PC fails to start....then starts....then fails...you get the idea

Adski

Adski

Adski

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Hi - just signed up here so if this isn't in the right place then I apologise. I'd love to put it in a more specific place but it could be anything!

I'll outline the problem - sorry if it gets a little long but it's a big problem!

Right - I got asked to fix a computer for a mate. Sounded like a simple motherboard problem - when powered up, nothing would appear on the screen despte the fans kicking in but the CD drives (it has two) kept clunking every 5 seconds as though powering on so I assumed it was the motherboard resetting. I removed every component bar the processor and fan and it still did it. Replaced it all still did it. However, the crazy thing is, after about 20 casual pushes of the power button, on it came. Restart, nothing. But if you were persistent enough, it came on.

Now this threw me. I don't like intermittent problems so I rang a friend who knows lots more than me and he seemed to agree that it was the board but just to be sure, he took the processor (a P4 3.0GHz) and tried it in his. It should be noted that I run an AMD so know very little about Pentiums which brings me onto my next point - the processor seems to run very hot - at around 65 degrees at idle but I'm assured that's normal for P4's.

Anyway - the processor worked in his board seemingly discounting that. (But it does, and did at my other mate's house make a funny noise). So everything was pointing at the board. I okayed buying a new motherboard and power supply (just to be on the safe side) whacked everything in, power on and everything seemed fine. Installed loads of stuff on it at my house, restarted it loads of times, perfect. Took it to my mate's house to set it all back up for her and seemingly everything was ok until...the day after I set it up :confused:

Apparently, someone installed Fifa and the fan seemed to get noisier which I told her was ok but she insists if was never this loud before until it started to break the first time. Then she tried to power on and nothing. Came back a bit later and it was ok. I've arranged to pick it up again and have a look but I'm desperately running out of ideas. Just a few of my thoughts:

* I can't see it being a temperature related issue as when it does come on, it could be just after it's been on for hours or from cold - seemingly indiscriminate of the temperature

* The way I see it, it could only be these things now - a) The motherboard; there's every chance I've bought a dud one b) The processor; it makes funny noises! c) The Graphics card - I doubt this because I tried the onboard one and it still did it d) The hard drive; again - doubt this because I would have thought the computer would have at least come on and then struggled to find a hard drive rather than come on but with nothing on the screen.

* When on, the computer works perfectly.


I really need help guys - I'm stumped as is my mate which, if you knew him, would realise that it must be the Apocalypse. Any help would be greatly, massively, enormously appreciated.

Cheers,

Adam
 
Hi - thanks for the welcome.

That had crossed my mind but in the original board at least I removed it and it still had the same problem.

Admittedly I haven't tried removing it in the new one but surely if it was a heat problem, the computer would start from cold and then not come on at all rather than vice versa?

I don't know really - I'm just clutching at straws!
 
With the original problem, I took out the RAM and it failed to come on. I never tried a stick from mine in there though. However, since changing the board, it worked so I never removed it again.

However, it's entirely possible that it could be the RAM in this new one or even that I've bought a dodgy power supply (it was only 13 quid!) but obviously I can't test it until I get the PC.

I'm sceptical that something I've bought is dodgy but then again, something in there is wrong isn't it?

I hate computers.
 
have you tried a BIOS update? sounds like incompatability problems and updates are only answer sometimes.

Else I would think its mobo and something not clicking right.
 
If you take the side off, you should be able to locate where the noise comes from.

Just keep moving around to you can locate the noise, once you know what creates the noise you'll likely find your problem.

I had a buzzing noise myself yesterday, ended up being the retail hsf on my A64 when it speeds up in this hot weather, hence to say i've got a new one ordered already.

Locate the noise.

P.S. Whats the specs of the system?
 
Which P4 3Ghz is it? Northwood, Prescott, Smithfield, Presler etc...

Even a Prescott shouldnt really idle at 65, With decent cooling 40-50, but even with the stock intel heatsink, I would expect only 50-60 even if the case cooling was poor.

I've also seen this kind of startup problem with cheap PSU's, Sometimes pulling the power lead out, and then reconnecting it can get them to boot faster, or as you say hit the power button until it works. To be honest I wouldnt even let a £13 PSU in my house. IMHO cheap PSU's are both a fire risk, and a danger the the computer componants.

As for the fan noise, assuming its a Prescott, the 'stock intel' CPU coolers ramp up from 2000rpm, to almost 5000rpm as the cpu passes 75 degrees (exact values can be configured in bios). And to be honest, it sounds like a helicopter. Something like a Zalman cooler would be a lot more efficient, and they are very quiet. (Plenty of other good aftermarket coolers too).
 
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Thanks for all the help guys.

I haven't picked the PC up yet (it's been faultless since Sunday!) so bear in mind I won't be able to try out some of your ideas yet. But to address what's been said so far;

Not tried a BIOS update to be honest. I thought (wrongly!) that because it had worked for a year, what now could have sent it weird - it's never been opened or messed with. Might be worth trying that on the new board though.

The noise - it sounds like it's coming from the CPU but I've been told that's impossible. It happens when it's loading so it could be the Hard Drive too I guess. It's not so much a buzzing - but a high pitched....squeak. That doesn't describe it to be honest. It doesn't sound too healthy whatever it is. Specs of the system are

P4 3.0Ghz
512 MB RAM (it gets used fairly heavily as a games machine - both times it's gone wrong initially have been when a game has been installed but probably coincidence)
200GB SATA Drive
Some ATi Radeon graphics card - can't remember the exact spec but I'll get back to you on it
an ASROCK motherboard
Power supply was a 300W one and is now a 350W.

I'm afraid I have no idea what type of P4 it is. Up until you said that in here, I thought there were just two types - Prescott and...um....Non-Prescott! Is there anyway I can find out?

I initially thought 65 was hot but got told since that it wasn't. What you say about the power supply is interesting. I thought they were all much of a muchness but clearly not. I thought I was getting a good deal too compared to the 30 quid jobbies in ***********! Where am I best getting a decent PSU from then? And how much should I look to pay. (Bear in mind it's not my money and I'm trying to keep costs down for her)

Thanks again for all the help. If (most likely when) the problem happens again, I'll pick the computer up and post back here with what I find out.

Thanks again - great welcome,

Adam
 
Remove the competitor please, and £30 is still to cheap, your looking at £40+ for a decent solid PSU.
 
Download CPUID, it will tell you not only the 'name' of the P4, but what stepping it is too, everything you ever wanted to know.

Works on AMD chips too, a handy little program.

As a rough indicator (and ignoring celerons)

Willemote 1.4-2.0Ghz, always has 256k onboard cache
Northwood 1.8-3.4Ghz always has 512k onboard cache, A-FSB=400, B-FSB=533 and C-FSB=800
Prescott ???-3.8Ghz, normally 1meg cache
Smithfield, Dual core prescott, 2x1meg cache
Cedarmill, 65nm die shrink of Prescott, with 2meg cache
Presler, Dual core Cedarmill, 2x2meg cache.

Sometimes the Extreme Editions had different named cores, there and the socket can be used for partial identification as well.

Wille's were socket 423, and 478
Northys' Socket 478 only
Prescott 478 and 775
Smith/Cedar/Presler Socket 775 only.

There may have been a 1.6Northy, but I am pretty sure the slowest was 1.8
 
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