Self Employment

mmcg1

mmcg1

mmcg1

Associate
Joined
6 Nov 2017
Posts
28
I arranged to meet with a local brewery about a potential job and then sent an email asking about the salary just in case we were both wasting each other's time. This is what I got back:

Pay would depend on the level of commitment to the cause! I am currently preparing the business for a sustained increase in cask/keg production. A new approach to sales and marketing is steadily increasing turnover and this will benefit everyone in the brewery. I'm looking for an effective and enthusiastic brewer to take over the day to day running of production from me so I can manage the business more effectively.

One point you need to know is that we are all self employed at xxxxx, completely flexible of hours worked, holidays taken, as long as production and quality is maintained... Still interested?"
Click to expand...

Should I run a mile? It sounds a bit dodgy to me as it's essentially a full time, permanent position.
 
That's fine as long as they're paying a contractors wage...the problem comes when they're trying to pay a standard permie salary
 
As Tom says, is the salary they're offering better than what you'd expect from a regular full time contracted position?

Also need to consider things like holiday pay, sick pay, pension etc - as i'd suspect if they're saying you're "self-employed" they wouldn't be paying/contributing to these three things.
 
I've never been self-employed before.

They never mentioned a salary so I can only assume I'd be working for similar pay to what I'm on at the moment with the added stress/responsibility of no holiday/pension/sick pay/job security and own taxes/NI. The reluctance to not even mention a vague range is a bit worrying as well.
 
Wouldn't this be inside IR35? In which case you're getting all of the downsides of being self employed without the benefits of tax efficiency.

They would need to be paying very good rates for this to make sense.
 
As a very very approximate, employed by a company to contractor, you need to double your employment salary to make up for the various benefits employment has.
 
So you ask about the salary and he replies with a load of faff.

Think that says it all.
 
There's nothing wrong with being self employed. But the rate has to be sufficient to cover all the loss of benefits above, plus the inherent risk of not have a job a week from now, plus the risk of IR35.

If the rate is high enough then go for it. If it isn't then walk away. It does sound like the moon on a stick though, judging by the waffle.
 
From my experience, when they say things like 'competitive salary' etc. It means that the pay is really bad, otherwise if it was good they would put it up as it would attract more candidates.
 
IC3 said:
From my experience, when they say things like 'competitive salary' etc. It means that the pay is really bad, otherwise if it was good they would put it up as it would attract more candidates.
Click to expand...

I hate when companies use this practice as well.

I guess it stops people trying their luck saying they already earn at the upper bounds of the salary range.

But it also potentially wastes everyone's time, i remember applying for a job at a much smaller company many years ago, and the salary wasn't divulged on the advert. When i turned up for an interview and they asked my current salary, they basically said there and then that they wouldn't be able to match what i was currently on.
 
You need to tread very carefully and take advice from a professional accountant. Did you contact the Brewers' Company as I suggested in your other thread?
 
Tell them to do one. If they want employees they can hire people.

If they don't want an employee they can pay you the 30% extra you'll need to cover yourself for the things they are shirking responsibility for.
 
mid_gen said:
If they don't want an employee they can pay you the 30% extra you'll need to cover yourself for the things they are shirking responsibility for.
Click to expand...

ITYM 100% extra. The OP's professional indemnity insurance is going to be huge, for starters.
 
mmcg1 said:
I've never been self-employed before.

They never mentioned a salary so I can only assume I'd be working for similar pay to what I'm on at the moment with the added stress/responsibility of no holiday/pension/sick pay/job security and own taxes/NI. The reluctance to not even mention a vague range is a bit worrying as well.
Click to expand...

Well if that is the case then no reason to take the job - but surely if he's not mentioned a figure it is for you to negotiate. If he doesn't want to pay appropriately then you've no longer got a dilemma and can write this one off.
 
It's illegal for these reasons.
If you...
...can decide what to do, where to provide your services, when to work and how you do your work
...risk your own money in your work
...can make a loss as well as a profit from your work
...provide the main items of equipment you need to do your job
...are free to hire other people to do the work you have taken on, or to take on helpers at your own expense
...are responsible for correcting unsatisfactory work in your own time and at your own expense.

Otherwise your an employee.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom