Next Gen Xbox to have Fusion Bulldozer variant APU?

An Exception · 21 Jul 2011 at 18:33

"We reported earlier this month in our "E3 Rumors on Next Generation Console Hardware" article that Microsoft's next-gen Xbox would likely be sporting a new IBM cell processor, although we did suggest that was not written in stone. We are hearing this week that AMD has very likely locked up the whole shebang with a Fusion Bulldozer variant APU. This of course will be a huge win for AMD."

http://www.hardocp.com/news/2011/07/20/next_generation_console_hardware_update/

If the rumour of this as well as AMD being the GPU of choice for all next gen consoles turns out to be true, then this is a HUGE win for AMD.

Also if the below post is true, this may be a HUGE win for PC gaming as a whole.

"I HAVE GOT BIG NEWS.....

According to some one Microsoft is serious about an x86 powering their next XBOX the reason is because Microsoft wants console and PC compatibility to improve in terms of games.

What the x86 cores are suppose to do is ease the transition of games from PC to Console and vice verse. Among other things the GPU part 'Which ever is used' will also have some amount of modification.

Now the weird part is that Microsoft have listened to their developers and this move is because of collective efforts from a few game developers. Here is a rough outline of the talk i just had:

Me- x86 really on xbox why?

G1- Well it will better the understanding of hardware capability of the console

Me- So what

G1- Better graphics in shorter time development phase

Me- But current games are f'ed up in PC because of consoles

G1- Well the next xbox may have a layer between the software and the hardware, this layer will have pre defined attributes for the setting, etc. Basically a config of what settings to use in the console. Like GTA 5 can have distance show at 50 for the console but on the PC you can change it to anything "0-100"

Me- So it will have some sort of windows?

G1- It will be a layer

Me- huh

G1- ya

Me- Thanks... Bye"

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?273466-Rumored-that-AMD-bulldozer-based-APU-will-appear-in-next-gen-XBOX&p=4910101#post4910101

paradisiac · 21 Jul 2011 at 18:37

well this seems to back up the claims xbox games will work on pcs. maybe thats the layer aspect, the 1 disc will work on either pc or console. rather than the rumours that 360 games will work, its more that the next gen games will.

An Exception · 21 Jul 2011 at 18:51

^^^
If that does turn out to be the case, then it could be a major boost to the ailing PC platform, probably the biggest it's ever had, because with Fusion'esque Processors just becoming mainstream, EVERYONE with such a system, will effectively already have a PC gaming platform at their fingertips, this effectively will create a huge potential user base that developers will want to pay attention to..

pastymuncher · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:00

If this turns out to be true does that also mean that there will be zero backwards compatibility with current 360 games?

An Exception · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:08

^^^
Maybe some form of emulation could be used with a software layer...

james.miller · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:09

counts how many times ejizz says the word 'huge'........yeah, too many

You are right though, that would put AMD in a very good position.

weyland yutani · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:10

Ejizz said:
"I HAVE GOT BIG NEWS.....

According to some one Microsoft is serious about an x86 powering their next XBOX the reason is because Microsoft wants console and PC compatibility to improve in terms of games

According to someone, next gen consoles will look like Avatar, bring about world peace and make poverty history.

paradisiac · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:10

pastymuncher said:
If this turns out to be true does that also mean that there will be zero backwards compatibility with current 360 games?

i would have to say yes. it was, and walways has been claimed by emulator creators that although pcs have a lot more power than current gen consoles, the way they utilise their hardware is too complex to recreate. so unless they have got the funds (like sony did with the original PS3) to do some form of hardware emulation then no backwards compatability. but sony soon ditched it, so can only imagine its not cost effective.
but................sony was pretty quick to release a lot of old games on the PSN, i know 360 games are big and complex, so large HDDs would be required, but this would be the logical way for microsoft.
i think doing a dual compatability disc for both xbox and pc would rapidly shoot the xbox up the leaderboards for the most wanted console.
how they get around piracy is going to be the main issue, unless all games use some kind of online activation.

any way, this if true, could be the best thing for pc gamers, and also move a few steps close to microsofts vision of owning the home entertainment crown.

An Exception · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:25

I think it would be interesting to see where Sony goes if this turns out to be true.

Do they stay with Cell to combat the Xbox, and risk the PS4 being a flop if the new Xbox is a hit and turn into something like SEGA, or do they follow a similar strategy that would allow PS4/PC compatibility?

Would love a PC Gran Turismo title...

titaniumx3 · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:35

I wouldn't be so quick to judge this as being a good thing for PC gaming.

Surely this will mean an end to pure PC titles, and not just from a 'better graphics' perspective, as any serious PC gamer knows that the attraction to PC gaming is a lot more than just better graphics.

paradisiac · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:37

Ejizz said:
I think it would be interesting to see where Sony goes if this turns out to be true.

Do they stay with Cell to combat the Xbox, and risk the PS4 being a flop if the new Xbox is a hit and turn into something like SEGA, or do they follow a similar strategy that would allow PS4/PC compatibility?

Would love a PC Gran Turismo title...

Sony will not follow suite with the PC compatibility, IF it is tru microsoft are going down this route, they will make sure there are things in place for exclusivity.

i think Sony will head more down the digital distribution route and push it as an all round entertainment package like they did with the current console.

paradisiac · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:41

titaniumx3 said:
I wouldn't be so quick to judge this as being a good thing for PC gaming.

Surely this will mean an end to pure PC titles, and not just from a 'better graphics' perspective, as any serious PC gamer knows that the attraction to PC gaming is a lot more than just better graphics.

but if the next gen will run on pc style hardware, then the games will be better optimized for pcs to start with (ie multicore). and i imagine there will be more to the pc layer than just unticking some gfx options.
surely this means that devs will not have to look at whether they can port this game or not, it will already be optimized, will just need some tweaks on the pc layer.
but i imagine this will require BR if not BRXL discs, which will mean the sales in drives will go up, and was BR not a technology Sony heavily invested in to kill of HDDVD?

Lightnix · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:44

Ejizz said:
^^^
Maybe some form of emulation could be used with a software layer...

I couldn't see even a next generation x86 processor being able to competently emulate the Xenon processor in the 360 (it's still pretty fast at certain things). I think they could however include a 28nm "XCGPU" (that is, the single package CPU/GPU/eDRAM found in the 360 'slim') for a relatively low cost if they want backwards compatibility that badly.

Monkeynut · 21 Jul 2011 at 19:56

Lightnix said:
I couldn't see even a next generation x86 processor being able to competently emulate the Xenon processor in the 360 (it's still pretty fast at certain things). I think they could however include a 28nm "XCGPU" (that is, the single package CPU/GPU/eDRAM found in the 360 'slim') for a relatively low cost if they want backwards compatibility that badly.

They might not need the GPU, just the CPU. Then the graphics instructions could be translated on the new x86 CPU for the new graphics chip.

An Exception · 21 Jul 2011 at 20:00

titaniumx3 said:
I wouldn't be so quick to judge this as being a good thing for PC gaming.

Surely this will mean an end to pure PC titles, and not just from a 'better graphics' perspective, as any serious PC gamer knows that the attraction to PC gaming is a lot more than just better graphics.

Anything that increases the PC gaming userbase will provide motivation for developers to actually put aside some half decent budget and effort for PC titles, I personally can't think of a decent PC only game for a long while, Crysis, Metro etc. etc. they're all crap in terms of playability imo, so it's no surprise PC gaming is in decline.

Freddie1980 · 21 Jul 2011 at 20:06

For backwards compatibility they could just take the Xenon CPU from the 360 build it on 28nm to make it super cheap and put it on the same motherboard as the new hardware just like Sony did with the PS3 and the emotion chip from the PS2.

mattjd · 21 Jul 2011 at 20:19

Freddie1980 said:
For backwards compatibility they could just take the Xenon CPU from the 360 build it on 28nm to make it super cheap and put it on the same motherboard as the new hardware just like Sony did with the PS3 and the emotion chip from the PS2.

Or even better on the 22nm

GoogalyMoogaly · 21 Jul 2011 at 20:25

If the new XBOX will be more PC like to allow quicker porting of games, doesn't that seem to suggest that even more games may now be design with a console joypad in mind when the controls are being thought up?

An Exception · 21 Jul 2011 at 20:27

paradisiac said:
Sony will not follow suite with the PC compatibility, IF it is tru microsoft are going down this route, they will make sure there are things in place for exclusivity.

i think Sony will head more down the digital distribution route and push it as an all round entertainment package like they did with the current console.

Tbh I'm not sure that's a good move for Sony, it would only work for them if they were the dominant player, but they have lost a lot of ground with the PS3, and if m$ do go ahead with this PC compatibility stuff, then developers resources can be streamlined and concentrated to better create games as well as bring them to market sooner.

paradisiac · 21 Jul 2011 at 20:33

Ejizz said:
Tbh I'm not sure that's a good move for Sony, it would only work for them if they were the dominant player, but they have lost a lot of ground with the PS3, and if m$ do go ahead with this PC compatibility stuff, then developers resources can be streamlined and concentrated to better create games as well as bring them to market sooner.

i must admit i havent had my ps3 now for quite some time, but when i did, it felt like it was moving more towards a music/video system with more indie style games on the PSN. this is the route i think sony will concentrate on IF MS go down the route suggested in the OP. they will loose a lot of hard core games, so will have to be like the wii and find a gimik to tap into a certain niche market.
i dont think nintendo or sony will stand a chance of releasing anything that would be considered as a games machine if MS get some way of dual a dual disc version for both formats.