So £100 would give you how much more power than an old 3ghz P4?

NeilF · 14 Apr 2008 at 10:10

So out of interest, in raw processing power, if I was to spend around £100 on a modern motherboard & CPU, how much (if any?) more processing power would I end up with than my current old P4-3.2ghz (533 bus)?

Let's say for example processing video footage, which is basically just solid CPU intensive stuff...

Trunks9486 · 14 Apr 2008 at 10:45

Cant realy wuantify it, lets just say a lot. I would suggest keeping your money until you have enough to buy a Quad though, especially if you dont upgrade often.

NeilF · 14 Apr 2008 at 11:02

Trunks9486 said:
Cant realy wuantify it, lets just say a lot. I would suggest keeping your money until you have enough to buy a Quad though, especially if you dont upgrade often.

Why a Quad?

I'm looking to upgrade my machine enough to allow me to play games for the next years or so adequately (not high settings, just medium is fine).

This can be done in two ways...

1) Stick with my current setup (so nice easy life) and just spend £150 on an HIS 3850, no faster AGP card than this around! - Job done.

2) Or, as has been suggested elsewhere, replacing my motherboard, and CPU to go PCIe and getting a lesser GFX card. However, this would also mean replacing my memory, and without a doubt I'd want to replace my system disc (as I'd have to do a fresh install) with a new SATA drive as well.

Option (1) will cost me about £160ish...

Option (2) will end up costing me (I suspect) about twice that...

My gut feel is to limp along with my AGP system for another year or two by putting that 3850 in... Unless say £120 on the motherboard and CPU is literally going to blow my current CPU performance out of the water...

note1: I don't play many games really... Just HL2 engine stuff (which runs OK at the moment) and I want to play Mass Effect (hence upgrading!).
note2: I have a 700W power supply ready....

Pilgrim57 · 14 Apr 2008 at 12:16

NeilFawcett said:
I'm looking to upgrade my machine enough to allow me to play games for the next years or so adequately (not high settings, just medium is fine).

This can be done in two ways...

1) Stick with my current setup (so nice easy life) and just spend £150 on an HIS 3850, no faster AGP card than this around! - Job done.

2) Or, as has been suggested elsewhere, replacing my motherboard, and CPU to go PCIe and getting a lesser GFX card. However, this would also mean replacing my memory, and without a doubt I'd want to replace my system disc (as I'd have to do a fresh install) with a new SATA drive as well.
My gut feel is to limp along with my AGP system for another year or two by putting that 3850 in... Unless say £120 on the motherboard and CPU is literally going to blow my current CPU performance out of the water

A quad isn't the obvious choice despite what a lot would say.
AGP is dead why spend £150 on something with a limited lifespan :confused:

but you can upgrade the chip as & when even a Wolfdale. Result money well spent for the double cost.

NeilF · 14 Apr 2008 at 12:29

Some of your links for the mb/cpu/mem point to the same thing so I can't see specific items

I think your first comment is a very interesting, and may have answered my question... 'Most games are NOT cpu limited' - So if I can get away with just £150 now and games play fine, I'm happy...

I know for about £350 I can have a nice setup, but is does end up being £200 more, and I suspect I just won't get much value out of... For example, if I were to play 'Mass Effect' on both setups I bet they'd both play fine

(at least I hope so

)

Dingleberry88 · 14 Apr 2008 at 12:33

NeilFawcett said:
note1: I don't play many games really... Just HL2 engine stuff (which runs OK at the moment) and I want to play Mass Effect (hence upgrading!).

Get a 360.

Roobubba · 14 Apr 2008 at 13:20

"Why a quad"?

presumably because you mentioned video processing, and most of the video editing type software is well positioned to make use of all 4 cores of a quad chip. The trouble you face here is the budget - it's a *little* low to get something which would last you long enough to make it worthwhile.

My inclination would be to spend the minimum just now, if you can save up enough to splash out a tad more in say 6 - 12 months (or after Nehalem comes out, and hopefully the older architecture chips and chipsets come down in price as a result).

That's what I'm planning to do anyway - I'm on PCIe at the mo, so my 8800GT is great, but the system is still 939-based and the CPU and RAM aren't a scratch on the new wolfdales + DDR2 or DDR3

I live in hope that once Nehalem comes out, DDR3 prices will have come down enough for me to get a fast wolfdale and a decent ddr3 motherboard.

Roo

NeilF · 14 Apr 2008 at 13:21

Dingleberry88 said:
Get a 360.

Seriously tempted except I hate console controls... Especially as a lot of stuff I do is FPS type stuff...

Unless someone is suggesting the HIS 3850 + my current setup will not allow me to play things like Mass Effect, Left 4 Dead and the like, in reasonable settings at a good frame rate, then I'm going to put off the MB and CPU upgrade I think...

In the next 1-2yrs prices will only substantially drop in price and on my next upgrade I'll do the whole lot and change OS... For the time being just changing a single card will keep me happy I hope...

Roobubba said:
"Why a quad"?

presumably because you mentioned video processing, and most of the video editing type software is well positioned to make use of all 4 cores of a quad chip.

Well, just a (poor) example I guess.... Just trying to get some feeling of ummmfff of the new Core-Duo processors when compared to my old P4-3ghz. eg: Basically twice as fast for the cheaper (£50) ones?

Roobubba said:
The trouble you face here is the budget - it's a *little* low to get something which would last you long enough to make it worthwhile.

Indeed! I just cannot justify spending more when I don't play much and really just need enough performance to make things reasonable...

Roobubba said:
My inclination would be to spend the minimum just now, if you can save up enough to splash out a tad more in say 6 - 12 months (or after Nehalem comes out, and hopefully the older architecture chips and chipsets come down in price as a result).

That's what I'm planning to do anyway - I'm on PCIe at the mo, so my 8800GT is great, but the system is still 939-based and the CPU and RAM aren't a scratch on the new wolfdales + DDR2 or DDR3 I live in hope that once Nehalem comes out, DDR3 prices will have come down enough for me to get a fast wolfdale and a decent ddr3 motherboard.

I think I agree... I'll hold off and then just replace the whole lot in one go, rather than doing bits and pieces... Including a complete OS upgrade/install.

bilston · 14 Apr 2008 at 15:53

Mobo: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MB-086-GI&groupid=701&catid=5&subcat=913

CPU: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CP-152-IN&groupid=701&catid=6&subcat=793

Ram: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MY-088-CR&groupid=701&catid=8&subcat=

Graphics: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-002-PN&groupid=701&catid=56&subcat=1008

You can overclock that to 3ghz on air easily and the GT will keep your games looking and running fine for ages to come.

All for a grand total of £266 +shipping

Trunks9486 · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:06

I wouldnt buy the AGP card, X1950 PRO was already an overkill for the old single core AGP systems ( i have used the X1950 in an AGP P4 northwood). Games tended to slow down due to the CPu but i could add AA/AF without affecting performance too much. Seeing that you own an X800XT (?) I would still insist on saying that you should wait.

The reason for suggesting a Quad is that its a more future proof processor. Personally i dont like changing systems or components too often (Graphics being the exception). I changed from a Single core athlon 64 (early 754 model), 1GB of RAM and a X800 PRO to a completely new system with a Q6600 clocked at 3.4GHz, 4GBs of fast DDR2 and an HD3850 512 and saw a tremendous improvement in all areas and most importanly i was able to truly multi task. I was unable to use more than two programs on my Athlon but on the current system i was able to throw a LOT of stuff at it without experiencing any slowdowns at all. True multitasking is important for me but you also need the desktop space to do that so its a moot point on a smaller screen.

The Q6600 can be easily clocked to 3.2-3.6GHz. The new dual cores can do 4GHz and we are still waiting to see how the new Quads fare. I am of the belief that a highly clocked Q6600 will be of better value as when games start using the extra cores then the difference ebtween a 3.4GHz Quad and a 4GHz Dual wont be in favour of the Dual but in favour of the Quad.

Anyway i realise that not many people agree with my way of thinking but as i said i like to build my system to last me about 3-5 Years depending on my financials. I am hapy with my Quad experience which is why i am suggesting it to you.

NeilF · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:17

bilston said:
Mobo: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MB-086-GI&groupid=701&catid=5&subcat=913

CPU: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CP-152-IN&groupid=701&catid=6&subcat=793

Ram: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MY-088-CR&groupid=701&catid=8&subcat=

Graphics: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-002-PN&groupid=701&catid=56&subcat=1008

You can overclock that to 3ghz on air easily and the GT will keep your games looking and running fine for ages to come.

All for a grand total of £266 +shipping

VERY tempting... If I did that I would want to buy a new SATA main drive to replace my IDE system disc. So we're talking about £320 by the end of it all... Plus fitting/installation/getting back all applications etc... Hmmm....

Tricky... I'm not interested in multi-tasking. My current desktop experience is fine... Just concerned about games like Left 4 Dead, Team Fortress 2 and Mass Effect being smooth... Hmmm....

taz488 · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:27

bilston said:
Mobo: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MB-086-GI&groupid=701&catid=5&subcat=913

CPU: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CP-152-IN&groupid=701&catid=6&subcat=793

Ram: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MY-088-CR&groupid=701&catid=8&subcat=

Graphics: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-002-PN&groupid=701&catid=56&subcat=1008

You can overclock that to 3ghz on air easily and the GT will keep your games looking and running fine for ages to come.

All for a grand total of £266 +shipping

surely that mobo is a bit expensive for the budget

Devil_Spawn · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:30

i would advise against getting the agp card too - if you decide to make an upgrade to the mobo/cpu, you will be forced to get a new card too.

NeilF · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:31

taz488 said:
surely that mobo is a bit expensive for the budget

You're only going to skim £10 or so off of it... Personally I think a good MB is worth it... You really do not want it to fail on you!

Devil_Spawn said:
i would advise against getting the agp card too - if you decide to make an upgrade to the mobo/cpu, you will be forced to get a new card too.

True, but this is true of every item you ever buy...

The question is will £150 now mean I can play games like Mass Effect (& Fallout 3?) etc over the next year or two... If the answer is yes, I'm happy to do that, and then wait and do a mass replacement after that, when my saved money will only get me more anyway!

If the answer is no, then I'll have no choice to spend £320-400 now... plus do a complete re-installation/setup... So basically £200+ more and lots more time and effort as well...

ps: Again, I'm not interesting in top notch visuals, just average and smooth...

Sean_UK · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:33

NeilFawcett said:
'Most games are NOT cpu limited' - So if I can get away with just £150 now and games play fine, I'm happy...

Is this £150 amount taken from what you expect to make back for your old pc parts, or could you add that ontop even?

As you should manage to gain at least an extra £100+ for 2nd parts...

sir-les-mp · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:38

bilston said:
Mobo: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MB-086-GI&groupid=701&catid=5&subcat=913

CPU: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CP-152-IN&groupid=701&catid=6&subcat=793

Ram: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MY-088-CR&groupid=701&catid=8&subcat=

Graphics: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-002-PN&groupid=701&catid=56&subcat=1008

You can overclock that to 3ghz on air easily and the GT will keep your games looking and running fine for ages to come.

All for a grand total of £266 +shipping

if you add this into the mix
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=HD-022-HI&groupid=701&catid=14&subcat=167
and keep your existing ide's as extra storage
new system for a grand total of £296 + Shipping

NeilF · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:40

Sean_UK said:
Is this £150 amount taken from what you expect to make back for your old pc parts, or could you add that ontop even? As you should manage to gain at least an extra £100+ for 2nd parts...

No, it's taken from the amount of money I can realistically justify spending on something I don't do very much (gaming)

If £150 will mean I can play Mass Effect (ok'ish) I'm happy... If I have to spend £300+ then I'll likely skip it (maybe)...

However, what I don't want to find out is if I do get the HIS 3850, is it doesn't allow me to play the games. That would just be £150 wasted

Hence me trying to gauge my CPU's performance against modern (cheap) CPUs... (bit of a daft request really I guess!)

uv · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:44

bilston said:
Mobo: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MB-086-GI&groupid=701&catid=5&subcat=913

CPU: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CP-152-IN&groupid=701&catid=6&subcat=793

Ram: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MY-088-CR&groupid=701&catid=8&subcat=

Graphics: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-002-PN&groupid=701&catid=56&subcat=1008

You can overclock that to 3ghz on air easily and the GT will keep your games looking and running fine for ages to come.

All for a grand total of £266 +shipping

That could be done for much cheaper.

The mobo can be swapped for a p31-s3l. Will easily reach 3Ghz+, and will be about half the price.

The OP has no need for a 8800GT.

A 9600GT, whilst only marginally slower, will save you another £20.

so a grand total of ~£210, for a *very* nice upgrade.

Sean_UK · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:54

NeilFawcett said:
No, it's taken from the amount of money I can realistically justify spending on something I don't do very much (gaming)

Well tbh for just £150 your going to struggle, £225+ then your talking smooth pc upgrade which allows you to enjoy all round decent budget pc, along with very acceptable gaming quality.

9600 gfx card or the above, either will do absolutely fine with games you mention.

NeilFawcett said:
Let's say for example processing video footage, which is basically just solid CPU intensive stuff...

4gb mem + Quad imo, but then im no expert on vid editing pc requirements.

NeilF · 14 Apr 2008 at 16:58

Sean_UK said:
Well tbh for just £150 your going to struggle, £225+ then your talking smooth pc upgrade which allows you to enjoy all round decent budget pc, along with very acceptable gaming quality.

9600 gfx card or the above, either will do absolutely fine with games you mention.

Thanks for that! I'd need a SATA hard drive as well, as I'd be doing a fresh OS install.

That's a very interesting spec you've detailed there! How future proof is the motherboard... The last thing I would want to do with an upgrade is find I'd need to upgrade again shortly. ie: If I was going to upgrade I wouldn't want to compromise too much.

The thing is here though, from spending £150, which TBH is a bit more that I'd llike to spend, we're now upto £250-300 (at least). Not impossible, just harder to justify (for me)...