Shuttle-Sized SSF's for AM2 or Intel Core 2?

[Le_Petit_Lapin]

Hi,

I need to get another PC put together, as the current one is bugging me. Been unstable for about a week, after I whacked in another Gig of RAM, works fine without it, but with all the bits together, its unstable, no matter what the settings (and with DFI, theres a massive ammount of settings to work through )

So....was looking at getting a 2 Gig det of DDR RAM to whack into it instead, matched pairs, but....then I realised, theres no point, the damn things wont be usable in a future upgrade anyway, so I've decided to go with a new PC "base unit" instead. Sell the old one as seperate bits in Members Market (including a Opty 148 CABYE. ) It all works fine, just not as a "set".

Preformance wise, I see good things about the Intel Core2 processors, but then again, I'm also told AM2 will offer decent upgrade potential. are these statements both true?

If so, I'll go with the more immediate preformace preference of the Core 2 processors. What SSF cases are available for these Core 2 processors at present? There might be some on OCUK, but with the new layout, I cannot find 'em.

What Graphics cards fit in these types of cases? I assume they need to use Single Slot cooling? x1900pro, or 7900 will do fine for my needs. DX10 isn't really needed by me yet seeing as I wont be "upgrading" to Vista soon. Besides the DX10 Graphics cards are rather expensive right now.

RAM, what are my options? Any specifics aside from DDR2? Is there any "fat" sticks of RAM out there that wont fit?

CPU coolers.....I'll need one of those, I've a W/C loop here, but theres no damn way it'll fit in there (at least without a tedious ammount of case modding that I'm not min the mood for right now). What CPU coolers do I have as options?

Right, if you've managed to get through that rambly mess of a post, congratulations! Can you offer any advice?

Edit: Oooh....and Surround sound too.

Is this even possible?

 

[Tute]

Ok, that's a lot of questions, i'm gonna go through them one by one.

Hi,

I need to get another PC put together, as the current one is bugging me. Been unstable for about a week, after I whacked in another Gig of RAM, works fine without it, but with all the bits together, its unstable, no matter what the settings (and with DFI, theres a massive ammount of settings to work through)

Sounds like the two types of RAM are different. If they have different SPD settings, or if your motherboard is really fussy, then it won't work and/or you'll get crashes.

So....was looking at getting a 2 Gig det of DDR RAM to whack into it instead, matched pairs, but....then I realised, theres no point, the damn things wont be usable in a future upgrade anyway, so I've decided to go with a new PC "base unit" instead. Sell the old one as seperate bits in Members Market (including a Opty 148 CABYE.) It all works fine, just not as a "set".

Yes, good idea. DDR is becoming very hard to get hold of these days, and as a result the prices are high. Better off moving to DDR2 now.

Preformance wise, I see good things about the Intel Core2 processors, but then again, I'm also told AM2 will offer decent upgrade potential. are these statements both true?

Possibly. AMD have stated that they want AM2 to carry on a long time. However, they don't look able to give Core 2 Duo a good competition for a fair while yet, at which point you'll probably be around to upgrading again.

If you're building new, it's Core 2 Duo all the way.

If so, I'll go with the more immediate preformace preference of the Core 2 processors. What SSF cases are available for these Core 2 processors at present? There might be some on OCUK, but with the new layout, I cannot find 'em.

Okay, you have 2 types - the Shuttles, and the mATXes.

The mATXes are the cases that take mATX boards, and include cases like the Silverstone Sugo SG01, Lian-Li V300, and Aspire X-Qpack. Many of these cases can take ATX PSU's, meaning you can give them a high wattage one if you want, or a low wattage, your choice. They come as a case only, so you will need the motherboard, PSU, and CPU cooler separately.

The Shuttles are... the Shuttles! There are a couple of Core 2 Duo models floating around now, with a couple more due soon. The SD37P2 is the "daddy" of the Shuttles, and sports the top chipset with Crossfire capability, if you want to go that way. I'm unsure if the SD31P supports Core2Duo, the chipset should, however it doesn't list compatibility on the site. There's also the SD32G2, which is due soon, and will be a fair amount cheaper than the SD37P2, with probably not as many capabilities (only one PCIe slot, no Crossfire). There's a thread on that Shuttle in this very forum.

What Graphics cards fit in these types of cases? I assume they need to use Single Slot cooling? x1900pro, or 7900 will do fine for my needs. DX10 isn't really needed by me yet seeing as I wont be "upgrading" to Vista soon. Besides the DX10 Graphics cards are rather expensive right now.

With some exceptions, "most" graphics cards will fit. I'm not sure about getting a G80 in any of these, as i've never tried nor have I seen anyone trying to, but from the X1950XTX down, they should fit, albeit with a bit of a squeeze. Also note that if you get a dual slot card, you will lose the use of the adjacent slot.

RAM, what are my options? Any specifics aside from DDR2? Is there any "fat" sticks of RAM out there that wont fit?

RAM is RAM, tbh. Go with what suits you. Overclocking RAM if you intend to overclock, normal RAM if you don't. Many people like to go for the GeIL DDR2, the value set is good for non overclocking, and the more expensive stuff is good if you do plan to overclock.

CPU coolers.....I'll need one of those, I've a W/C loop here, but theres no damn way it'll fit in there (at least without a tedious ammount of case modding that I'm not min the mood for right now). What CPU coolers do I have as options?

Shuttles come with their own coolers for the CPU.

If you go with a mATX setup, you will need your own cooler. I use the Zalman CNPS8000 as it's quiet, efficient, and low profile, meaning it fits most smaller cases. Don't throw your W/C loop away though, I have heard of people fitting them into SFF setups, although it will probably require modding, so make sure you're handy with that Dremel!

Right, if you've managed to get through that rambly mess of a post, congratulations! Can you offer any advice?

Yes. SFF machines rock. I'm so glad I got mine, when I go away, I just lift my PC into a bag and go. No lugging around a huge case.

Oooh....and Surround sound too.

Most, if not all, SFF and/or Shuttle motherboards and systems come with some form of surround support. If that doesn't suit your needs, then pick up a Soundblaster X-Fi card. If it won't fit, then it's external sound card time!

Is this even possible?

Very much so, and very much worth it!

Hope this helps.

 

[cokecan]

Tute pretty much answered everythin though i have a few things to correct and add

the SD31P doesnt support core 2 duo and the only shuttles out that currently does support it is the SD37P2 though the SD32G2 and SD32G5 are due out anytime now.

the SD37P2 has no pci slots so if you dont like the onboard sound, external or live with it tbh lol

If you dont want to overclock then the SD32 may be a good option, you'd fit a decent g-card in, have a cpi slot for an x-fi or x-mystique or somethin and the via chipset aint that bad

there are loads of core 2 duo mATX boards out now if you wanna go that way. infact there is a list somewehre round here of all the mATX boards and how they fair up overclocking, price and general performance wise

 

[Tute]

Tute pretty much answered everythin though i have a few things to correct and add

the SD31P doesnt support core 2 duo and the only shuttles out that currently does support it is the SD37P2 though the SD32G2 and SD32G5 are due out anytime now.

the SD37P2 has no pci slots so if you dont like the onboard sound, external or live with it tbh lol

If you dont want to overclock then the SD32 may be a good option, you'd fit a decent g-card in, have a cpi slot for an x-fi or x-mystique or somethin and the via chipset aint that bad

there are loads of core 2 duo mATX boards out now if you wanna go that way. infact there is a list somewehre round here of all the mATX boards and how they fair up overclocking, price and general performance wise

There is, however it's not on this forum. Not sure if I can link to it, but a google should open it up.

 

[cokecan]

im sure it was linked to in here somewhere (possibly mobo's sub forum).

link posted below by tute

 

[Tute]

I'll chance it.

http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=900405

 

[Le_Petit_Lapin]

aye, after reading that thread on [H]ard, it seems everyone loves the Abit nView motherboard, and I might just go with that along with a AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core 4600+. at least I'll be on familiar ground (AMD) overclocking wise should I take the urge. I keep reading that this Asus P5B-VM board for the Core 2 is more or less a dead dog at O/C'ing.

Also, if I'm not mistaken that board looks like it has a nice 1 slot gap (by "gap" I mean the PCI-E 1x slot I wont be using) between the PCI-E 16x GPU slot and the two other PCI slots, meaning I could get a OcUK MSI GeForce 7900 GTO SILENT 512MB in there and still be able to use the outside PCI slot for a X-Fi soundcard, and give the GPU a bit of room to breathe as it were...

Does this sound right? If theres another Graphics card in the store that would give me better preformance for similar price, reccommend away. ATi or nVidia, I'm not bothered either way.

So...with all that in mind....how does this sound:

Abit NFM2-nView nForce 6150 Micro ATX (Socket AM2) PCI-Express DDR2 Motherboard
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core 4600+ 2.20GHz (Socket AM2)
OcUK MSI GeForce 7900 GTO SILENT 512MB GDDR3 VIVO TV-Out/Dual DVI (PCI-Express)
G.Skill 2GB DDR2 NR PC2-6400 (2x1GB) CAS5 Dual Channel Kit (F2-6400)
Lian-Li PC-V300 Case

Other questions:

The Case, it takes an ATX PSU (like my Hiper 580w) ok?
The Case package....are fans included?
The RAM, that stuff listed above isn't for O/C'ing as I wont be right off the bat, but will the Motherboard be ok with PC8000 stuff?
The Motherboard, does it have PATA slots? I've a large PATA HDD here that I'd like to use. Looks like theres PATA slots in the pictures of it, but thats not included in the item description on OCUK.
CPU Cooler, What fits? (Kind of an essential question there)

 

[Kezmo]

Specs look good, tho if moneys not tight id go for a modular psu for a tidy build and better airflow
That new Abit mobo is great as is the g.skill ram , as for cpu cooling im sure a zalman cnps8000 or one of the flower coolers would fit.