Ranger or RM?

Trigger

Trigger

Trigger

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Joined
15 Dec 2004
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Hi,

At school, we're in the process of upgrading the network to support a new web design course next academic year. The last 'upgrade' was three years ago when we moved from an RM network of just 50 computers to a Ranger network of about 160 computers. The current network is run by a single 2GHz Xeon with 1GB RAM and the hard disk on it is rapidly filling up (It's an IDE disk- don't ask, Zentek did it) As I just mentioned, it was Zentek who installed this network. Clients computers vary really from 400-600MHz Celerons to 3GHz P4's. We've got 40 tablet computers which are pretty good supported by several wireless AP's and most of the staff now have laptops.

I don't want replies like 'they're both crap, you don't need them' as the network manager has decided to go for one of these management solutions but we're not quite sure which one yet. I also don't want replies like we're not doing you're job for you- it isn't my job either but i'm merely trying to help- we're just looking for people's opinions on which is the better software to use. The options are therefore either:

1.) RM

2.) Ranger AND Zentek Solutions

RM seems to be the cheaper software as it includes windows licenses (Have a site Win XP License but are currently using Win Server 2000 and will be intending using Server 2003 so we will need to get licenses one way or another) but it seems that it's liking taking a step back as we've used it before.

Really would appreciate any replies and people's experiences with either security suites :)

Thanks

Ben
 
I also work at a school and these network management apps are something being looked in to as well. Those are two of a fair few being investigated. There's an IT company in Canterbury that will happily arrange a free two hour demo of the Ranger Suite (a Ranger rep will be there) and this is something we're currently trying to arrange. I've heard a lot of good stuff about Ranger (excellent for network management and has a lot of useful tools for teachers as well) but until i've seen/tried it i can't really recommend them. :)

As for RM, someone from their support dept are coming to see me mid-February to see how our current network operates and will no doubt tell me all the great things RM would be able to do. I'll post back here once that's taken place.

Out of interest could you tell me a little more about your wireless network; how reliable it is, hardware etc. Thanks.

For info: Ranger Suite - http://www.rangersuite.com/
RM Community Connect 3 - http://www.primarycc3.rm.com/ and http://www.rm.com/Support/Portal.asp?title=Community Connect 3 Portal
 
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Thanks mate- really appreciate that :) As for the wireless network, well it's working quite well so far. Basically we have two trolleys, each holding 16 tablet computers. On top of the trolley (Both bolted down ;)) is a laser printer, wireless access point for the machines and a network switch. The switch is then plugged into a netowkr socket on the wall. All the chargers and stuff are onboard as well so the kids just plug them back in at the end of the lesson.

We've also got a few more access points dotted about to give the entire school wireless coverage for the staff laptops etc. The sports Hall also currently has a wireless link which seems good. We did this as it seemed cheaper than doing a fibre link down there :o We also have 8 spare tablets located in the server room which can be borrowed if a class does not have enough computers to go around (Class sizes vary widley) Reliability wise it seems fine. We had a few initial teething problems with Ranger Timing out because on some tablets the connection was too slow but we solved this with a patch from Ranger.

Thanks

Ben
 
Thanks back. I like the idea of the moveable trolleys etc...really good.

Just to clarify; a classroom full of students, during a lesson, accessing the same network resources/internet etc runs ok?

Also, you've kept the main wired network in place..just added access points around the school. That correct?

Sorry if i'm taking this a little OT.
 
Tried&Tested said:
Thanks back. I like the idea of the moveable trolleys etc...really good.

Just to clarify; a classroom full of students, during a lesson, accessing the same network resources/internet etc runs ok?
Click to expand...

Yeah, seems fine. Internet runs really well. One of the Geography applications we have running on a separate CD Server can get a little bogged down at times but all the other nwtwork resources and stuff on the cd server runs absolutley fine :)

Tried&Tested said:
Also, you've kept the main wired network in place..just added access points around the school. That correct?
Click to expand...
Yep, wired network is still there and constantly being added to- we seem to be having extra points installed all over the place lol :D The access points are just plugged in and out of students tampering reach so the entire school has access :cool:

Tried&Tested said:
Sorry if i'm taking this a little OT.
Click to expand...

No problems mate, glad I can help :)

Thanks

Ben
 
Trigger said:
RM seems to be the cheaper software as it includes windows licenses (Have a site Win XP License but are currently using Win Server 2000 and will be intending using Server 2003 so we will need to get licenses one way or another) but it seems that it's liking taking a step back as we've used it before.
Click to expand...

Can you elaborate on your licensing situation?

I've administered a Ranger network and the software is very easy to use. From what I remember its quite expensive with all the modules. IMO it was a good system for a simple network, but a bit too constrictive for my liking.
Unfortuently, I've not had any first hand experience with a RM network.

Is this a primary or secondry school?

Burnsy
 
It's a secondary school :) Basically, when we went from RM to Ranger, the school purchased a Education Site License from Microsoft so we can install XP as many times as we like. We also purchased two Windows Server 2000 Advanced licenses, one for the proxy server and one for the Ranger Server- we now want to upgrade to Windows Server 2003 with the new network.

If we buy RM, then for each Server Software package we buy from them, we will get a Windows Server 2003 license with it as well as their community connect license etc. Also, if we purchase thier client software, it also comes with an XP license key and a CAL for Windows Server 2003 whereas if we get Ranger, Ranger is what you get and nothing else :(

Thanks

Ben

EDIT: We already have Ranger BTW, we're just not sure whether it will be too small for our needs when we upgrade and get a fair few more machines as it gets very confusing when on multiple servers as you have to manually set all the policies on each server whereas with RM, you do it through the management console and it's on all of them...
 
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Sorry i cant help with your question as i have no experience of Ranger and have only just over a years experience of RM CC3. Currently working as an ICT Technician at a secondary school too.

I stumbled across the forum below and have been meaning to register for quite sometime. Might be a better place to ask as its more specific to school networks. Hope this is ok by the dons.

Link

HTH

P.S. where in the UK are you based?
 
Hi,

Thanks for the reply :) Going to sign up to that forum in a minute- all ready had a look around and it looks rather good. In Cheshire BTW :cool:

Cheers

Ben
 
From my own personal experience of Zentek I would stay clear. They expanded too rapidly and didn't employ enough staff to do the job properly.

I personally would say RM due to it being almost solely educational developed. I am a network manager in a secondary school with just under 300 pc's and we don't use anything like these. I have spoke to engineers who have installed both and said ranger was more troublesome. I haven't played with RM myself apart from an old 10+ years plus 3.11 network which was trouble free.

We are currently using net op remote control to control the workstations remotely but have everything locked down by group policies. It does take a lot longer this way but I now know where every setting is, and what affects it will have on our network.

The above might not be much use. Personally I would go with ranger. I do like RM though. When I looked at some info about it what caught my eye was that you can reboot a machine and it will check key files and if they have changed it'll reboot and reimage in a few minutes. I thought that was good.

Ste
 
I wouldn't consider the extra licences from RM any benifit. The 2003 upgrade licenses are cheap and the CALS are so cheap its not even worth thinking about.

Personally, I think you really should consider other solutions from other providers. There are loads out there and you really should explore them. I know this isn't being considered atm, but it should.

Burnsy
 
I think we are now definatley looking at Ranger software :) Do you think the network manager would be best installing it herself and when we purchase Ranger just get their support with it or getting Zentek in to do it? I know she has the ability to do it but I think it's more of a case of 'just in case things go wrong' sort of thing...

Thanks for any help

Ben
 
I would say get the help initially...no doubt these people have set it up properly on a load of networks. I thought you got a day's free training when purchasing Ranger Suite as well? Might be wrong.

I've got someone from RM coming in to visit in the first week back from half term. Will let you know how it goes. And i'm going to sort the Ranger visit out shortly after. Let them battle it out to impress me most.

My school's network was in such a state when i took over, but i'm looking forward to getting it running as it should. I'm in the Gravesham area and the government are pumping in a LOT of money (over 100million i think) to the area...and i want my slice. :)
 
Haha, thanks for the reply. The point about Ranger is that we already have it installed so know very well how all the settings work and Chris know her way around Ranger Administrator very well also so setting up the policies will also be no problem so it would probably easier if we stuck with Ranger and I'm convinced it would be far cheaper to do it ourselves. I run Windows Server 2003 at home so could probably assist with that. Ranger also have telephone support avaliable and most of our network problems at the moment are Ranger based so this would probably work out better...

Any more ideas?

Thanks

Ben
 
No one? Anyone else care to throw in their opinions on whether we would be better getting zentek/3rd party company in or doing the software installation ourselves?
 
Its hard to say, I havn't used Zentek, so I wouldn't be able to recommend them. As for a 3rd party company, it depends on the company and thier competence as well as value for money. Obviously if you have the technical abilty to do it yourself that is preferable, but if your not familiar with Ranger then you may need training, which is also an expense. What is the budget and how do they Sys Admins feel?

Burnsy
 
Thank you for your reply :)

I know we can install it ourselves, I think it's just a question of confidence. We've been using Ranger for three years now so are pretty confident in using it and setting it up. I've also just downloaded the new version of the manual from Ranger and it seems really easy to install- just like any other software package and the load balancing feature seems simple to set up as well.

The server setup is not a problem as we've both set up servers before, the only problem I can see is with ghost not liking connecting to the server shares so we may need to keep a Server 2000 box dedicated to ghost... On the budget front, just been told get the cheapest quote lol but obviously getting a 3rd party company in isn't going to be cheap :o

Thanks again,

Ben
 
If everyone is happy to install and maintain it themselves, then this is the best option in terms of cost and providing the best support to end users. But I would suggest just for piece of mind, make sure you get taining for all staff who are going to use the system in depth.

Ghost can be a pain connecting to servers with the images, I find a simple Win 98/2000 Pro box is good to ease the pain.

Burnsy
 
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