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Radeon VII a win or fail?

Discussion in 'Graphics Cards' started by Gregster, Feb 8, 2019.

  1. Brazo

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Apr 22, 2016

    Posts: 2,224

    That’s like complaining that a HGV is slower than a lotus and using the argument that a HGV has far more horse power!
     
  2. vapor matt

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jan 19, 2003

    Posts: 1,761

    Location: west sussex

    The VII is not a pointless release by AMD, It can trade blows with the 2080 and over time it will most likely be better once the drivers mature. its 25% faster than vega 64. if your in the red team its an upgrade with double memory 16g.
    Its a great compute card as well. now if you had a 1080ti the 2080 is a pointless upgrade, you would have to go 2080ti to see more raw speed but it would cost you more than double what most paid for there 1080ti gpu's if you wanted a top notch 2080ti
    it would cost you over double what a 1080ti cost.

    I have had zero issues with it so far, not 1 crash and it over clocks too, I am a complete newby to AMD software and watt man, but I always start with fresh windows install. the last AMD card I had was a 7950 or something like that. yes some have trouble and some have trouble with
    NV cards as well, some complete failures with more than 1 RMA. its unfortunate that AMD let it be released to reviewer's with pre release drivers, that's AMD bad judgement as these reviews are read by many.

    What I don't get is all this AMD bashing because the card cant beat a 2080ti costing nearly double for the cheapest version with the first release core. So far I am happy with it, it performs well and will get better.
     
  3. Kaapstad

    Man of Honour

    Joined: May 21, 2012

    Posts: 27,662

    Location: Dalek flagship

    Not at all.

    It is a bit disingenuous to say the 2080 Ti is the fastest gaming card, I was just pointing out that it was not.

    As to the price, I think all Turing NVidia cards from the 2060 upwards are way too much.

    NVidia's price points on cards like the 2060 and 2070 are far more mental than something like the TU102 cards as the former are used by the vast majority people.
     
  4. 4K8KW10

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 2, 2017

    Posts: 5,097

    Why? The HGV is built to take heavy loads, while the other just moves fast when there is no resistance ... ?!
     
  5. HRL

    Hitman

    Joined: Nov 22, 2005

    Posts: 809

    Location: London

    Fair enough. I always thought the Titan cards were aimed above the gaming tier.

    Absolutely right about the prices of all the Turing cards though. I’d set my sights on the next Ti 12 months ago and originally only anticipated spending £800 or so. I was rather reluctant to spend over £1K but performance-wise, I’ve no regrets with my Zotac.

    Would I have purchased an R7 instead? No, don’t think the performance is good enough even if the price is slightly more reasonable.
     
  6. Kaapstad

    Man of Honour

    Joined: May 21, 2012

    Posts: 27,662

    Location: Dalek flagship

    Where the Titan brand is aimed is a bit blurred as they have different capabilities.

    The Titan V (Volta) is a beast of a card for both professional DP work and gaming which makes its high asking price a bargain even now.

    The Titan Xp on the other hand is a bit of a wimp when it comes to professional work and really is no more than a slightly bigger faster 1080 Ti.

    The RTX Titan is somewhere between the two cards above, it is lacking in DP ability but the 24gb memory does have uses for professional work.

    For someone who wants the best value for money I would never recommend any of the Titans as there are always better options available.

    I do think that when the next gen of cards launches there will be some price reductions as NVidia have really shot themselves in the foot with the RTX card prices.
     
  7. D.P.

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 29,515


    If the goal is to get around the race track as fast as possible the HGV fails, despite its power.

    But really your whole concept is flawed. GPUs have thousands of cores. It is not up to the game to magucallybmake use ofbthem, that is the job of the driver and hardware. AMDs architecture is horribly inefficient. It goes for a brute force approach while Nvidia uses a complex and highly efficient and very balanced system to make sure the slightly lower resources are used better. AMD spends transistors on raw power, Nvidia on making the card as efficient as possible in real world gaming. Nvidia does a far better job keeping all cores busy and minimizing bottlenecks, using lossless compression to reduce bandwidth etc. AMD just throw more cores at the same GPU and hope that things scale.
     
  8. 4K8KW10

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 2, 2017

    Posts: 5,097

    Oh, come on with your fairy tales :D
    First of all the example with cars is stupid.
    Second is that when pushing pixels, you need as many cores as possible. This is why there are 4096 shaders and not 8 shaders.
    nvidia just cheats with things like their TWIMTP programmes and similar, like in Crysis 2 https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/t...icially-caught-cheating-in-crysis-2.18307621/

     
  9. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 26,327

    Location: Dormanstown.

    On that Crysis 2 thing.
    It worked for Nvidia because their GPU was better at tessellation performance.

    I don't know how people can fanboy so hard about products to the fact they invent fantasy.
    The VII isn't *better* than the 2080, end of.
     
  10. Shaz12

    Gangster

    Joined: Apr 25, 2017

    Posts: 276

    Its getting beaten by the 1080ti in some games which is a 2 year old card. Geforce optimised or not, it should keep up with the 2080 or at the very least not get beaten by the 1080ti 2 years later. Some games its barely faster than even the 2070
     
  11. 4K8KW10

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 2, 2017

    Posts: 5,097

    Trolling :D
     
  12. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 26,327

    Location: Dormanstown.

    For nigh on double the price.

    It'd cost me 400 pound at least to upgrade to a VII from my V64 for a meagre 25% gain.

    I'd be "happy" to buy this card at £500.

    But pretty much all the higher end offerings from both vendors are just taking the proverbial.
     
  13. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 26,327

    Location: Dormanstown.

    The only one who's trolling is you. That's literally all you do.
     
  14. 4K8KW10

    Soldato

    Joined: Sep 2, 2017

    Posts: 5,097

    But you just said that 2080 with 8 GB is better than the Radeon VII 16 GB which is nothing else but damn lie.

    Just be a man at least once and admit that nvidia are cheaters. What else is TWIMTBP and GPP programmes? What else is the inferior image quality that gives them performance advantage, so they look better in the benchmarks?
     
  15. pete910

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Oct 3, 2013

    Posts: 2,445

    It's a nice analogy however, bit floored though. I think the point that @4K8KW10 was trying to make that the hardware's not been used to it's potential as in If said HGV was racing around a track with what both are capable of pulling it would win.
     
  16. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 26,327

    Location: Dormanstown.

    You may want to actually look at what I said.
    I said the VII isn't better than the 2080. I mean they're basically around the same ball park performance, wins either side (Although I've seen some reviews which really don't paint the VII in a positive light, but I'd still consider them to be basically at parity overall). At the same price point I'd take a VII. But as their prices stand I'd take neither.

    Saying the VII's better in every single way is the only lie here.
     
  17. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 26,327

    Location: Dormanstown.

    Isn't there a whole thing about RTX not having its hardware used to its potential? (DLSS).

    It's a none point. End of the day, you buy a card and play games, its performance is its performance.
     
  18. vapor matt

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jan 19, 2003

    Posts: 1,761

    Location: west sussex

    I would say more like £320 to upgrade over a new vega64 for 25% performance gain, some times more than 25% gain. which isnt to bad considering how much extra you have to pay for the same gain from a 1080 to 2080 and even more 1080ti to 2080ti
    so over all £320 isnt so bad. I think it comes down to the end user and what they are prepared to pay for there next GPU. for vega 64 owners who dont wish to upgrade or pay the price needed is no diffrent to the 1080ti owners not willing to pay
    over double for the 2080ti upgrade.

    for me 16g of memory seems more future proof at 4k and was worth choosing the VII card, plus its compute ability's as i do more than gaming.
     
  19. pete910

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Oct 3, 2013

    Posts: 2,445

    Ain't it in BF5 and Tomdraider ? I know its 2 games but it's being used at least I guess

    Agreed, I was pointing out what I thought 4K8KW10 was trying to get at.
     
  20. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 26,327

    Location: Dormanstown.

    I can't sell my Vega 64 at the same price as new ones, so the upgrade price for everyone is at the second hand sale of their card taken away from the new pricing, so it's not really £320.

    I vote with my wallet, so I wouldn't be buying anything above my V64 until I'm able to buy an upgrade for the same price I paid for it.