R2 290 reference cooler and noise in silent mode?

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

The nVidia cards only throttle by 13-26 MHz though generally. Even stock cooler based ones. Which is a lot less noticeable on performance than 1-200 Mhz (or whatever).

Edit: and I'm talking over time here based on using a 680 or two for a long enough period of time.

The reference GTX760 and Geforce Titan saw 100MHZ+ drops with certain games with launch drivers according to a couple of different French and German reviews. It was because NV Turbo MK2 was more temperature based,and the throttling was less worse with the earlier cards of the GTX600 series. Hardware Canucks for example saw a 40MHZ drop after 5 minutes with their reference GTX660TI.

Things might have changed now OFC with newer drivers and improved fan profiles,but it was noticed by a few sites at launch.

This is why I tend to prefer non-reference cards,unless OFC you need a blower type cooler and are willing to put up with more noise to maintain better cooling.

Cards like the GTX660 OTH are quite immune to throttling as Nvidia gimped them with relatively low power limits.

Anyway,I am now ducking out of this thread,as this has been discussed plenty of times before.

 

[Gregster]

Wow lol

I mention the poor cooler of the Ref 290/X and the defence of it is incredible. Had they put that cooler on nVidia, I would be moaning like a goodun or ripping it off for a better cooler. Sorry I mentioned it

 

[DMF1986]

That's partly why amd reference cards are so cheap though. Its why a lot of people buy them. If amd started slapping expensive coolers on their cards then the price would shoot up. AMD's superb price vs performance is then gone. However i do think they need to improve their reference cooler and i think they will. I don't think we'll see this kind of cooler again on high end amd gpu.

You can get a AIB 290 for pretty cheap now, as cheap as reference cards so id rather have a brand new AIB 290 than a second hand 780, but thats just me. AIB 290's are cool and quiet and have none of the problems the reference cooler has.

Same as above

 

[DMF1986]

On the AMD cooler I have not researched the AIB card

 

[Rusty0611]

The reference GTX760 and Geforce Titan saw 100MHZ+ drops with certain games with launch drivers according to a couple of different French and German reviews. It was because NV Turbo MK2 was more temperature based,and the throttling was less worse with the earlier cards of the GTX600 series. Hardware Canucks for example saw a 40MHZ drop after 5 minutes with their reference GTX660TI.

Things might have changed now OFC with newer drivers and improved fan profiles,but it was noticed by a few sites at launch.

This is why I tend to prefer non-reference cards,unless OFC you need a blower type cooler and are willing to put up with more noise to maintain better cooling.

Cards like the GTX660 OTH are quite immune to throttling as Nvidia gimped them with relatively low power limits.

Anyway,I am now ducking out of this thread,as this has been discussed plenty of times before.

Hence me saying 'generally'...

 

[ICDP]

I'm sorry LT but trying to defend AMD R9 290/X reference cooler as, "cheap to keep costs down" is a fallacy. As has been pointed out the cost of a decent custom cooled card compared to reference is only a few quid.

I can understand AMD sticking to a blower style as reference for OEM purposes but even then an HIS IceQ blower cooler would hardly have bumped the price up. Either way you try to cut it, the R9 290/X were the AMD flagship cards upon release and the cooler is laughably poor.

Is it adequate: Barely
Is it quiet: No
Is it usable: Yes if you can forgive the high sound levels and can accept 95c operating temperatures as the "norm".

It's hardly a secret that I prefer AMD, but I am NOT going to defend them when they mess up in such monumental fashion.

 

[LtMatt]

I'm sorry LT but trying to defend AMD R9 290/X reference cooler as, "cheap to keep costs down" is a fallacy. As has been pointed out the cost of a decent custom cooled card compared to reference is only a few quid.

I can understand AMD sticking to a blower style as reference for OEM purposes but even then an HIS IceQ blower cooler would hardly have bumped the price up. Either way you try to cut it, the R9 290/X were the AMD flagship cards upon release and the cooler is laughably poor.

Is it adequate: Barely
Is it quiet: No
Is it usable: Yes if you can forgive the high sound levels and can accept 95c operating temperatures as the "norm".

It's hardly a secret that I prefer AMD, but I am NOT going to defend them when they mess up in such monumental fashion.

Not really trying to defend it, just saying you get what you pay for. AMD reference cards are cheap but still offer the same or similar performance as much more expensive cards with more expensive cooling solutions. They just have caveats like they run hotter and are louder than other cards. It must give them bigger margins to then sell the cards at a cheaper rate and allows for cheaper pricing. I got two 290 cards for the same price as a single 780TI reference card and im getting close to double the performance. JUst have to put up with the caveats that come with it. For people that aren't willing to do that, they water cool or get an AIB 290. I don't know how much extra a better cooled reference card will cost, but i suspect this is the path amd will go down in the future and hopefully it does not bump the price up too much.

Also no need to be 'sorry'.

 

[Rusty0611]

Not really trying to defend it, just saying you get what you pay for. AMD reference cards are cheap but still offer the same or similar performance as much more expensive cards with more expensive cooling solutions. They just have caveats like they run hotter and are louder than other cards. It must give them bigger margins to then sell the cards at a cheaper rate and allows for cheaper pricing. I got two 290 cards for the same price as a single 780TI reference card and im getting close to double the performance. JUst have to put up with the caveats that come with it. For people that aren't willing to do that, they water cool or get an AIB 290. I don't know how much extra a better cooled reference card will cost, but i suspect this is the path amd will go down in the future and hopefully it does not bump the price up too much.

Also no need to be 'sorry'.

Kind of a tangent to the point being made. It's not about what the price is compared to the competition it's about what AMD are offering for that price point and could they not offer a better solution at the same price point? It's kind of making excuses for something for which there is no reason. If anything the quality of nVidia's reference cooler makes people believe (rightly or wrongly) into thinking that nVidia cards are better quality and that's why they cost more when in reality AMD could do something similar at a minimal increase in overall cost.

It's no secret there's a nVidia tax: rightly or wrongly people are happy to pay it to get a nVidia card for their own reasons but I don't think that was what he was getting at.

 

[Martini1991]

When the die shrink comes, what we've got now as a reference cooler will become adequate again.

I'd be surprised to see a massive deviation.

 

[LtMatt]

Kind of a tangent to the point being made. It's not about what the price is compared to the competition it's about what AMD are offering for that price point and could they not offer a better solution at the same price point? It's kind of making excuses for something for which there is no reason. If anything the quality of nVidia's reference cooler makes people believe (rightly or wrongly) into thinking that nVidia cards are better quality and that's why they cost more when in reality AMD could do something similar at a minimal increase in overall cost.

It's no secret there's a nVidia tax: rightly or wrongly people are happy to pay it to get a nVidia card for their own reasons but I don't think that was what he was getting at.

I'm sure they can offer something more efficient at cooling at a better price point and i envisage this is what they are will do with future designs. However i don't want them to copy Nvidia and then slap a £100 on to the cost. I'm just relaying what i believe to be a reason why amd reference cards are so much cheaper than similar performing cards with a metal shroud. The only other difference is the price. Its not about defending the AMD reference cooler, just giving my opinion as to why that is the case currently. I'm sure they can improve it a bit without increasing the cost too much. Well, i hope they can.

When the die shrink comes, what we've got now as a reference cooler will become adequate again.

I'd be surprised to see a massive deviation.

I wouldn't expect a massive deviation either. I'd be very surprised if its exactly the same model with no improvement though.

 

[Gregster]

When the die shrink comes, what we've got now as a reference cooler will become adequate again.

I'd be surprised to see a massive deviation.

Agreed.

With the bigger chips, they needed a better cooler and whilst the AIB coolers do a grand job, the ref 290/X cooler doesn't. Take the 680 ref cooler for example and if they had put that on the Titan/780 Ti/780, it would have seriously struggled to keep the cards cool enough and hence they redesigned the cooler (based on the superb 690 cooler).

I honestly feel that people with warm rooms will struggle to keep temps down in the summer who have a ref 290/X. Bah, time will tell anyway.

 

[triss]

I think for how little extra the AIB 290's are it shows with a a very small increase in costs (not a £100) AMD could well of launched with a far better cooler and would have IMO had a far better product with less negative PR
Bad press true or false does affect a lot of peoples opinions and gives AMD this whole poor mans card lower quality runs hotter idea a lot of people have

 

[Martini1991]

I don't know why they don't start putting bigger fans into GPU's, I don't know why they're the height they are...