Options for Replacing Windows Home Server

Nazbit · 10 Dec 2019 at 21:48

Hi,

I've been using a HP Media Server EX490 running WHS for probably a decade now.

It has been serving two functions for me, one as a NAS and two as an automated backup of Windows clients.

I've moved the NAS away as I never really trusted the mandatory Windows Drive Extender but the backup service runs every night to maintain recovery images of every other machine and also allows me to browse individual files in those backups and restore to a point in time.

This has been very useful and has allowed me to restore a machine fully after a crash and recover various documents when they have been corrupted, lost or deleted.

Unfortunately the software no longer works reliably with Windows 10 and I can't depend on this solution any longer.

I'm looking for as close to a like for like replacement as possible to perform these backups.

The closest hardware wise probably would be something like a HP Gen8/Gen10 Microserver or a Dell T30/T40. But where I'm really stuck is the important bit, equivalent replacement software.

I've been reading that Windows Server Essentials basically has the same exact backup functionality that I've been used to in WHS and screens and wizards that I'll be used to. (Can't find any youtube videos showing this functionality, might have to spin up an AWS box and have a look around.)

But then it seems to get complicated. It sounds like Server Essentials 2016 can only be used as a domain controller and that some significant messing about is required for Win 10 Pro clients if you want them in a workgroup rather than a domain.

Not sure if 2019 still suffers this problem or how easy it is to get around but I've also read suggestions that there is no Essentials versions of 2019 at all in which case I assume I couldn't obtain cost effective licences for the larger versions.

If you are in the know about these things or using any of these solutions I would really appreciate a steer on this.

Thanks

EDIT - I've come across a lot of people saying just use Win 10 instead of a server OS but as far as I can tell there is no automated functionality within Windows 10 for it to take scheduled backups of other clients - is there?

Quartz · 10 Dec 2019 at 21:55

Windows Server Essentials 2016 is what you want. Not 2019. 2019 lacks the backup facility and a few other things too.

Nazbit · 10 Dec 2019 at 22:08

Thanks.

Do you know anything about this idea that 2016 must be used as a domain controller?

Will it play nicely backing up multiple Win 10 Pro machines that are all in the same workgroup without needing me to configure a domain?

I've read that Win 10 Home clients work in workgroup but that server 2016 wants Win 10 Pro clients in a domain by default and that it can involve quite a bit of tinkering?

Not being familiar with these server OS packages is this difficult to overcome?

The thing that I've enjoyed most about WHS is that it has run for so long without really thinking about it, I'm hoping that the replacement can be similarly low maintenance from reading peoples comments on the "domain workaround" it makes me worry that I'll be forever troubleshooting that hack whenever updates are installed etc.

khrall · 10 Dec 2019 at 22:16

Have a look at Veeam agent for Microsoft Windows Free Edition if your thinking of moving over to Windows 10.
https://www.veeam.com/windows-endpoint-server-backup-free.html

Also in agreement with Quartz comment, 2019 has missing features, there are some posts out there of people re-enabling or adding features from 2016, but life really is too short.

Quartz · 10 Dec 2019 at 22:18

Nazbit said:
Do you know anything about this idea that 2016 must be used as a domain controller?

Yes, that is correct. It automatically creates its own domain.

Nazbit said:
Will it play nicely backing up multiple Win 10 Pro machines that are all in the same workgroup without needing me to configure a domain?

Domain creation is handled automatically. I think all clients get added to the domain. I just automatically did it.

Nazbit said:
I've read that Win 10 Home clients work in workgroup

Sorry, I've no experience here. You could always upgrade them to Win 10 Pro.

Clients being in a domain isn't an issue for me.

BigT · 11 Dec 2019 at 12:33

Veeam agents backing up to a NAS share would seem to fulfil your two requirements. Going this route opens up all the various options for your server/NAS. Windows, Linux, dedicated NAS OSs like OMV, FreeNAS Unraid etc.

As someone who isn't the brightest spark with Linux, and has always used mainly Windows and a bit of OSX now, I have gotten along really well with an Unraid/Veeam combination. Set and forget and easy restoration of files when required. It just works out of the box really like an all Windows/WHS environment used to for you.

Nazbit · 11 Dec 2019 at 20:37

Thanks for the replies, really helpful.

For Server 2016 essentials I like that it will have the same backup screens that I'm used to and happy with.

The domain thing really puts me off though. I have 5 clients all on Windows 10 Pro so its going to force them down the domain creation route. I need to do some more research in to just what that means but I assume it means things like the users will now have roaming profiles and there will be AD permissions and things to mess with.

I also wonder what impact it would have on my two work laptops which obviously have VPNs installed but in terms of them accessing local resources like NAS files and printers.

The problem is that if I have to be regularly involved with maintaining the domain side of it I will eventually loose interest and then the backups won't be there when I need them.

It also means that the domain server has to be on 24/7 doesn't it? Whereas with a box that is just for backups I could power it down for 12 - 18 hours a day and wake it for use.

I assume that if the domain server goes down and I'm not home then family won't be able to logon to their PCs, my CCTV server could fail etc?

I need to do more research, I'm only familiar with very basic AD tasks and it does put me off quite a bit to be honest.

For Veeam I've downloaded the Free Windows Agent which I assume is the correct tool?

I have it running an initial backup now and I've scheduled it to run overnight for the next few days so that I can do some testing.

It does seem like it suits the "set and forget" aspect that I'm looking for and does both a full image and individual files.

Is there any kind of central monitoring tool for it? As far as I can tell it seems to be a case of one agent running on each client machine with its own config and the NAS server is just a target drive with no awareness of the Veeam processing at all? its just providing some disk space for in which to save the backups? Hence the suggestion that I can then use any NAS platform rather than needing to be windows.

The only concern with that is how I would know if one of the clients had an issue without a central monitoring tool. For example if there is a failure to backup a client and that family member doesn't tell me I wouldn't be able to resolve it. I can only see email alerts in the config but by the look of it that might need the use of a standalone email server.

I do like the idea that veeam opens up the pure NAS OS's but I'll also have to do a fair bit of research in to which one to choose.

khrall · 11 Dec 2019 at 21:25

Nazbit said:
For Veeam I've downloaded the Free Windows Agent which I assume is the correct tool?

I have it running an initial backup now and I've scheduled it to run overnight for the next few days so that I can do some testing.

It does seem like it suits the "set and forget" aspect that I'm looking for and does both a full image and individual files.

Is there any kind of central monitoring tool for it? As far as I can tell it seems to be a case of one agent running on each client machine with its own config and the NAS server is just a target drive with no awareness of the Veeam processing at all? its just providing some disk space for in which to save the backups? Hence the suggestion that I can then use any NAS platform rather than needing to be windows.

The only concern with that is how I would know if one of the clients had an issue without a central monitoring tool. For example if there is a failure to backup a client and that family member doesn't tell me I wouldn't be able to resolve it. I can only see email alerts in the config but by the look of it that might need the use of a standalone email server.

I do like the idea that veeam opens up the pure NAS OS's but I'll also have to do a fair bit of research in to which one to choose.

There is a community edition of Veeam Backup & Replication. You can use it to do the job monitoring etc.

https://www.veeam.com/virtual-machine-backup-solution-free.html

Quartz · 11 Dec 2019 at 21:54

Nazbit said:
The domain thing really puts me off though.

Why? It's dead easy and the WSE client install does it for you.

Nazbit said:
I assume it means things like the users will now have roaming profiles

Not true. No roaming profiles unless you enable them.

and there will be AD permissions and things to mess with.

No more than your current WHS.

Nazbit said:
It also means that the domain server has to be on 24/7 doesn't it?

Is that really a problem? My server uses as much power as an old lightbulb.

Nazbit said:
I assume that if the domain server goes down and I'm not home then family won't be able to logon to their PCs, my CCTV server could fail etc?

Credentials get cached so logging in is not a problem. Remote access may or may not be an issue: WSE allows remote access, just like WHS, and it can fail in the same way. But if you have direct access then that is not affected.

WSE really is simple. Complexity lurks under the surface, but you can leave it under the surface.

Nazbit · 12 Dec 2019 at 18:54

khrall said:
There is a community edition of Veeam Backup & Replication. You can use it to do the job monitoring etc.

https://www.veeam.com/virtual-machine-backup-solution-free.html

thanks, just downloaded this, its installing now so I'll have a look around

Quartz said:
Why? It's dead easy and the WSE client install does it for you.

WSE really is simple. Complexity lurks under the surface, but you can leave it under the surface.

Ok so it seems like I might have made some assumptions or had the wrong idea about this then from what you're saying. Just queuing up some youtube videos to see what the set up and configuration looks like.

Maybe I've over complicated it in my mind. I guess the way I'm thinking of it is that once you've created a domain that you're leaving "home" computing behind and you're on the first rung of the ladder towards a proper business network, with no network admin skills thats put me off.

But ok maybe thats not the case at all, sounds like from what you're saying a domain created in this way will basically be no different to my current workgroup?

Off to watch some videos on the subject now

Thanks

chroniclard · 12 Dec 2019 at 19:06

Isn't it about 300 quid? Seems pointless when can just use W10 with a cloud backup(or local cloud backup server running on the windows box)

Quartz · 12 Dec 2019 at 23:04

Nazbit said:
But ok maybe thats not the case at all, sounds like from what you're saying a domain created in this way will basically be no different to my current workgroup?

There is more there - a lot more - if you want it. But it's mostly hidden and you don't have to use it.