PlayStation 3 lacks upscaler for 1080i

[Schnippzle]

Saw this on Shacknews:

With numerous display standards falling under the high definition umbrella--mainly 720p, 1080i, and 1080p--many gamers have expressed confusion as to which is the most appropriate for their games. Now, it seems that with certain HD PS3 games on certain HD television sets, there might not be the option for HD at all. Earlier today, posters at the NeoGAF forums, among other internet gaming hangouts, realized that PlayStation 3 does not seem to have an internal mechanism for upscaling 720p to 1080i. Meanwhile, many 1080i-capable HDTVs also lack such an upscaler. This means that a 720p-only PS3 game simply will not sync with a non-upscaling 1080i HDTV, forcing users to play the game in 480p enhanced definition or 480i standard definition.

For reference, all PS3 games support 720p, while support for 1080i and 1080p is optional. In the NeoGAF thread, a developer from Insomniac Games, which produced the 720p-only Resistance: Fall of Man, stated that the problem is "not a software issue," implying that it is the hardware that lacks an upscaler. By contrast, Microsoft's Xbox 360 will upscale 720p games to 1080i for TVs that require it.

For users with a standard or enhanced definition television, PS3 games should pose no problem, even if they will not be displayed in full resolution. Though apparently lacking an upscaler, the machine does have a functional downscaler.

Shacknews cannot confirm these reports firsthand, lacking a 1080i-only TV with which to test a 720p claim, but multiple firsthand accounts along with the suggestive developer comment point to this one being true. Hopefully the company issues a software update remedying the situation.

Sony Computer Entertainment America had not reponded to requests for comments at time of publishing.

Im just wondering......does any one else feel slightly cheated by this? Users and game developers are promised one thing....then the games are released...and the consoles themselves do not support the graphics that the game developers have made.

 

[The Running Man]

who has a 1080i TV? and who bought one without an inbuilt upscaler - i presume everything they have watched so far has been downscaled and they would be quite unhappy with everything they have viewed on it?

 

[JUMPURS]

who has a 1080i TV? and who bought one without an inbuilt upscaler - i presume everything they have watched so far has been downscaled and they would be quite unhappy with everything they have viewed on it?

Apparently in the US a lot of folk with TVs 2-3 years old, which are the rear projection CRT HDTV's are like that, because 720p didn't exist at the time. What they watch just now is usually upscaled by the device doing the outputting, such as Satelite box, dvd player, So this will cause issues. I think most of the folk affected will most likely be in America though.

 

[mark_t50]

I thought if you bought a HD ready TV it would at least do 720P and I. So even if the game/PS3 won't upscale to 1080I then surely that doesn't mean it will only run at 480P/I cant I just run it at 720P

EDIT - just read JUMPURS post and it makes more sense now. I didn't realise there were TV's out there that didn't do 720P/I.

 

[The Running Man]

i still dont understand the original post - who has been promised what, and by whom, and how is someone failing to live up to this?

what gfx does the console not support which the devs are supporting? surely it is infact the devs which are not supporting the resolutions they need to - which is hardly a fault of sony for not having an upscaler involved?

 

[Wyrdo]

Apparently in the US a lot of folk with TVs 2-3 years old, which are the rear projection CRT HDTV's are like that, because 720p didn't exist at the time. What they watch just now is usually upscaled by the device doing the outputting, such as Satelite box, dvd player, So this will cause issues. I think most of the folk affected will most likely be in America though.

Yep, I'd agree with this. Probably won't cause an issue for most people.

 

[barnettgs]

which is hardly a fault of sony for not having an upscaler involved?

PS3 doesn't have upscaler yet cheaper & 1 year old xbox 360 does.

With high price tag for PS3, you would at least expect it to do as well and also Sony stated that games would run at 1080p which none of launch games are capable of.

This is a kick in the teeth for older HDTV owners!

 

[Werewolf]

Yep, I'd agree with this. Probably won't cause an issue for most people.

Maybe not in the U.K where 90% or so of HD capable sets are only a couple of years old at most, but in the U.S. and Japan where there are millions of sets that were bought before the current standards were set it will be (there is a reason for the 1080I being available even on sets with a physical res of 720).

It's like HDCP, due to the number of sets that don't support it in Japan it's unlikely to be used there for a long time (I've heard comments that the Japanese consumer watchdogs are likely to not allow it, rather than relying on the good will of the content providers).

 

[JUMPURS]

what gfx does the console not support which the devs are supporting? surely it is infact the devs which are not supporting the resolutions they need to - which is hardly a fault of sony for not having an upscaler involved?

But you see the thing is its not a Dev issue, its the fact that the console wont automatically adjust games outputing in 720p to 1080i.
The PS3 must have a scaler in it of sorts as it will downscale, i presume it will be capable of upscaling also? just that it will probably need to be enabled in the firmware.
If the scaler chip they use is just physically isn't able to do it, then Sony may have a big problem in the US market.
How an electronics firm that makes TV's by the boatload managed this is beyond me tbh.

[I know with some of the above i am a bit out of my depth and someone who is an AV nut may come along and correct me, but that is what i am picking up from other forums. And kinda it makes sense to me.]

With high price tag for PS3, you would at least expect it to do as well and also Sony stated that games would run at 1080p which none of launch games are capable of.

RR6, i mean RR7 is native 1080p

 

[Beepcake]

It wouldn't be a major issue for me, but it would be an issue. Although most TVs over here have scaling hardware, the quality of their output is hugely dependant on the input resolution (if that makes sense). My TV looks noticeably better scaling a 1080i picture to it's native res than it does a 720p image, which is why I have my 360 and original XBox outputting 1080i. Incidentally, the 360 actually does a very good job of upscaling it's output considering it's relatively budget cost.

It won't be a show stopped for most people, but it does seem an odd omission.

 

[Wyrdo]

Maybe not in the U.K where 90% or so of HD capable sets are only a couple of years old at most, but in the U.S. and Japan where there are millions of sets that were bought before the current standards were set it will be (there is a reason for the 1080I being available even on sets with a physical res of 720).

It's like HDCP, due to the number of sets that don't support it in Japan it's unlikely to be used there for a long time (I've heard comments that the Japanese consumer watchdogs are likely to not allow it, rather than relying on the good will of the content providers).

Aye that's what I meant. It won't cause an issue for the majority of people over here and I couldn't care less about Johnny Foreigner I know the US have lots of sets that could be an issue, wasn't sure about Japan.

 

[The Running Man]

PS3 doesn't have upscaler yet cheaper & 1 year old xbox 360 does.

With high price tag for PS3, you would at least expect it to do as well and also Sony stated that games would run at 1080p which none of launch games are capable of.

This is a kick in the teeth for older HDTV owners!

hi, sony never stated that ALL games would be 1080P, that is out of their control. what they did state it that the console COULD output 1080P games (i believe) which it can - subject to the developers making the games in 1080P? so either you are dissapointed because you misinterpreted an article, or your post is based upon ficticious info.

the lack of upscaler may be an issue for older HDTV' users who unwittingly bought TV's without any kind of upscaler in them

i have also looked across amazon. and not all DVD players upscale - which leads me to believe that 1080i TV's are a minority. i wonder IF a 1080i DVD player could be used to upscale the PS3 output as a pass through?

 

[~J~]

hi, sony never stated that ALL games would be 1080P, that is out of their control. what they did state it that the console COULD output 1080P games (i believe) which it can

I seem to remember the exact thing been discussed yesterday with the 360 and people thinking that the GAMES would output at 720p. Sony have done exactly the same as Microsoft but are unfortunately getting the *****-end of the stick.

 

[VIRII]

PS3 doesn't have upscaler yet cheaper & 1 year old xbox 360 does.

With high price tag for PS3, you would at least expect it to do as well and also Sony stated that games would run at 1080p which none of launch games are capable of.

This is a kick in the teeth for older HDTV owners!

The original Xbox can output 1080i but there aren't any games that support it iirc, it can also output 720p but again hardly any games supported it.

 

[VIRII]

It won't be a show stopped for most people, but it does seem an odd omission.

Then again the Xbox1 UK version had the odd ommission of being unable to put out at 720/1080 on UK models even though the US models could.
What made it really odd was that it was simply a software ommission not a hardware issue.

 

[punky_munky]

Then again the Xbox1 UK version had the odd ommission of being unable to put out at 720/1080 on UK models even though the US models could.
What made it really odd was that it was simply a software ommission not a hardware issue.

I'm most likely talking out of my arse here but would that be something to do with speeding up 50Hz games?

 

[Beepcake]

I'm most likely talking out of my arse here but would that be something to do with speeding up 50Hz games?

I don't think so, there were so few games that supported anything other than 480p and so few HD sets in Europe at the time they just never bothered fixing it. On an NTSC box you have options for 480p/720p/1080i where the PAL60 option is on a PAL box.

Very odd, but only really useful for a few games and a few things we can't discuss here.