lemming3k]

This is completely incorrect. Of the 4 extra spots created by this new set-up, one spot is going to the qualifying rounds for small nations, one spot is going to the 3rd place side in the 5th highest ranked league (who would normally only get 2 spots) and the other 2 spot will go to the Leagues that perform best in the preceding season. So for example if the PL were one of the top 2 performing Leagues then 5th place would qualify for the CL.

Sounds like they've changed it (again) then as that was definitely the initial proposal. Does it really change that much though when the top 2 leagues are almost certainly going to be England and Spain/Italy? The 5th ranked league is also highly likely to be from France or Germany most years with the odd appearance from Portugal or Netherlands.
They changed from 10 games to 8 a while back but seems they've also now removed the Europa drop down. Wouldn't count on it staying this way for long though once a big team actually experiences it.

Throwing one small club a bone isn't going to hide that this is really about the big teams making more money. If that doesn't happen then expect further reforms so it does.

 

[BaZ87]

Sounds like they've changed it (again) then as that was definitely the initial proposal. Does it really change that much though when the top 2 leagues are almost certainly going to be England and Spain/Italy? The 5th ranked league is also highly likely to be from France or Germany most years with the odd appearance from Portugal or Netherlands.
They changed from 10 games to 8 a while back but seems they've also now removed the Europa drop down. Wouldn't count on it staying this way for long though once a big team actually experiences it.

Throwing one small club a bone isn't going to hide that this is really about the big teams making more money. If that doesn't happen then expect further reforms so it does.

It changed about 2-3 years ago and it does change much because it's not going to the highest ranked clubs but to the League so for example if x finished 6th but were the highest ranked side outside of the CL, they wouldn't qualify, it would go to the side who finished 5th.

And you're wrong again about the money point. The change has been done the generate more money for the CL through more and (hopefully) higher quality group stage games and as I said, this change is driven as much by the smaller nations as the bigger ones*. And the way money is going to be distributed will be more performance related that season and a smaller pot for the coefficient payments than we have now.

*There was an interview with the head of the Polish Leagues (or one of the eastern european leagues) on a podcast I listen to a couple of years back and he pointed out that European tv money is far more important for smaller nations than it is the larger nations so having those extra games is much more important for them.

 

[henry hoov3r]

Martin Keown won’t be happy.

 

[lemming3k]

It changed about 2-3 years ago and it does change much because it's not going to the highest ranked clubs but to the League so for example if x finished 6th but were the highest ranked side outside of the CL, they wouldn't qualify, it would go to the side who finished 5th.

It's an improvement over giving it to the clubs sure, but in practice it won't change much since it's rare that a top 6 club doesn't finish 5th. If you think it's designed as anything other than a reprieve for the big boys than you're in for a big disappointment.

And you're wrong again about the money point. The change has been done the generate more money for the CL through more and (hopefully) higher quality group stage games and as I said, this change is driven as much by the smaller nations as the bigger ones*. And the way money is going to be distributed will be more performance related that season and a smaller pot for the coefficient payments than we have now.

*There was an interview with the head of the Polish Leagues (or one of the eastern european leagues) on a podcast I listen to a couple of years back and he pointed out that European tv money is far more important for smaller nations than it is the larger nations so having those extra games is much more important for them.

You've fallen hook, line, and sinker for the UEFA rhetoric I'm afraid. Of course small teams will see some incidental benefit - nobody is saying they won't and it's big money they can't afford to turn down. But you're kidding yourself if you think that was ever the actual intention of this plan.
As you pointed out, 75% of the new places are going to the big 5 leagues, with 50% to the top 2. They could easily have given the 4 places to smaller leagues if they wanted them to take a greater share. Instead even more is going to the bigger leagues and teams. They could even have given more of the current places to smaller leagues if it was about giving them more money. Simply put it's designed so big teams play each other earlier (which gives those teams money, not the Polish teams btw) and when (not if) teams like Utd, Liverpool, Barca etc have a bad season and finish 5th, they won't lose out on the champions league money the following year.

Wouldn't be surprised if after 3 years they reinstate the Europa league drop down when some of the big teams get shocked in the 9-24 playoff round and can't afford to lose out on the extra money.

 

[BaZ87]

It's an improvement over giving it to the clubs sure, but in practice it won't change much since it's rare that a top 6 club doesn't finish 5th. If you think it's designed as anything other than a reprieve for the big boys than you're in for a big disappointment.



You've fallen hook, line, and sinker for the UEFA rhetoric I'm afraid. Of course small teams will see some incidental benefit - nobody is saying they won't and it's big money they can't afford to turn down. But you're kidding yourself if you think that was ever the actual intention of this plan.
As you pointed out, 75% of the new places are going to the big 5 leagues, with 50% to the top 2. They could easily have given the 4 places to smaller leagues if they wanted them to take a greater share. Instead even more is going to the bigger leagues and teams. They could even have given more of the current places to smaller leagues if it was about giving them more money. Simply put it's designed so big teams play each other earlier (which gives those teams money, not the Polish teams btw) and when (not if) teams like Utd, Liverpool, Barca etc have a bad season and finish 5th, they won't lose out on the champions league money the following year.

Wouldn't be surprised if after 3 years they reinstate the Europa league drop down when some of the big teams get shocked in the 9-24 playoff round and can't afford to lose out on the extra money.

With the greatest of respect, you've made numerous factually incorrect statements on the new format, showing you don't really know what you're talking about so you're probably best looking closer to home in regards to falling hook, line and sinker to rhetoric.

Regardless of what intentions there were, there will be a more equitable distribution of prize money than before, there will be more games between the bigger sides than before and the extra places won't simply go to the biggest sides. You've made all these statements (or replied to those asking the question) and you were wrong on every count.

 

[opethdisciple]

Terrible idea.

 

[sigma]

Martin Keown won’t be happy.

Martin Kemp might be happy.

 

[Fubsy]

I suppose it makes it more of a Champions (lol) League than currently.

Best change of recent years was the stupid away goals. It's made the tournament way more interesting.

 

[adam cool dude]

I think the new system is a lot better and will result in more big matches.

Lets face it Champions League has been a weak competition for a good 5 years now.

 

[lemming3k]

With the greatest of respect, you've made numerous factually incorrect statements on the new format, showing you don't really know what you're talking about so you're probably best looking closer to home in regards to falling hook, line and sinker to rhetoric.

Regardless of what intentions there were, there will be a more equitable distribution of prize money than before, there will be more games between the bigger sides than before and the extra places won't simply go to the biggest sides. You've made all these statements (or replied to those asking the question) and you were wrong on every count.

I already accepted some info was out of date since the many changes UEFA have made over the years, it doesn't change the rest of the facts which you already agreed with.

Unfortunately we've seen all too well over recent years if people want to be swayed by false promises then nothing can be said to change their minds. Good luck with it.

 

[HangTime]

How can a league format be fair if each team only plays 10 of the other 35 teams?

That was my default reaction as well but I suppose the whole tournament has never been 'fair' in the sense that whether you progress through the rounds depends heavily on whom you are drawn against.
I think the key mental hurdle you need to overcome is thinking of it as a "league". It's basically a big pool of teams trying to qualify for the next round based on matches against various opponents, some times will get easier fixtures than others - just as it is today.
I think the challenges will come in scenarios where you have teams tied on points/GD etc where there wasn't a H2H match or if there was it was drawn. Does someone get knocked out based on the fact that some system says they had easier fixtures or whatever?

Personally, I like the variety it will bring, playing 10 different teams instead of 3 or 4 (I'm assuming there will be fewer playoff rounds).