Really easy question about having 2 TVs

[Wayne666]

Hello

I am new to the forum but I've looked on here lots of time for advice, it's been very useful. I will try to give back, on this Home and Garden sub forum in particular as this is my speciality.

I have an easily solvable issue but I can't find the time to educate myself about how to sort it out (I'm getting old and out of touch with modern technology). If anyone can suggest a solution that'd be awesome.

I have a TV in my lounge, currently connected to sky but soon to be replaced by a Freesat box. I have a TV in my guest room which isn't connected to anything (though I can plug it into the computer to watch DVDs or youtube etc). What is the easiest/cheapest way to watch TV (a different channel to the lounge TV) in the guest room? ie: What hardware cables do I need to buy and what do I need to plug into what? I also have a wifi router and HDMI cables coming out of my ears. There is a RF socket it the guest room but the signal is terrible.

 

[Terminal_Boy]

Are you wanting to view different Freesat channels to those seen on the lounge TV on the TV in the guest room?

 

[Maundie]

Depends on what connections the TV has and what you are wanting to watch.

If you just want to watch freeview connect a box to the RF socket (although you've said signal isn't that good), if you want to watch freesat then you need a freesat box connected to the TV with associated cables running to the satellite dish, if the TV has HDMI connection you could use various on-demand devices like Amazon Fire TV or Now TV box (although they will need separate subscriptions to get the most out of them).

 

[mmj_uk]

How many cables goes from your dish to your sky box in the lounge? if there's two cables and recording is not important to you with freesat then just extend one of the cables.

 

[lucid]

You haven't said what type of property it is and whether its your own dish or a communal system. I am going to presume it's your own house and you currently have a Sky box capable of recording, therefore it has twin cables connecting it to the dish. Should that be the case, then it's extremely likely that the dish has an LNB with four outputs, and currently two are free for use. However, all bets are off if you live in a block of flats.

What I would do immediately is get out the ladders and go swap the cables at the dish to the unused sockets to test that the LNB works. The Sky box has a signal strength display in the Services > Signal sub menu. Use it for a before and after comparison. You're looking for 70% or more on the bar scale.

Once you know that all four outputs on the LNB are good, then go ahead and have a twin cable routed to the second room. Add a second Freesat HD recorder. Job done.

An alternative practical solution is to get the TV aerial system working. There are a few more hurdles here because line-of-sight to the transmitter is important. This means that if there are whacking great trees in the direction your neighbours aerials are pointing, and they complain about poor or intermittent signal, then I would stick with satellite reception.

For you, IP-based solutions fall in to two camps. You're either restricted to catch-up services and the Web pages that stream TV live. Catch-up is okay but only covers a small portion of the broadcast output. "Web TV" is fairly ropey from what I have experienced.

The other option is hardware that catches the signal output from some or other tuner/receiver/recorder box and then IP-ises it for in-house transmission over a home network. The problem there is it is limited to showing what's on the main lounge box.

Personally, I would stick with Freesat in your case, or explore having the TV aerial sorted and get a signal to both the bedroom and lounge.

 

[Wayne666]

Are you wanting to view different Freesat channels to those seen on the lounge TV on the TV in the guest room?

I need to be able to view different channels on each TV.

... if you want to watch freesat then you need a freesat box connected to the TV with associated cables running to the satellite dish, if the TV has HDMI connection you could use various on-demand devices like Amazon Fire TV or Now TV box (although they will need separate subscriptions to get the most out of them).

I guess it has to be freesat as the terrestrial signal is so weak. I don't really want to subscribe to anything but I was wondering if there was some sort of freeview usb stick that got it's signal from the home wifi?

How many cables goes from your dish to your sky box in the lounge? if there's two cables and recording is not important to you with freesat then just extend one of the cables.

There is 1 CABLE from the dish to the sky box. I can install a second cable if there is a socket on the sky dish to run to the guest room. The freesat box I have coming can record. I guess I need to buy a second box for the guest room.

You haven't said what type of property it is and whether its your own dish or a communal system. I am going to presume it's your own house and you currently have a Sky box capable of recording, therefore it has twin cables connecting it to the dish. Should that be the case, then it's extremely likely that the dish has an LNB with four outputs, and currently two are free for use. However, all bets are off if you live in a block of flats..

Yup my own house. It's a sky dish and was installed about 3 years ago so it could well be the one with 4 outputs (will check when I get home).

What I would do immediately is get out the ladders and go swap the cables at the dish to the unused sockets to test that the LNB works. The Sky box has a signal strength display in the Services > Signal sub menu. Use it for a before and after comparison. You're looking for 70% or more on the bar scale.

Once you know that all four outputs on the LNB are good, then go ahead and have a twin cable routed to the second room. Add a second Freesat HD recorder. Job done.

That sounds easy enough. I'll give it a go.

An alternative practical solution is to get the TV aerial system working. There are a few more hurdles here because line-of-sight to the transmitter is important. This means that if there are whacking great trees in the direction your neighbours aerials are pointing, and they complain about poor or intermittent signal, then I would stick with satellite reception..

My house is in a bit of a valley. The previous owner had a signal booster but it required a socket that looked like a hypodermic needle and I struggled to reliably fudge the connections together. The signal booster I then bought that fitted all the connections didn't actually help me get any signal at all. In the end I gave up and waited weeks for sky man to come and fit my dish. I was stuck on my contract with them anyway (that contract's now expired).

For you, IP-based solutions fall in to two camps. You're either restricted to catch-up services and the Web pages that stream TV live. Catch-up is okay but only covers a small portion of the broadcast output. "Web TV" is fairly ropey from what I have experienced.

The other option is hardware that catches the signal output from some or other tuner/receiver/recorder box and then IP-ises it for in-house transmission over a home network. The problem there is it is limited to showing what's on the main lounge box.

Personally, I would stick with Freesat in your case, or explore having the TV aerial sorted and get a signal to both the bedroom and lounge.

yeah, I think I'll borrow a freeview box just to see if I it works. Then probably do the dish to second freesat box thing.


Thank you everyone. I do have a clearer understanding of what I need to do now.

 

[lucid]

My house is in a bit of a valley. The previous owner had a signal booster but it required a socket that looked like a hypodermic needle and I struggled to reliably fudge the connections together. The signal booster I then bought that fitted all the connections didn't actually help me get any signal at all. In the end I gave up and waited weeks for sky man to come and fit my dish. I was stuck on my contract with them anyway (that contract's now expired).

BIB, I come across this quite frequently when people move house. Often it's because they don't really understand the bits of gear behind the TV, so presume that any box with aerial cables in and out and a power lead must automatically be a booster. It's an easy mistake to make too, especially as some designs of masthead power supply and set back amp look very similar.

The common problem with an aerial system not working after the "booster" was removed is that it's not a booster at all. It's a power supply. The bit that does the boosting is up by the aerial. It's called a masthead amplifier. Since it is both difficult and dangerous to put 240V up on an outdoor aerial installation then there's a different way of powering the device.

The answer is a phantom power supply. That's what a masthead amp power supply is. It uses the aerial cable as a way to transport power up to the amplifier. This works because certain types of signal will co-exist in a cable without interfering with each other. Power over Ethernet (PoE) is another example of phantom powering.

Without a power supply the masthead amp will not work. That doesn't just mean it won't amplify. It means it will block the signal completely.


The "hypodermic" connections you refer to are satellite type F connections. These are slowly replacing the TV aerial-type Belling-Lee plugs for all the connections from the aerial itself down to just before the wall plate or setback connection. The screw-on connectors are easier for consumers to fit, and they tend to stay connected rather than working loose over time.

The pointy end is because the centre core has been cut at an angle rather than straight across. This shows that the installer knew how to finish the connector correctly as the pointy end makes it easier to insert the plug in to the female F socket.

yeah, I think I'll borrow a freeview box just to see if I it works.

Why are you planning to borrow a Freeview box when it sounds like the aerial system isn't working? It's pointless.

Freeview is TV aerial
Freesat is satellite dish A.K.A Sky dish
The two TV transmission systems are not the same and the recorders are not interchangeable.

All modern TVs have a Freeview tuner. If you want to test whether the aerial system is working, then just plug in to the TV. wouldn't bother though until you know for sure what gear you have (aerial alone or aerial + masthead amp).

If you meant "borrow a Freesat box" then again why? Freesat and Sky use the same dish position and satellite signals. The difference is that the Sky box has access to more channels and uses a different EPG. So long as Sky works, and you do the cable swap at the LNB-end to check all outputs work, then that's all you need to do. When you get a Freesat box then it will work. Simple as that.

 

[Wayne666]

Without a power supply the masthead amp will not work. That doesn't just mean it won't amplify. It means it will block the signal completely..

That explains a lot. Now I know what that little grey box in the eaves is for. I think I still have the power supply kicking around somewhere.

Why are you planning to borrow a Freeview box when it sounds like the aerial system isn't working? It's pointless..

I thought I'd just give it another try. I know the difference between freeview and freesat (as of yesterday ). Now I know about this masthead amp thing Freeview is probably my better option as all the cables are already in place. Thanks

 

[RoyMi6]

Thank you everyone. I do have a clearer understanding of what I need to do now.

Just to throw another idea out there - if it's genuniely a geust room, used by guests for short periods of time, you could avoid all this hassle by getting a something like a Roku of FireTV stick for about £80.

Saying that, we've currently gone without live TV for about 8 months and never really had a problem, relying exclusively on our Amazon Fire TV and Prime account.

If you've already got a Amazon Prime or Netflix account that will give them a load of great content to watch, and even if you don't being able to access all the catchup services, live BBC and YouTube means that it's basically unlimited stuff to watch regardless.

Much cheaper and easier if you can forgo live freeview TV and makedo with other stuff.

 

[Puzzled]

For ease of use I'd just get the aerial fixed and either use the built in tv tuner or buy a second hand Youview box cheap.

If you are in a bad area for freeview then freesat and run a second cable to the other room.

You can get a network based tv tuners like the HDHomerun and then use a fire stick in the other room but its not a great experience and if you want to record then you'll need to set up a computer as a server.

Depends how much it will be used really, if its just occasionally then you might get a away with a fire tv stick and just watch on demand content on iPlayer / ITV HUB / 4OD etc

 

[Wayne666]

I checked the signal strength on the spare pair of dish outputs as suggested and it's better than the pair I had it on.