Samsung SyncMaster 215TW Good or Bad

Caporegime
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Still struggling to decide between a "quality" 20" or a "less quality" 22" when I came across the Samsung SyncMaster 215TW for £169.95 inc.

From what I can make out, it's an MVA panel (correct?) and 21".

Can anybody advise me what the screen is like? Is it as good as the decent 20" screens?

If it is then with the extra 1", i'll order one this weekend. :D
 
It's S-PVA from Samsung, but close enough :) plenty of review links and user opinions here which should help. It's a good screen, a little lacking in terms of responsiveness though
 
You seem to be a guru of tft, badass :D

I followed your link and although some reviews mentioned the responsiveness, some thought it was good.

I have searched around and looked at reviews. A lot of reviews state the response is no worse than a TN panel - is this true?

But they also say that the image and colours are better on the samsung over TN monitors - true?

I would love the NEC but unless I can find a second hand one, the new ones are way out of my price league - almost 24" money :eek:

So how does the samsung compare with the viewsonic, belinea, nec etc 20" monitors? slightly worse on speed but on par on quality?

Many thanks
 
Greebo said:
I have searched around and looked at reviews. A lot of reviews state the response is no worse than a TN panel - is this true?

You've got to remember here that the 215TW was released quite a while ago, over a year ago in fact, and so reviews at the time would be comparing it with TN Film based screens also released around then. You can compare responsiveness to a degree using the images here. You can see that the 215TW is certainly nowhere near as fast as some of the other models around like the NEC 20WGX2.

The problem you have with the responsiveness of the 215TW is that it was part of Samsung's first generation of overdriven panels. Previously, PVA panels were pretty poor for gaming, with a maximum ISO response time (black > white > black) of about 12ms. Grey to grey transitions were much slower, and there weren't really any decent PVA panels for gamers. When overdrive technologies began to emerge, Samsung's first generation was specified with a supposed 8ms G2G response time. In practice however, the 8ms G2G PVA generation was nowhere near as good as that, and didn't really show any noticeable improvement in real use, when compared with the previous 12ms non-overdriven generation. If you look at the response time graph for the 215TW as recorded by Tom's Hardware you can also see that it's nowhere near 8ms G2G at any point:

latency.gif


There were some improvements across grey transitions since the non overdriven panels, but meanwhile other panel manufacturers were having much more luck boosting responsiveness in both specs and practice. You can tell by the images in the BeHardware review that the 8ms G2G generation of P-MVA panels (from AU Optronics) were greatly improved since their non overdriven generation. TN Film models were also showing good improvements. It wasn't until Samsung's second attempt when we saw their 6ms G2G rated generation, that we saw real improvement in practice for PVA panels.


For this reason, I'd be careful about saying the 215TW was suitable for much gaming. It obviously depends on your needs, your gaming habits and whether you think you would be susceptable to things like ghosting and blurring. You may well find it's perfectly adequate, but it's more of a gamble than other faster models out there for sure. The 8ms G2G PVA generation tends to be comparable in practice to the old non-overdriven 8ms TN Film generation, but certainly won't compete with modern TN Film offerings (Viewsonic VX922, Samsung SM226BW, Samsung SM206BW etc)

But they also say that the image and colours are better on the samsung over TN monitors - true?

PVA does offer it's advantages. Picture quality on the 215TW is supposed to be very good, nice and crisp and clear. Colour accuracy is good (after calibration certainly), panel uniformity is good. Black depth is also good on PVA panels as shown by the high contrast ratio. The panel is also 8-bit and so offers a 16.7 million colour palette without the need for frame rate control technologies used in TN Film models.

So how does the samsung compare with the viewsonic, belinea, nec etc 20" monitors? slightly worse on speed but on par on quality?

depends which models, but yes, i'd say responsiveness is behind other 20" models around, but PQ and other factors are certainly good.

hth
 
Thanks for taking the time with your comprenhensive answer. Much appreciated.

As far as ghosting/lag goes, i'm upgrading from a HITACHI CML174SXW. Can't remember what type of panel this was but the speed is 16ms and I have never noticed any ghosting/lag on this so I don't think my eyes are very good at spotting it - which is a good thing :D

Therefore, I'm guessing whatever monitor I choose, including the 21" samsung, is going to be an improvement on what I have and if I don't notice any problems in games now, I certainly won't on the new monitors?

I like the sound of a PVA monitor if only for colour accruacy and depth of black so which 20"/21" monitors have either the second generation 6ms G2G rated sumsung panels or the better 8ms G2G generation of P-MVA panels (from AU Optronics)?

Since I only seem to uprgade my monitor every 4 years, I may as well try to get something that I can live with for that long :D
 
Greebo said:
Thanks for taking the time with your comprenhensive answer. Much appreciated.

As far as ghosting/lag goes, i'm upgrading from a HITACHI CML174SXW. Can't remember what type of panel this was but the speed is 16ms and I have never noticed any ghosting/lag on this so I don't think my eyes are very good at spotting it - which is a good thing :D

Therefore, I'm guessing whatever monitor I choose, including the 21" samsung, is going to be an improvement on what I have and if I don't notice any problems in games now, I certainly won't on the new monitors?

I like the sound of a PVA monitor if only for colour accruacy and depth of black so which 20"/21" monitors have either the second generation 6ms G2G rated sumsung panels or the better 8ms G2G generation of P-MVA panels (from AU Optronics)?

Since I only seem to uprgade my monitor every 4 years, I may as well try to get something that I can live with for that long :D

no worries mate :) The Hitachi was an old 16ms TN Film panel from AU Optronics, if you find that fine then you should have no issues with the 215TW so that's a good thing :)

As for models with 8ms P-MVA panels, there were a few, but not readily available now because TN Film became more widespread in this sector. there was however: Viewsonis VX2025WM, Fujitsu-Siemens S20-1W, Belinea 102035W / 102030W which were quite common

I can't think of any 20"/21" models using the 6ms G2G PVA generation, they were more used in other sizes like 19", 24" models
 
Greebo said:
Therefore, I'm guessing whatever monitor I choose, including the 21" samsung, is going to be an improvement on what I have and if I don't notice any problems in games now, I certainly won't on the new monitors?
Just one thing about gaming - although your Hitachi wasn't a quick screen by todays standards in terms of response time, it may still have less lag than the 215TW. Lag and ghosting shouldn't be confused, they're not the same thing (although the response time will contribute to the total lag). I saw some photos someone took of the 215TW cloned with a CRT with clocks running on both screen, and they were getting over 60 ms of lag on the 215TW which is pretty high and means the image you're seeing is 3-5 frames behind the game. Some people would notice it, some would be completely oblivious to it. I guess it depends how seriously you take your gaming and how quick the games you play are.
 
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