Sick/Fit Note - None payment of wage

[Transform_IT]

Hi all,

I am an employee forum rep at work, and I have an individual who has just returned from absence due to workplace stress and mental health issues. Whilst they were off, they provided medical fit notes electronically via email. On one occasion, the employer/HR had to phone them to request they send in their form before the close of play to avoid not being paid. They actioned this (emails to prove). When returning to work, they received an email from HR saying their pay had been suspended due to non-receipt of Fit Notes. When questioning why and attaching the emails as evidence of submission, HR replied, saying it was a day late (although there are no previous emails stating what date they need to be sent by - all done via phone call).

Where does this individual stand legally? - I appreciate they are partly to blame for not sending them in a timely fashion. But, they have explained how these were requested from their GP but were delayed due to being busy. As a result, they were backdated (not uncommon). They were submitted to work when requested.

They have never received a warning or request in writing detailing that should they not submit them, they won't be paid. The fact they were off with workplace stress and mental health issues is also alarming. I'm struggling with how best to advise them due to not having legal knowledge.

Thanks,

T_IT.

 

[Transform_IT]

How long a time are we talking? A day unpaid, or a month unpaid?

Their company sick pay was suspended from 25th September - 8th October and 8th October - 18th October. They were told on the 8th that if they hadn't set their fit notes in by the close of business on the 8th, they wouldn't get paid (this was the first prompt they received). They sent them on the 8th and explained there were delays from their GP. They questioned HR and have been told their pay from 1st - 18th October won't be reinstated due to late fit notes.

 

[Transform_IT]

The individual isn't a part of the union - although the site is unionised. I was copied into the emails as I am their employee forum rep. I was unable to advise them but I would like to help as I disagree with the decision made by HR. However, I don't want to spout nonsense if a fair challenge can be brought to the table. For me, the fit notes were provided when requested, but now the employee is being penalised with no fair reason as they complied within the timeframe.

 

[Transform_IT]

I'm on the fence with issues like this. Following a bereavement, or other life changing issues - then sure. But if it's simply the stress of the job that's causing the person to be off sick - then they're clearly not suitable for the job.

I've seen too many people taking the complete **** out of places I've worked (where I used to assist HR with investigations), only to leave the rest of the team to pick up their slack - to have too much sympathy. If HR are starting to play hardball, it's because they likely know enough about the individual to warrant it.

I agree with you for the most part - however, this individual suffers from mental health and depression, but they had also been bullied at work and had raised a grievance. Due to this, they went off sick, not from the pressure of the job, but due to the bullying, which has since been dealt with.

 

[Transform_IT]

When I handed in my notice in my old job I went off sick two weeks before I was due to leave (real reasons). I returned with 3 days left on my notice. I lost a months pay as they thought I had done a runner and only paid till I went on sick. Handed in self cert and everything. HR even rang me because they thought I was playing the system even though the year before when I was off with covid nothing was even mentioned. I just emailed my senior manager and that was it.

I drove into work the day I realised I hadn't been paid and had words with H/R. Was in my account within two working days.

In most cases H/R is there for the senior staff only and will do their upmost to make the workers life miserable. Saying that there are so many dossers that play the system with their sick pay (We had a generous 13 weeks full sick pay) they end up tarnishing everyone with the same brush.

I presume he will get paid but at a later date?

They have been told they won't be paid for these dates.

 

[Transform_IT]

So, I checked the policies this morning, and it says "If employees fail to produce a doctor's note and only self-certify, they will be in receipt of SSP only (if eligible)".

They submitted their sick note when prompted (not a day late). The reason HR gave for not paying was "your company sick pay was not paid due to not receiving doctor’s notes in a timely manner. As these notes were received after these dates had passed, they are unable to be paid in retrospect. Meaning this pay will not be reinstated, in your November pay."

"Timely manner" - nowhere in the policy does it mention this wording or what it actually means.

 

[Transform_IT]

They have refused payment and senior management has been involved. But, they too have failed. A dead end and a lesson to be learned it would seem. I feel extremely sorry for the individual.

 

[Transform_IT]

and their reason was because they were 1 day late?

Their reason was they have produced another policy stating that "the company reserves the right to terminate company sick pay if certification is not received in time or if an individual does not keep in contact with the company"

The individual phoned their boss weekly to update them - their boss has confirmed this.