Remote job - Now need to attend in person meetings?

Richeh

Richeh

Richeh

Soldato
Joined
24 Jul 2003
Posts
3,349
Location
South East Coast
Hey,

I don't know if anyone could help with this but would just put it out there.

I have fairly severe depression/anxiety related issues. Specifically with travelling to unknown locations. I live very remotely and am technically closer to France than to London - I took a remote job for this reason which I believe I am fairly good at.

My original manager advised me that they have occasional meetings in person (London) but it would never be mandatory to attend. However, they left last July and my new manager who I have explained all my issues to accepted these and 'seemed' to understand. I did however, attend a 'Christmas meeting' in December to meet people but despite the 3.5-4 hour travel time and being doped up on Diazempam found the main meeting applied to say 15 minutes relevant to me in a 2 hour meeting. I thought I was done as it were.

My workload for my job has increased 3 fold with essentially 0.7 extra persons added to help (part time, very good but 3 days per week).

However, I recently got a group email advising that they want us to now do I believe at least 3 meetings in person per year in the London office (which has now change from the office I originally visited). I genuinely wish travelling for me was a barrier to overcome but it's not. The instant I got the email about this I basically feel a panic attack coming on and it is just constantly on my mind. Again I have previously explained this to my new manager who seemed to understand but I feel backed into a corner as I don't want to lose this job as it suits me and my lifestyle but is not a well paying job by any means and again I live very remotely so London is at the very least 3+ hours. On top of that it is not a 'day off actual work' situation. If I arrive 'early' say 11am you are expected to whip out the company supplied laptop and work as normal until the meeting - which again I presume will contain about 15-20 minutes of relevant info to my actual job that could happily be accessed remotely.

Do I have a leg to stand on here to say 'I have told you about my issues, I attended the meeting in December to say hello but it affected my 'mental' severely etc etc I am thinking of putting this in an email as previously it was verbal via Skype call so technically 'no evidence'. I did inform a couple of my co-workers about my issues, again verbally but they were understanding.

I don't want to lose this job as it suits me but do I have any recourse to just refuse and state my issues again and just say no? I would love to be able to say yeah no problem I will come but after 30+ years of existence and attempting to overcome these issues it hasn't worked. I don't want to take more medication to be able to handle this and just want to honor my original position of a remote worker.

This may be way too deep for a lot of people but I am coming around to the legality of it as I have expressed my concerns previous to the Decemember meeting I did attend.

Any help appreciated.
 
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I think ultimately a lot of your defence will come down to the wording in your contract. If it's fully remote and specifically states that, with no mention of visiting an office then you could argue on those grounds.

However, as I suspect in most cases for remote workers, you may be expected to be able to attend an office as and when needed. I know my contract says something like this.

Have you been at your job for at least 2 years? I guess you've got a couple of options:
- anytime an in-person meeting is scheduled email your manager to outline your reasonings for not being able to attend.
- if the meetings are arranged a reasonable amount in advance you could book some time off as annual leave, although you'll probably only get away with this a few times
- assuming your sickness record is good, you could phone in sick on the day, but again you'll only get away with this once or twice.

If your contract does state that you may be requested to attend an office, and your new manager is quite insistent on visiting then I think it'll only be a matter of time before you have to go in.
 
I'm working remotely too and was lined up for promotion then suddenly that role required travel so I had to turn it down.

I think it's unlikely they fire you over it - because they're obviously under-staffed, and because it would be bad press, and it's just not worth the cost of hiring a new person over it. So I'd say stand your ground. Of course if it's in your contract there's nothing you can do if they don't see it that way.

I noticed a systemic issue in job ads too where the job is advertised as remote then you speak to them it turns out to be hybrid. To me remote is 100% remote and hybrid is anything less. It should at least be set out in job ads so applicants can save everyone from wasting their time. That said, there are other remote jobs if you end up needing one.
 
Does your contract specifically state you will never ever have to visit the office? If not, this could lead to a difficult situation. If you're valued as an employee then your manager/employer is far more likely to make exceptions for you.

I can't comment on the mental health aspect; I don't know how that sort of thing is viewed in employment law in the UK.
 
are you sure it is an issue? before you lose any more sleep over it talk to your manager, it could be a boiler plate bulk mail was sent out but you will get special dispensation or at least a compromise offered (you can skip 2 meetings but you must come to 1 for instance).
our team has a general policy of 3 core days in the office and 2 WFH but despite that 1 only comes in once a week and one once a month.
perhaps get a doctor's note if it is that bad explaining how I'll it makes you....I know you told your manager but something more official may helpm

good luck
 
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Richeh said:
Hey,

I don't know if anyone could help with this but would just put it out there.

I have fairly severe depression/anxiety related issues. Specifically with travelling to unknown locations. I live very remotely and am technically closer to France than to London - I took a remote job for this reason which I believe I am fairly good at.

My original manager advised me that they have occasional meetings in person (London) but it would never be mandatory to attend. However, they left last July and my new manager who I have explained all my issues to accepted these and 'seemed' to understand. I did however, attend a 'Christmas meeting' in December to meet people but despite the 3.5-4 hour travel time and being doped up on Diazempam found the main meeting applied to say 15 minutes relevant to me in a 2 hour meeting. I thought I was done as it were.

My workload for my job has increased 3 fold with essentially 0.7 extra persons added to help (part time, very good but 3 days per week).

However, I recently got a group email advising that they want us to now do I believe at least 3 meetings in person per year in the London office (which has now change from the office I originally visited). I genuinely wish travelling for me was a barrier to overcome but it's not. The instant I got the email about this I basically feel a panic attack coming on and it is just constantly on my mind. Again I have previously explained this to my new manager who seemed to understand but I feel backed into a corner as I don't want to lose this job as it suits me and my lifestyle but is not a well paying job by any means and again I live very remotely so London is at the very least 3+ hours. On top of that it is not a 'day off actual work' situation. If I arrive 'early' say 11am you are expected to whip out the company supplied laptop and work as normal until the meeting - which again I presume will contain about 15-20 minutes of relevant info to my actual job that could happily be accessed remotely.

Do I have a leg to stand on here to say 'I have told you about my issues, I attended the meeting in December to say hello but it affected my 'mental' severely etc etc I am thinking of putting this in an email as previously it was verbal via Skype call so technically 'no evidence'. I did inform a couple of my co-workers about my issues, again verbally but they were understanding.

I don't want to lose this job as it suits me but do I have any recourse to just refuse and state my issues again and just say no? I would love to be able to say yeah no problem I will come but after 30+ years of existence and attempting to overcome these issues it hasn't worked. I don't want to take more medication to be able to handle this and just want to honor my original position of a remote worker.

This may be way too deep for a lot of people but I am coming around to the legality of it as I have expressed my concerns previous to the Decemember meeting I did attend.

Any help appreciated.
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I think you need to have this conversation with your manager first and foremost.

In my experience these sorts of 'rules' are dreampt up by bean-counters or HR people trying to justify their existence, and will suddenly not be a big deal and be dropped as soon as it comes down to letting one valuable employee break said rule, or letting them go, although it may be a case of making sure the right person in the company hears about the case (i.e. someone more senior thatn the bean counter that made it up).
 
mid_gen said:
I think you need to have this conversation with your manager first and foremost.

In my experience these sorts of 'rules' are dreampt up by bean-counters or HR people trying to justify their existence, and will suddenly not be a big deal and be dropped as soon as it comes down to letting one valuable employee break said rule, or letting them go, although it may be a case of making sure the right person in the company hears about the case (i.e. someone more senior thatn the bean counter that made it up).
Click to expand...
To add to this...if you are medically unable to travel (which sounds like you are), then you're employer is I believe legally required to make reasonable dispensation to accommodate your disability.

IANAL but I would definitely look into that side of it if you really want the job. May be worth speaking to CAB.
 
Richeh said:
Hey,

I don't know if anyone could help with this but would just put it out there.

I have fairly severe depression/anxiety related issues. Specifically with travelling to unknown locations. I live very remotely and am technically closer to France than to London - I took a remote job for this reason which I believe I am fairly good at.

My original manager advised me that they have occasional meetings in person (London) but it would never be mandatory to attend. However, they left last July and my new manager who I have explained all my issues to accepted these and 'seemed' to understand. I did however, attend a 'Christmas meeting' in December to meet people but despite the 3.5-4 hour travel time and being doped up on Diazempam found the main meeting applied to say 15 minutes relevant to me in a 2 hour meeting. I thought I was done as it were.

My workload for my job has increased 3 fold with essentially 0.7 extra persons added to help (part time, very good but 3 days per week).

However, I recently got a group email advising that they want us to now do I believe at least 3 meetings in person per year in the London office (which has now change from the office I originally visited). I genuinely wish travelling for me was a barrier to overcome but it's not. The instant I got the email about this I basically feel a panic attack coming on and it is just constantly on my mind. Again I have previously explained this to my new manager who seemed to understand but I feel backed into a corner as I don't want to lose this job as it suits me and my lifestyle but is not a well paying job by any means and again I live very remotely so London is at the very least 3+ hours. On top of that it is not a 'day off actual work' situation. If I arrive 'early' say 11am you are expected to whip out the company supplied laptop and work as normal until the meeting - which again I presume will contain about 15-20 minutes of relevant info to my actual job that could happily be accessed remotely.

Do I have a leg to stand on here to say 'I have told you about my issues, I attended the meeting in December to say hello but it affected my 'mental' severely etc etc I am thinking of putting this in an email as previously it was verbal via Skype call so technically 'no evidence'. I did inform a couple of my co-workers about my issues, again verbally but they were understanding.

I don't want to lose this job as it suits me but do I have any recourse to just refuse and state my issues again and just say no? I would love to be able to say yeah no problem I will come but after 30+ years of existence and attempting to overcome these issues it hasn't worked. I don't want to take more medication to be able to handle this and just want to honor my original position of a remote worker.

This may be way too deep for a lot of people but I am coming around to the legality of it as I have expressed my concerns previous to the Decemember meeting I did attend.

Any help appreciated.
Click to expand...

As others have said, it comes down to your contract.

Unfortunately, people do not understand any form of social anxiety. The average person has no idea how bad it can be. Especially if it is matched with "avoidance". But, I don't think you have any choice. Tell them you will go, but also explain to them that it causes you great anxiety, and to you, it's like being a fish and looking out of a goldfish bowl, and to them, you will be like a squirrel in headlights. Apologise upfront, but show willing. Don't fight it, or you will just end up being fired.

One thing, it is a nightmare, yes, but you will be incredibly proud of yourself if you go. And, once you have been, you will feel a bit better about going again.
 
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From an outsider view I think you should consider the employers point of view first so you set the table properly. I understand you have personal issues but if you can factor in that your employer isn't being massively unreasonable or overbearing it'll help maintain a balanced assessment.

Try weigh in how valuable or replaceable your skill set is Vs how likely you are to find a similar job getting working conditions above and beyond what your current employer is offering. Personally I'd be of the view if I had an otherwise great situation, except for 2 trips to the office a year, I might be inclined to go back to the doctors to change the therapy sessions or medications. If you can walk into a better situation at another firm start looking.

Ultimately if you can't negotiate an outcome satisfactory to all it comes down to the wording in the contracts signed. Get copies of these in case you need to take objections formal as a last resort.
 
Richeh said:
If I arrive 'early' say 11am you are expected to whip out the company supplied laptop and work as normal until the meeting - which again I presume will contain about 15-20 minutes of relevant info to my actual job that could happily be accessed remotely.
Click to expand...

If you've got a good relationship with your manager then maybe you could mention this but in a wider context I'd perhaps avoid going down the route of this meeting is a waste of my time/I don't think it's important as others perhaps inc your manager and other managers may well consider it to be important. Just focus on the MH aspect.

As mentioned above by another poster if you're remote what does your contract say about this sort of thing? That should really have been the first thing you checked, I know no one reads T&Cs for subscription services, software licenses and just clicks yes etc. but people really, really should read employment contracts.

Verbal agreements are iffy, you weren't lied to (the other risk) but they're worthless when the person leaves (as you found out). Ideally you ask for this in your contract but it's a bit late for that now (unless you get a new contract with a promo in future) another approach could be say an e-mail, inc HR confirming that it's not expected of you.

Suppose your Dr or therapist confirms your anxiety diagnosis and requests accommodations from your employer, you send the letter to your manager/HR, then you get an e-mail from HR confirming you're not required to attend meetings then you're covered for future managers.

The other thing you could do is speak to an employment lawyer, find out what is or isn't reasonable in terms of accommodations for your MH issues etc.
 
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