Projector setup help

devious93

devious93

devious93

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Hi All,

I'm just about to have an annexe built with will have a home cinema and I'm looking into getting a new projector all hooked up and need a bit of assistance!

The plan is to get a motorised projector screen 120 inches in size, a I/O panel with 2 hdmi ports, a vga port and RWY input this part itself is a pain to find!
The cables with go via the wall/ceiling, based on the projector calculator this'll be 1.8-1.9m from the wall and I'll be sitting approx 2.5 metres from the screen to view the screen

Screen%20Shot%202016-01-03%20at%2014.36.51_zpskwxnapq8.png


Tab tensioned screen I'm looking at:
51AxdBBmLCL.jpg


And the shortest possible ceiling mount I can find below (218m from ceiling to top of projector), it's not the most adjustable and I think it's a bit long though based on the limitations of the room being 2.35m in height.

Pic of mount wrapped in spoiler tag as it's a huge picture


** No Hotlinking **


Does anyone see a potential problem with the above, the viewing distance or can advise any better mounts so I can have the projector closer to the top of the ceiling with some height adjustments on it that isn't on a huge extending arm.
 
The projector looks like the Benq W1080ST+. It's probably going to be fine. Go have a look at one in RS first before you throw down some cash though.

The bracket, well you could probably shave 50~70mm from the drop by using something more compact, but I think you know that already.

Screen.... looks great but is probably crap TBH. You're buying a £750-ish projector, so you aren't going to be spending the same again plus a bit more on a decent tab-tensioned screen, so you found this which if my guess is correct is somewhere under £150 (probably a Luxberg/Luxburg or similar) because it 'looks just like the really expensive screens'. Sorry to burst your bubble but with screens you really do get what you pay for. I haven't time to go retyping all the reasons why these type of budget screens are a false economy, so have a quick read of this thread from early December where pretty much the same questions came up about exactly the same screen LINK :)

Wall plate/connection panel...... Waste of time and money.

- First, you haven't mentioned any kind of audio system.... (Please say that you're not planning on relying on the projector's built-in speaker or thinking about cobbling on a soundbar.)... but if you're looking at an AV receiver + 5.1 speaker package then for about what you'll end up spending faffing around with the wall plate you can upgrade a basic receiver to one that has video up-conversion. That means it will take composite video (the Y of YWR) and pipe it through the HDMI cable.

- VGA: it's now cheaper to buy a VGA to HDMI converter than it is to buy decent VGA cable

- The only compelling reasons to use composite video is if you have a Laser Disc collection or you're in to classic console gaming. VHS looks ropy on a projection screen of the size you're planning, and the sync instability makes it hard to maintain decent colour and sync lock especially on tapes where the oxide is demagnetising due to age. Consider going for an amp with up-conversion if you need composite video compatibility.

- Each time you introduce a cable connection (which you do a lot with wall plates) then you put a weak link in the chain. You also make the install more difficult because these cables have to connect to the backs of the plate which means either making the cutouts extra deep or trying to bend stiff cables at awkward angles. Neither is a good solution

The simplest solution is the best and the most reliable and the lowest cost too. Run the cables in wall (inside wide conduit is best for future-proofing) and then finish off each end with brush plate in an appropriate size and colour. LINK
 
lucid said:
The projector looks like the Benq W1080ST+. It's probably going to be fine. Go have a look at one in RS first before you throw down some cash though.

The bracket, well you could probably shave 50~70mm from the drop by using something more compact, but I think you know that already.

Screen.... looks great but is probably crap TBH. You're buying a £750-ish projector, so you aren't going to be spending the same again plus a bit more on a decent tab-tensioned screen, so you found this which if my guess is correct is somewhere under £150 (probably a Luxberg/Luxburg or similar) because it 'looks just like the really expensive screens'. Sorry to burst your bubble but with screens you really do get what you pay for. I haven't time to go retyping all the reasons why these type of budget screens are a false economy, so have a quick read of this thread from early December where pretty much the same questions came up about exactly the same screen LINK :)

Wall plate/connection panel...... Waste of time and money.

- First, you haven't mentioned any kind of audio system.... (Please say that you're not planning on relying on the projector's built-in speaker or thinking about cobbling on a soundbar.)... but if you're looking at an AV receiver + 5.1 speaker package then for about what you'll end up spending faffing around with the wall plate you can upgrade a basic receiver to one that has video up-conversion. That means it will take composite video (the Y of YWR) and pipe it through the HDMI cable.

- VGA: it's now cheaper to buy a VGA to HDMI converter than it is to buy decent VGA cable

- The only compelling reasons to use composite video is if you have a Laser Disc collection or you're in to classic console gaming. VHS looks ropy on a projection screen of the size you're planning, and the sync instability makes it hard to maintain decent colour and sync lock especially on tapes where the oxide is demagnetising due to age. Consider going for an amp with up-conversion if you need composite video compatibility.

- Each time you introduce a cable connection (which you do a lot with wall plates) then you put a weak link in the chain. You also make the install more difficult because these cables have to connect to the backs of the plate which means either making the cutouts extra deep or trying to bend stiff cables at awkward angles. Neither is a good solution

The simplest solution is the best and the most reliable and the lowest cost too. Run the cables in wall (inside wide conduit is best for future-proofing) and then finish off each end with brush plate in an appropriate size and colour. LINK
Click to expand...

Hi Lucid,

Thanks for your helpful input!
I nabbed the projector in the sale for £600 about a month ago and had my eye on it for a while, for the price point I wanted to spend it does the job well enough for me.

The particular screen is by "Allcam" (links removed as I was unsure on the rules on this sub section in regards to external links) it comes with a 3 year warranty so based on wanting to spend sub £200 on a screen it seemed like the only viable solution without relying on just a painted wall.
Looking at the other thread (which answered any other questions I was probably going to ask, thanks!) there's a 106 inch screen in the deal by Sapphire for £200 which is affordable but a little under the size I was hoping for :(

Audio system as a temporary solution was going to be projector/ existing headphones (optic fibre connector to a hub which connects to the output device) until I upgrade my Sonos network with a play bar and sub (already have two 1's).

In regards to composite, you're right, it's for the man cave/consoles throughout the years so they'll be needed for PS2/PS1, N64 etc

The wall plate idea was because it's going into a brand new building about to be built and it needs to be re-sellable at some point, a brushed metal faceplate with the connectors seemed a bit more inviting to the average joe vs the brush faceplate (although that would be used in the ceiling to projector). Future proofing however I think you've got a point there, blast. That way it is!
Sourcing high quality 5m+ YWR, HDMI/ VGA cables starts adding up....
 
I know what you're saying about screen size. It's one of the constant challenges: The entry-level price point for projectors is getting cheaper and lamps are getting brighter so it's possible to project very large images for very small amounts of money. That then leads to an expectation that screen prices should fall pro-rata. That hasn't really happened though. The major brands such as Stewart, Draper, Da-Lite, Owl/Screenline have all stayed around the same price. New manufacturers have come in to the market by making economies in design and materials and churning out high volumes to reduce unit manufacturing costs. Some brands such as Beamax (now defunct :( ) and Sapphire still make a good quality product at lower price points by applying sensible economies in the manufacturing process without trashing the fundamental qualities that define a decent screen. The screen surface, motor, case etc aren't the same quality as the higher priced brands, but they're still very good for the money. Unfortunately there are screen manufacturers who sell purely on price and they're the ones where every component is the cheapest they can lay their hands on. These are the ones you find on Ebay and Amazon.

If the thought of going smaller on the screen is a bit of a stumbling block then have a think about looking for a used screen. I'll be honest though, the 120" you want is a big screen, so if you're looking for quality then you'd be looking for someone who bought a very big screen already and then wanted to go even bigger! I think that's a big ask. It's probably better to search for someone who bought a cheap 120" screen and is looking to upgrade to something better at the same size or smaller. You could buy their old screen. That way you wouldn't take the bit financial hit from buying new.

Incidentally, have you worked out screen widths? 120" diagonal is 8ft 6" wide and 106" diagonal is 7ft 8" wide. What's your viewing distance?

Sound systems: I'm a Sonos dealer so you'd think I'd be biased to the product, but in this case I think you can do far better with a conventional AV receiver and speaker package.

For a start there's the logistics of handling source signals. A Playbar has just one optical input. If you have more than one source, or something that doesn't have optical out, then you'll need to convert those signals as well as provide some kind of source switching. Routing those audio signals via the projector really isn't proper solution because it reduces everything to basic analogue stereo i.e. you lose even basic Dolby Digital not to mention DTS and the HD audio formats from Blu-ray.

A Playbar and sub is going to cost the thick end of £1100. For that money you could have a Yamaha RX-V679 (£350) and a set of Monitor Audio MASS speakers (£500) and still have enough left over to add a Sonos Connect (ZP90). That combination would give you multiple HDMI inputs with HD audio, optical, digital coax, analogue audio inputs, Bluetooth, Airplay, Wi-Fi, video cross conversion (composite and component in to HDMI out), upscaling (SD in > HD out), plus of course all the Sonos features.

As for decent video cables... well you don't need to go mad on the long HDMI. A standard Hi-Speed cable will do just fine. If you go with the AV Receiver suggestion then there's no need for a long composite lead. VGA is the only remaining consideration. You could buy and install a long lead or just go for a VGA to HDMI converter.
 
lucid said:
I know what you're saying about screen size. It's one of the constant challenges: The entry-level price point for projectors is getting cheaper and lamps are getting brighter so it's possible to project very large images for very small amounts of money. That then leads to an expectation that screen prices should fall pro-rata. That hasn't really happened though. The major brands such as Stewart, Draper, Da-Lite, Owl/Screenline have all stayed around the same price. New manufacturers have come in to the market by making economies in design and materials and churning out high volumes to reduce unit manufacturing costs. Some brands such as Beamax (now defunct :( ) and Sapphire still make a good quality product at lower price points by applying sensible economies in the manufacturing process without trashing the fundamental qualities that define a decent screen. The screen surface, motor, case etc aren't the same quality as the higher priced brands, but they're still very good for the money. Unfortunately there are screen manufacturers who sell purely on price and they're the ones where every component is the cheapest they can lay their hands on. These are the ones you find on Ebay and Amazon.

If the thought of going smaller on the screen is a bit of a stumbling block then have a think about looking for a used screen. I'll be honest though, the 120" you want is a big screen, so if you're looking for quality then you'd be looking for someone who bought a very big screen already and then wanted to go even bigger! I think that's a big ask. It's probably better to search for someone who bought a cheap 120" screen and is looking to upgrade to something better at the same size or smaller. You could buy their old screen. That way you wouldn't take the bit financial hit from buying new.

Incidentally, have you worked out screen widths? 120" diagonal is 8ft 6" wide and 106" diagonal is 7ft 8" wide. What's your viewing distance?

Sound systems: I'm a Sonos dealer so you'd think I'd be biased to the product, but in this case I think you can do far better with a conventional AV receiver and speaker package.

For a start there's the logistics of handling source signals. A Playbar has just one optical input. If you have more than one source, or something that doesn't have optical out, then you'll need to convert those signals as well as provide some kind of source switching. Routing those audio signals via the projector really isn't proper solution because it reduces everything to basic analogue stereo i.e. you lose even basic Dolby Digital not to mention DTS and the HD audio formats from Blu-ray.

A Playbar and sub is going to cost the thick end of £1100. For that money you could have a Yamaha RX-V679 (£350) and a set of Monitor Audio MASS speakers (£500) and still have enough left over to add a Sonos Connect (ZP90). That combination would give you multiple HDMI inputs with HD audio, optical, digital coax, analogue audio inputs, Bluetooth, Airplay, Wi-Fi, video cross conversion (composite and component in to HDMI out), upscaling (SD in > HD out), plus of course all the Sonos features.

As for decent video cables... well you don't need to go mad on the long HDMI. A standard Hi-Speed cable will do just fine. If you go with the AV Receiver suggestion then there's no need for a long composite lead. VGA is the only remaining consideration. You could buy and install a long lead or just go for a VGA to HDMI converter.
Click to expand...

You sir are a terrible influence on me.
See the below floor layout of the new build to go up in the next few weeks, the left room will be the one this is situated in with the screen going on the back wall (at the top of the picture)

Screen%20Shot%202016-01-04%20at%2018.17.24_zpsphn34ncq.png


Approximate seating distance will be 2-2.5 metres, I tested the 120 inch size at this distance and for a 2 hour period and didn't find it tiring/harsh on the eyes although I might have peen scanning the screen a tiny bit, it felt like I was at the imax compared to my old dying 32 inch tv but in the long term this might be pushing it a bit.

In regards to size, yep, sizes checked on the calculator and on a wall in the house and it left approximately 60-80cm height for a unit to go below the screen depending on bracket/screen choices.

Screen wise I may have to check 106 inch size on the wall and see if I'll be happy with that and I may end up taking up the recommendation on that brand of screen.

The audio system on the other hand did force a few tears in the wallet department, after years of buying cheap and buying twice vs more high end systems I've bought I think I'll be heading down to the AV store on the weekend and seeing what the kit combination sounds like in person.

Hiding all those wires around the room is going to be interesting!
 
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