Soldato
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Free servicing or not then? It was critical to point you made earlier.
Spec me a New Car possible scrappage banter!
- Thread starter Docaroo
- Start date
Free servicing or not then? It was critical to point you made earlier.
Oh sorry I presumed it was a rhetorical.
However as you're insisitant on dragging your point out, all cars need servicing. Just because you can service a car yourself - doesn't mean everyone can. Yes you take it into your personal consideration when purchasing a car. The fact you've now bought what most people would consider a machanical / electrical financial nightmare, was largely because you work in that area - and hence the maintenance of that vehicle will be a lot lower than if - say I bought an insight.
Of course running your 10 year old focus cost a lot less. However that was mainly because you were capable and willing to service it yourself. However not everyone does that. Would a normal service on a 10 year old Focus cost less than a 2009 Fiesta? I'd imagine that - in general - there would be a few more things to pick up on.
What I was mainly debating is that someone could buy a 10k 330 and over the course of 3 years would end up spending less than I would on my 11k Fiesta. I'm presuming that the vast majority of people wouldn't be servicing their 330 themselves. They may no longer be going to a main stealer for servicing - but any work will still command a premium price compared to the relatively low cost services and any unforseen work that will have to be carried out on my Fiesta.
If you add the word 'pseudo' before something - does that mean you're making it up? I'm not mocking anyone.
Associate
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This topic is the wrong topic for a car enthusiasts forum, sure we all want the faster, better handling car - but that is because thats our priorty.
Some people are willing to pay the premium to have something new even if the performance is utterly awful
Some people are willing to pay the premium to have something new even if the performance is utterly awful
I'll have to put new tyres on it at some point too.Not sure what the service intervals are on the new Fiesta but you're looking at £170 upwards per service from a main dealer. You can flush those tax savings down the toilet
I can forget all about fuel economy then.
I guess it all depends on how you measure performance.
My Baja has better performance than most cars on this forum. Or is the only measure of performance a cars 0-60, or how well it does on a track.
Soldato
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I was actually countering the point that you made which suggested I had done no servicing to my car in the last 2.5years which simply is not the case. It had nothing to do with whether I could do it myself or not, although if i had a new car I still wouldn't want to DIY service it anyway due to the resale inplications.
FWIW My insight is far simpler than any turbo diesel. Its a Honda IMA an engineering piece of excellence in simplicity. It needs 2.5 litres of oil every 9k miles and thats about it.
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Soldato
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I know that bit, thats why I brought it up. Cos although the BMW may cost more over that time period which car do you think will be worth more at the end when it comes to sell them both? Thats real cost of ownership.
I dont know.
Buying new was quite reactionary to having a lot of problems with a previous car - and I just wanted something that I wouldn't have to spend my weekends fixing. I already have one of them.
The Baja needs a lot of work - and looking back, all the time I spent working on the heap of crap Golf, and my girlfriends Rover 200 - I could have been working on my Baja.
All my previous cars were very different. All 2nd hand and nearing the 80k mark. I was on a quest for faster, more powerful, quicker cars and I wanted the most performance / metal I could get for my money.
However I will never know if those cars were really what they should have felt like. I'll never know how well a a brand new Fiat Coupe pulls and handles. I'll never know if a Golf Mk1 GTI really is one of the best hot hatches ever (because I can tell you - despite ploughing money into it - the one I had wasn't!)
If I didn't have the Baja - I think I'd still have a motorbike. But sadly, one thing had to go to help fund the new car - and I love my Baja too much. Plus I think my appreciation of it greatly outweighed any financial value of it - compared to the bike.
Soldato
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- 4 Apr 2003
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The key points about purchasing a car which are usually put forward on this forum are:
Finance
1) If you are buying on finance, make sure the justification for buying on it finance is sound.
a) For example, if you have a car allowance and are required to have a car for business use then finance aka lease / contract / pcp is a logical business based choice. (some CA schemes require a car to be under x years old etc).
b) Finance may be the only option where the purchaser needs a car but cannot afford to by outright. However if affordability is not an issue so assuming a low rate of APR and short 3-4 year payment term is chosen this is not too much of an issue.
c) Avoid buying a car on finance that will result in a large amount of negative equity for the first couple of year of ownership in case circumstances change.
d) If you just fancy spending 200-300pm for the sake of having a new car, it is not always a good decision.
e) Look carefully between taking a PCP or Hire purchase. Obviously with PCP your payments can be lower but you never own the car unless you buy out of the agreement at the end. This is effectively the same as renting a car and does make sense if you need a car and have the mechanism to pay for it such as in point a) above (car allowance). A Hire Purchase allows you to return the car under the ‘Halves and Thirds’ rule. Effectively with the same effect as a PCP only no excess mileage charges and can work out cheaper.
Cost
2) Why spend 12k on a small basic hatch, albeit a new one, when you can spend half that on a 2 year old one with low mileage. Or get an ex demo and save a couple of K at least.
3) Why spend 12k on a small basic hatch, albeit a new one, when that budget will get some very capable cars with much higher specs and not overly upsetting running costs.
4) There is nothing wrong with buying a nice new car, it is the purchasers decision and down to their affordability and circumstances. However, the logic is often flawed where buyers are spending a lot of money to save a few hundred.
5) Smaller cars can cost very little to run in tax, servicing etc. However new small cars may require main dealer servicing for the warranty which will cost more than your local garage. Getting a free servicing deal on a new car is always a bonus
Fuel Economy
5) Small hatch diesels offer nice performance with great fuel economy, but they won’t set your world on fire.
6) When you take into account the cost of fuel, typically shorter servicing intervals and purchase costs, A diesel may not break even over the petrol counterpart until you have done 60,000-90,000+ miles. Sometimes you will never break even over buying a petrol counterpart. Example being a Volvo S60 2.0T petrol vs the D5. The 2.0T drinks fuel but second hand ones cost about 4-5k less than the D5. Another example is the Mondeo ST220, where they are considerably cheaper than the diesel version. On smaller hatches, you pay a premium for a diesel but this is often minimal over a petrol version these days. However, it all adds up.
Other Considerations
7) Everyone is an individual and has different requirements, tastes, needs etc, otherwise we would only have one brand and one type of car to choose from. Model T in black anyone??.
8) It is not so much the choice of car in most circumstances but the waste of money. The car could be a Punto, Fiesta, Mazda 2, Corsa and it really wouldn’t matter. Spending 12k on a new one, where it will depreciate 20% as you drive it off the forecourt, and probably down to 30% of its original value after 3 years is a bigger issue.
Finance
1) If you are buying on finance, make sure the justification for buying on it finance is sound.
a) For example, if you have a car allowance and are required to have a car for business use then finance aka lease / contract / pcp is a logical business based choice. (some CA schemes require a car to be under x years old etc).
b) Finance may be the only option where the purchaser needs a car but cannot afford to by outright. However if affordability is not an issue so assuming a low rate of APR and short 3-4 year payment term is chosen this is not too much of an issue.
c) Avoid buying a car on finance that will result in a large amount of negative equity for the first couple of year of ownership in case circumstances change.
d) If you just fancy spending 200-300pm for the sake of having a new car, it is not always a good decision.
e) Look carefully between taking a PCP or Hire purchase. Obviously with PCP your payments can be lower but you never own the car unless you buy out of the agreement at the end. This is effectively the same as renting a car and does make sense if you need a car and have the mechanism to pay for it such as in point a) above (car allowance). A Hire Purchase allows you to return the car under the ‘Halves and Thirds’ rule. Effectively with the same effect as a PCP only no excess mileage charges and can work out cheaper.
Cost
2) Why spend 12k on a small basic hatch, albeit a new one, when you can spend half that on a 2 year old one with low mileage. Or get an ex demo and save a couple of K at least.
3) Why spend 12k on a small basic hatch, albeit a new one, when that budget will get some very capable cars with much higher specs and not overly upsetting running costs.
4) There is nothing wrong with buying a nice new car, it is the purchasers decision and down to their affordability and circumstances. However, the logic is often flawed where buyers are spending a lot of money to save a few hundred.
5) Smaller cars can cost very little to run in tax, servicing etc. However new small cars may require main dealer servicing for the warranty which will cost more than your local garage. Getting a free servicing deal on a new car is always a bonus
Fuel Economy
5) Small hatch diesels offer nice performance with great fuel economy, but they won’t set your world on fire.
6) When you take into account the cost of fuel, typically shorter servicing intervals and purchase costs, A diesel may not break even over the petrol counterpart until you have done 60,000-90,000+ miles. Sometimes you will never break even over buying a petrol counterpart. Example being a Volvo S60 2.0T petrol vs the D5. The 2.0T drinks fuel but second hand ones cost about 4-5k less than the D5. Another example is the Mondeo ST220, where they are considerably cheaper than the diesel version. On smaller hatches, you pay a premium for a diesel but this is often minimal over a petrol version these days. However, it all adds up.
Other Considerations
7) Everyone is an individual and has different requirements, tastes, needs etc, otherwise we would only have one brand and one type of car to choose from. Model T in black anyone??.
8) It is not so much the choice of car in most circumstances but the waste of money. The car could be a Punto, Fiesta, Mazda 2, Corsa and it really wouldn’t matter. Spending 12k on a new one, where it will depreciate 20% as you drive it off the forecourt, and probably down to 30% of its original value after 3 years is a bigger issue.
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Soldato
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- 5 Jul 2007
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- 5,511
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- London
get back to enjoying your holiday
This point works both ways though. Yes a new diesel costs a little more than the petrol to buy initially - but the resale value is also more.
From what I've seen of recent ford sales - I would say the 2nd had price of a TDCI when compared to the petrol version is as much, if not more than the price difference when the car was brand new.
So unless I decide to drive my car off a cliff after 3 years - the difference in purchasing cost is cancelled out by a better resale value when I come round to selling it.
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