Shock letter

~J~

~J~

~J~

Soldato
Joined
20 Oct 2003
Posts
7,558
Location
London
Advice please!

Got home tonight, and there's a letter from a debt company saying I owe them £1451.51p. In short, it's from a loan with the HFC bank.

Now I'm a VERY careful person with money, have an excellent memory and know 100% I have no debt.

So I called.

They inform me of the following facts:

They have on their records that a "Jason Hirst" from Doncaster took out a loan several years ago, but can't say when because seeing as I have refused to accept the debt, it might not be the "Jason Hirst" they are referring to.

The debt is at an address that I haven't lived in since 2000.

They (the debt collectors) bought the debt from HFC in January 2006 and have been chasing me since.

They have spoken to someone already who has refused to pay the debt.

They do NOT have my date of birth or know what the debt is for, but 'think' it's probably a personal loan or credit card.


Now what I'm REALLY bothered over is that I've lived in Swansea for 5 years, NEVER heard of these people and suddenly got it tonight. The fact that 'someone' has refused to accept this debt, but they have my old address (which I did live at), but they don't have my date of birth. There is absolutely no way I've got this debt with them (never heard of them at all!!!) but I'm both worried, concerned and totally baffled as to what's gone off!

First thing in my mind is identity theft. But this 'debt' was supposedly took out at my old address which I haven't lived at for nearly 6 years, they only have "J Hirst", I nearly always sign things or enter agreements with "Jason M. Hirst" and they don't have my date of birth, surely a proper financial agreement should have this. And if this IS nearly 6 years ago, it wasn't as big as it is now (or am I been a bit naive)

Then I thought, well Have I? Have I forgot about something? But surely if I had (which I haven't), why nearly 6 years to get hold of me?

And finally I thought maybe it's a genuine mistake. But even if it was, how has details about me, my name and address been entered onto a computer system that I've never had any dealings with?

Anyone think of what I can do? I'm absolutely gobsmacked and just can't comprehend how I can prove that I have never heard of them or don't owe them anything if they've already got so much about me!
 
HFC are the credit company for a competitor (think indian food) when you get finance with them, it then turns into a loan with a ridiculous high interest rate.
 
Done that. They've refused.

Why?

Because I'm not prepared to accept the debt and believe that they've got the wrong person, they won't send it out to me because of the data protection act!

Crazy innit?
 
~J~ said:
Done that. They've refused.

Why?

Because I'm not prepared to accept the debt and believe that they've got the wrong person, they won't send it out to me because of the data protection act!

Crazy innit?
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Inform them theyy have to supply a copy of the (signed) credit agreement when requested - send them a letter stating that you do not accept the debt as being yours, and request it under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, include a cheque for £1 (but make it clear that that is purely for the cost of the copy of the agreement).

They legally cannot enforce any debt without the signed agreement, or when it it is in legitimate dispute.

If they still refuse contact trading standards and the financial ombudsman (IIRC they cover debt collectors), as the debt is unenforceable without the agreement, and they are I believe breaking the law by chasing you up without supplying it on request (otherwise there is nothing to stop Cheatem & Steal debt collectors from chasing every John Smith for a debt owed by one in Bristol).
 
Sounds to me like they're just trying to scam you. They probably picked up your name/address from somewhere and are trying to pull a fast one with the small amount of details they already know. They're probably hoping you'll tell them something that'll add to their information about you, thus making their case seem stronger until you give them money and they mysteriously vanish.

Looking at what they have, even if it was your debt, theres no way they could prove it. And the fact they won't send you a copy of the paperwork is even more fishy. I mean, they could black out all the sensitive information and send it like that.

I like the bit where you say, "Because I'm not prepared to accept the debt <snip> they won't send it out to me..". So they won't tell you anything until you sign on the dotted line admitting that its your debt? Haha. How stupid do they think people are?
 
They sound like one of the companies that buys up the debt then tries to collect it from anyone with a similar name, regardless of if that person is actually the one who owes the money.

A lot of debt collection agencies tend to flout all the guidelines and even commit borderline fraud, harrassment and obtaining money by deception because they don't care who pays, as long as they get the money, and will chase people who obviously don't owe money (relying on letters with misleading threats* to scare people into paying).


[edit]
Whatever you do, do NOT give them your phone number, a common practice is to keep ringing up at all times of the day to try and force you to cave in, it also means that they can twist anything you say on the phone in their favour/forget what they've said (and "lose" the recordings that they may claim are made).
I've read too many horror stories about debt collectors to trust them as far as I can throw them.


*They cannot claim to be able to take goods/reposses houses etc without a court order.
 
Just goto the citizens advice and do as they suggest. THE most important thing is to not sign anything or discuss anything over the phone. Make sure all discussions are in writing, if they phone inform them that you only respond to mail and that they are free to contact you by post.

This sounds like either identity fraud, or a fishing exercise by the debt collection company. Maybe someone rented the place after you moved and got some mail meant for you... dug around abit and found your date of birth somehow and managed to get a nice loan in your name.
 
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Cheers folks, appreciate it.

Gonna write a letter saying I'm not prepared to accept any debt (or further costs) and will refuse to acknowledge any letters until I have the paperwork from HFC Bank where I'll investigate further.

What I always thought though is if they say I took this loan out in around 2001 (which HAD to be before March 2001 as I was living somewhere else!), I thought the debt disappeared after 6 years (which is now over the 6 year) or is that a myth?
 
I'm sorry I must be missing something here ... if they won't provide you with any documents as evidence that you owe them any money because they think they have the wrong person - what the hell are you worrying about ? - if that's what they have stated, they know you don't owe them anything.

If you have told them the debt is not yours, you have not lived at the address they have for 5 years (during which time the loan was taken out at some point, I am assuming ?) and you refused to accept the debt, then it is up to them to prove the debt is yours ?

I had similar crap when a local sh*te took out mobile phone deals under his own name and used my details as the billing name and address - the stupidity of some people and companies truly amazes me at times.

I had 5 or 6 letters / phone calls reminding me I had to pay, requesting payment, demanding payment, passing over to baliffs, threatening court action, threatening to send the baliffs to visit my home etc ... in the end I reported the whole lot to the local police station and received a crime number.

Next time they phone I told them I was no longer willing to discuss the matter with them and if they wished to pursue it any further then they had to contact PC <whatever his name was> and quote the crime number I gave them.

I never heard a peep from them again and I checked my credit report shortly after the whole affair - the only evidence of any contact between me and them was a single credit search - which I guess was them making sure I had good credit history when the sh*te obtained the mobiles - and sod all else.

I learned two lessons from that set of events;

(1) Never let letters like that worry me again - if I ever receive more than 2 of those such letters in the future, I would now spend 10-15 minutes at the local police station reporting the fraud and that is it, job done.

(2) Never buy a product / service from phones4u (or anyone else owned by the Caudwell Group) - as their security checks are practically non-existent.
 
They cannot legally enforce you to pay anything of the sorts. There are a number of shady credit companies like this that use bully tactics to force you to pay a debt that they've inflated massively due to interest rates by threatening to stuff your credit rating.

get in touch with a credit reference agency like Experian to make sure they aren't doing that to your credit report right now. Also sounds like you might be the victim of identity fraud tbh.
 
~J~ said:
Cheers folks, appreciate it.

Gonna write a letter saying I'm not prepared to accept any debt (or further costs) and will refuse to acknowledge any letters until I have the paperwork from HFC Bank where I'll investigate further.

What I always thought though is if they say I took this loan out in around 2001 (which HAD to be before March 2001 as I was living somewhere else!), I thought the debt disappeared after 6 years (which is now over the 6 year) or is that a myth?
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So are you actually saying that you DO have a debt with HFC?
 
emailiscrap said:
So are you actually saying that you DO have a debt with HFC?
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Yea, that last bit saying 'until i've had paperwork from HFC' could be seen as admitting it's yours, as only the person with the debt could request it.
 
emailiscrap said:
So are you actually saying that you DO have a debt with HFC?
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Absoutely categorically refusing I have debt with HFC.

The last paragraph meant purely that they say, according to their records, they have a Mr. Jason Hirst at an address who has a debt.

I'm saying that is my name, and YES, I lived at that address but had no debt.

They say because I'm not admitting to the debt, they can not tell me anything else (such as the actual date it was taken out on, a reference number, time, location, etc, etc.)

So all I'm saying is that until they can send me a letter/form that has all my details on it, AND my signature (bearing in mind that they've already said, and so have I, that they do NOT have my D.O.B.) then I'll refuse to admit the person with that name (me) living at that address (me) has any debt.

AND, if by some miracle they DO send me a form through with all that information on, then I'm gonna investigate it and see just what the hell has gone off.

So no, I have not debt and am not admitting to anything because there's nothing to admit to.
 
Robert said:
It doesn't read that way to me?
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What I always thought though is if they say I took this loan out in around 2001 (which HAD to be before March 2001 as I was living somewhere else!), I thought the debt disappeared after 6 years (which is now over the 6 year) or is that a myth?
Click to expand...
I read that as him possibly having the debt. Could be wrong though.
 
Dear Sir/Madam

Account No: XXXXXXXXXXX

You have contacted me/us regarding the account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by myself/ourselves.

I/we would point out that I/we have no knowledge of any such debt being owed to HFC.

I am/we are familiar with the Office of Fair Trading Debt collection Guidance which states that it unfair to send demands for payment to an individual when it is uncertain that they are the debtor in question.

I/we would also point out that the OFT say under the Guidance that it is unfair to pursue third parties for payment when they are not liable. In not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonably queried or disputed debt you are using deceptive/and or unfair methods.

Furthermore ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for payment amounts to physical/psychological harassment.

I/we would ask that no further contact be made concerning the above account unless you can provide evidence as to my/our liability for the debt in question.

I/we await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed.

I/we look forward to your reply.

Yours faithfully
 
Sorry haven't had time to read all replys so I don't know if this has been mentioned or not, but HFC are awful, I've had dealings with them in the past and they always mess up, they often phoned me, and sent letters to me saying I'd missed payments when I had not...
 
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