1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Plastic makes me a sad panda

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Lil old me, May 28, 2010.

  1. Lil old me

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 2,522

    Location: Norfolk

    Well yea if you want. But then you have to factor in the farmer who rears the cows, his labourers, the butcher, lorry driver etc etc etc, you can go on forever! It might be interesting to see how many people actually work to produce a kilo of quorn versus a kilo of steak and do a comparison that way but i have no idea how you'd go about it.

    Awful lot of assumptions in this post.

    If you want something that looks and tastes like meat but doesnt have any of animal welfare issues then eat quorn.

    We've already established that both processes are wastefully inefficient in production of the final product but we have no actual figures, just assumptions that because its an industrial process it must be extremely environmentally damaging. Yoghurt is essentially processed but i dont hear many people complaining about that!

    As for the rest of it, read my OP. I do still eat meat. I love meat and ive just started this journey. Eventually the aim might be to do away with quorn, however for now even a meat substitute is better than no meat. At least quorn is produced in this country, bringing the food miles down.


    A general note to everyone though. The semi vegetarianism was never the point of this post, i can see now why the writer of fake plastic fish created a separate vege blog rather than combining it with her hatred of plastics. The point was to tell people about plastics and try and give some people ideas on how to reduce their usage, as well as to show people the damage they do. Perhaps this link will help:

    http://www.chrisjordan.com/current_set2.php?id=11
     
  2. Mucky_Pup

    Mobster

    Joined: Jul 21, 2008

    Posts: 4,625

    Location: Hebburn

    I eat what I want, which includes lots of meat, because it's tastes nice. I also like plastic, 'tis a great invention.
     
  3. mrk

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 83,910

    Location: South Coast

    In American "marts" they use brown paper bags to haul their shopping home. Why can't they do that here in every super market? Are British shoppers to lazy to carry?
     
  4. Lil old me

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 2,522

    Location: Norfolk

    From the previous page: :p

    Basically its better to reuse plastic, or even better to use unbleached cotton bags than to simply throw away paper.
     
  5. mrk

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 83,910

    Location: South Coast

    Yeah but the paper bags can be put over the heads of ugly people!
     
  6. platypus

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jul 25, 2003

    Posts: 38,864

    Location: Rhône-Alpes+Cambridge

    Except it isn't does it. Quorn tastes bland and plastic, ironically enough.

    The worrying thing is that of the plastics you stick in the recycling bin nowadays though, less then 50% of it is actually recycled because of the cost of doing so. I spoke to a council representative recently who told me exactly what is recycled in Cambridge, and what ends up in landfill.

    The sad fact is that it isn't financially viable for these companies to buy large amounts of recycling refuse as they get paid less to recycle it - so it ends up in the ground.
     
  7. platypus

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jul 25, 2003

    Posts: 38,864

    Location: Rhône-Alpes+Cambridge

    Any type of plastic can be recycled. A large amount isn't though, because it isn't financially viable.
     
  8. Cosimo

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Jan 9, 2007

    Posts: 163,586

    Location: Londinium

    Can they now. :p
     
  9. -BA-

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 4, 2005

    Posts: 2,793

    Actually that's not strictly true. I watched Tropic of Cancer recently and the presenter had travelled to Hawaii where there is a beach that just faces out to thousands of miles of open ocean but is almost entirely plastic right down to the fine grains of what has now become plastic sand. That was certainly quite an eye opener.
     
  10. Lil old me

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 2,522

    Location: Norfolk

    Not to my tastebuds. Quorn chicken curry made from scratch (I never ever buy jars of sauce) tasted loads better than a ready meal. Yes the texture was different but chicken is fairly tasteless anyway and in a curry you're letting the spices do the work far more than the meat flavour. Of course I know there are exceptions to this and I'd never buy quorn steak but for me it is a fairly tasty alternative!

    This highlights a problem I often find with environmental issues. People always see alternatives or changes in black and white. If I say oh ill half the amount of meat I eat, people say, well why dont you go the whole way then? Or id never ever give up my meat! Or when you say I recycle more, or buy less plastics people react with, but it cant all be recycled, theres no point anyway or I cant live without my laptop/tv/car dashboard. Look people, its not about changing everything 100%, its about making small changes which have the potential to make a BIG difference! You dont have to do away with all pollution or with all meat or with all plastics. Im sensible enough to realise all of these things are an unfortunate but NECESSARY part of modern life. I accept that you cant simply eradicate plastic or pollution but that does not mean you cant reduce it slightly.
     
  11. Psymonkee

    Capodecina

    Joined: Feb 24, 2004

    Posts: 13,698

    Location: St.Andrews

    Chicken is NOT tasteless!

    Best be getting your tastebuds checked!
     
  12. King85

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Nov 30, 2008

    Posts: 1,905

    Location: Solihull, West Mids

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8639769.stm
     
  13. platypus

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jul 25, 2003

    Posts: 38,864

    Location: Rhône-Alpes+Cambridge

    Pardon? You're doing something wrong if you think chicken to be tasteless :p. I also never eat ready meals.

    If we paid 250% taxes we could probably afford to recycle all plastics.
     
  14. Lil old me

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 2,522

    Location: Norfolk

    By tasteless i mean relative to a steak or lamb in a curry. To me spices in a curry have far more flavour than the chicken itself. I wouldnt use quorn chicken if i was only trying to do a chicken breast, but in a strong sauce it makes little difference.
     
  15. -BA-

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 4, 2005

    Posts: 2,793

    Yup that's the one. When you think about just how small the Hawaiian Islands are in the Pacific with that much trash on the beach, it is seriously disturbing to think how much is out there in the seas and oceans themselves.
     
  16. Radiation

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 12, 2003

    Posts: 4,030

    I find it extremely wasteful the amount of energy and resources that go into unnecessary packaging, i have often wondered to myself how it's sustainable when chucking it in the bin, i mean when you think about all the processes a simple box goes though its a lot but the amount of things plastic bottles, crisp packets and so on do with their often excessive decoration it must be huge.
     
  17. chumpit

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Nov 30, 2008

    Posts: 1,291

    Location: Brecon

    If you get upset about wasted packaging don't go to a co-op store, they chuck out absolute tonnes of plastic and cardboard daily and then claim to be environmentally friendly
     
  18. Jonny69

    Man of Honour

    Joined: May 3, 2004

    Posts: 17,659

    Location: Kapitalist Republik of Surrey

    It can be recycled but it usually downgrades each time into an inferior material of little use. Like I said earlier there's only a certain amount of low grade plastic we can use and we'd be best off recycling however many times we can before using it for energy recovery.

    Of course, the sensible option would be to switch to using plastics that do recycle more readily, but this is mainly down to educating designers in their material choices.

    I get 'accused' of being a hypocrite all the time. This is the other common great one. An environmentalist but yet own a car, eat meat, own energy using products, earn money etc...

    It depends on the product. Take something like a laptop where the resources that go into making the product are huge: if that product gets smashed in transit then you've made a huge loss in terms of energy and resources. In this case packaging becomes critical in preserving resources in transit.

    Now go to supermarket products where people will only buy the item if it is in 100% tip top condition and shiny. It just gets chucked away if it reaches its date which is a massive waste. Maintaining the product so it actually gets bought requires a lot of packaging.

    As for plastic bottles... The main problem is carting around tonnes and tonnes of water in trucks, not the plastic, when there is already a perfectly adequate water supply running everywhere in pipes. It's cultural and behavioural in this case. A massive waste but consumer led.
     
  19. platypus

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jul 25, 2003

    Posts: 38,864

    Location: Rhône-Alpes+Cambridge

    Yes burning plastics for energy recovery is being mooted on a large scale, however it has quite harmful emissions.
     
  20. Jonny69

    Man of Honour

    Joined: May 3, 2004

    Posts: 17,659

    Location: Kapitalist Republik of Surrey

    That's what you have flue scrubbers for ;)

    Plus, if the right plastics were being used in the first place you don't get the harmful emissions.