Online freedom bye bye.......?

Tyron said:
And the rest who pirate?
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If the information/media/software is available for free (regardless of legalities) because of "some" individuals, the floodgates are open for those who were either "on the fence", or have no qualms either way about piracy to download/obtain said products for free.

Are you that deluded you cannot see reality?
 
Neither, you just make poor excuses for your rationalizations.

If products were cheap enough then most people wouldn't pirate. Not that hard to comprehend, even for you.
 
I don't worry about it. I can still access the info I'm after, I don't do any stuff that requires subterfuge online so from a low end user point of view it doesn't seem to be causing me any issue at all. :)
 
Glaucus said:
Illegal stuff.

All which is happening is very slowly Internet laws are coming in line with real world. You haven't lost freedom.
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Wrong. A group of MPs want to make "adult" content opt-in. That requires a country wide great-firewall style filter and for people to be on a government accessible database to opt-in. All under the guise of "child protection".

Then you have our Government (and other so called liberal Western governments) wanting to monitor and log all internet traffic. Under the guise of preventing terrorism, of course.

That's just a couple of examples of the noose tightening. However it is easy to use the likes of Pirate Bay as a strawman.

Personally I think Governments are running scared of the fact that information (and thus power) has shifted to the general populous. Protecting children and acts of terror is a brilliant diversionary tactic to help convince the less aware that this is for out own good.

Wired did an article last year on the fallacy of using "child protection" to censor the internet.
 
Freedom of speech should be a given under any democracy

Unfortunately most governments in Western Europe, and especially the UK, want to keep tabs and either water down or block altogether all information in the public domain

Just look at the number of times each and everyone of us appears on the numerous private and public CCTV systems around the UK (I don't know of one person who has given their express permission for this)

All forms of censorship will inevitably increase and increase over the WWW because the people who rule the world don't want us mere mortals to know what they do

We are fast becoming controlled and steered in ways that most aren't even aware of - we are fast becoming a police state

Simple as that really
 
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LordSplodge said:
Wrong. A group of MPs want to make "adult" content opt-in. That requires a country wide great-firewall style filter and for people to be on a government accessible database to opt-in. All under the guise of "child protection".

Then you have our Government (and other so called liberal Western governments) wanting to monitor and log all internet traffic. Under the guise of preventing terrorism, of course.

That's just a couple of examples of the noose tightening. However it is easy to use the likes of Pirate Bay as a strawman.

Personally I think Governments are running scared of the fact that information (and thus power) has shifted to the general populous. Protecting children and acts of terror is a brilliant diversionary tactic to help convince the less aware that this is for out own good.

Wired did an article last year on the fallacy of using "child protection" to censor the internet.
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Show me where this is any different to real life. It simply isn't. What's the regs on mobile phones, would that be opt in by any chance and over 18laws in shops where you are asked for ID. I think so.

They aren't running scared, power hasn't shifted not in the west, that's just drivel you've read and think it fits your opinions.
 
yhack said:
Well with Steam, they have proved that if you sell games really cheap, you sell a ridiculous amount and make more profit(over the same time, not per unit). Of course you can't prove this causes less pirating, but if definitely has more sales, so maybe it does.
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This is way OT, but anyway:

Steam is a value-add service, so it's not only about price.

Steam gives you:

- Convenience (ease of access, no need for keys, packaging)
- Cloud services (game saves, screenshot storage etc)
- Price reductions in Sales (otherwise their prices are nothing special)
- Social app features (Instant Messaging, Join friends in game)
- Contingency (you can always download your games again so backups aren't essential)

Offer an attractive package and you'll wean all but the hardcore away from piracy IMO. I certainly don't feel the need to "acquire" games anymore.
 
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Glaucus said:
Show me where this is any different to real life. It simply isn't. What's the regs on mobile phones, would that be opt in by any chance and over 18laws in shops where you are asked for ID. I think so.

They aren't running scared, power hasn't shifted not in the west, that's just drivel you've read and think it fits your opinions.
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Mobile phone data shouldn't be opt-in anyway. Also it doesn't work, adult content gets through and non-adult content gets blocked.

As for the "drivel" I have read. Well stopping SOPA and PIPA is hardly drivel. In fact go look at the 38Degrees website (for example) and see what the pOwer shift has achieved. Or go look at how Chineese bloggers are reporting human rights abuse from inside China. Or how the Internet was used during the Arab Spring.

It's not drivel. The Internet is changing the world faster than governments can keep up.

Personally I take the *opinion* that it is a good citizens duty to question everything the government does and lobby hard against anything that is against the people's interest rather than blindly accept things like some, including you, are willing to do.
 
PianoBasher said:
This is way OT, but anyway:

Steam is a value-add service, so it's not only about price.

Steam gives you:

- Convenience (ease of access, no need for keys, packaging)
- Cloud services (game saves, screenshot storage etc)
- Price reductions in Sales (otherwise their prices are nothing special)
- Social app features (Instant Messaging, Join friends in game)
- Contingency (you can always download your games again so backups aren't essential)

Offer an attractive package and you'll wean all but the hardcore away from piracy IMO. I certainly don't feel the need to "acquire" games anymore.
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to get in on this debate, I have to agree to this.

If they can provide something like this for films/tv shows. At present there isn't anything. Not just to rent to buy, DRM free and so you can download it anywhere you log in.
 
Tyron said:
This is the free market at work, reduce prices = less pirating.
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Not really. Its not the free market at work, its the black market, and there is a difference. If someone opened a shop/market stall that sold or gave away pirate copies of films / books / music do you think it would be left unchecked by the law for as long as it has been allowed to run on the internet ?

Theft is theft whether its physically walking into a shop and pocketing a DVD or obtaining it directly from the web as a digital download. The problem we have is that digital theft is seen as being 'socially acceptable' , because its so faceless that people don't actually view it as stealing from someone or an organisation.

If i walked into HMV and brazenly picked up a DVD and walked out with it because i didn't want to pay the RRP as I thought it was way too expensive, this behaviour would not be tolerated and I would that instant become a criminal liable to prosecution. Why then can i do exactly the same thing on the internet, but rather than be labelled a criminal be labelled a warrior for fair pricing ?
 
Tyron said:
Neither, you just make poor excuses for your rationalizations.

If products were cheap enough then most people wouldn't pirate. Not that hard to comprehend, even for you.
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Then why is music piracy still so rife? The product is dirt cheap and still pirated extensively. You cannot really compete very well with free.
 
i think ocuk mods on their own are taking the freedom away bit by bit ;) its a bit stupid removing threads just like that.. "omg u discuss what the hell ban!!" its not like the thread was going out of hand or anything like that..
 
LordSplodge said:
Wrong. A group of MPs want to make "adult" content opt-in. That requires a country wide great-firewall style filter and for people to be on a government accessible database to opt-in. All under the guise of "child protection".

Then you have our Government (and other so called liberal Western governments) wanting to monitor and log all internet traffic. Under the guise of preventing terrorism, of course.

That's just a couple of examples of the noose tightening. However it is easy to use the likes of Pirate Bay as a strawman.

Personally I think Governments are running scared of the fact that information (and thus power) has shifted to the general populous. Protecting children and acts of terror is a brilliant diversionary tactic to help convince the less aware that this is for out own good.

Wired did an article last year on the fallacy of using "child protection" to censor the internet.
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+1
 
RDM said:
Then why is music piracy still so rife? The product is dirt cheap and still pirated extensively. You cannot really compete very well with free.
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But they come with drm, impositions and limitations to the user, like itunes for example, people don't want this and thus go for the pirating option much like the dvd situation stated in this thread.
 
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