Start SL5x5 fat or lose weight first?

ANONANON

ANONANON

ANONANON

Permabanned
Joined
18 Feb 2011
Posts
390
Hi guys, Some of you may remember me from a few months back.

Now, after looking at the SL5x5, it seems a much more easier and quicker plan than the one i am currently doing, so i would like to switch to it. Main thing i'm concerned about is my belly. Now looking at the pics below

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Do you think it would be ok to start the SL5x5 routine as i am, or lose the belly first? The programme im on at the moment (Anthonly Ellis Gaining mass) suggests to get to 10-15% BF before starting the masssing routine.

The article on the Stronglifts site recommended to just start the programme with the belly and worry about losing it later as it'll be easier to lose it with the extra muscle mass.

If you’re skinny-fat, best is to gain weight first. It’s a lot easier to lose fat with the added muscle mass and strength that comes with the weight gain. So gain weight first, then lose fat.
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What do you guys think? How much fatter do you think i would get eating 4000 cals a day?

Currently 14Stone (196 Ib)
5ft'10

I would love to get access to the SL forums, I would ask there as well, but they are currently closed to new members. :(
 
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first of all use a calorie counter, there is one on scoobies website, ill link to it in a bit. this will tell you how many calories you need to be eating in order to lose bodyfat, but still possibly grow/maintain muscle.

start SL 5x5 straight away, dont try to bulk, stronglifts will get you strong and slimmer automatically. all you need to do is ensure your giving 150% every workout, i mean really push it.

after doing stronglifts for 6 months (with monthly photos), and weighing yourself every week to re-calculate calories. you can switch to a different programme for gaining muscle mass.

also another thing, everybody is different. some people burn fat like they are a Lamborghini burning petrol, others burn fat as if they are a diesel volkswagon golf. muscle mass makes it like 10% easier, which isn't a lot. so if you are one of the people who find it hard to burn fat, you may be better off never ever bulking and just lean gaining once you are a lot slimmer.

another thing stronglifts is bad for building muscle mass, its a strength building programme. if you want muscles like jay cutler you need to do high reps and lower weight, for strength low reps and higher weight.

do stronglifts for 6 months then switch to muscle building routine.

what are your ultimate goals? to be skinny? to be muscular? to be strong? what?
 
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I would like to be both muscular and strong, but out the 2 i would choose muscular. I want muscle definition which isn't hidden underneath a thick layer of fat. Someone like Andy Sugden out of emmerdale (before you ask, i don't watch it, but i couldn't help but spot him when the mrs was watching it) :D

I've seen quite a few of scoobies videos, but totally forgot about his website, so thanks for the link to the calculator. After using scoobies calculator, I'm currently putting a diet together on Fitday. It's quite hard to get the correct amount of calories, carbs, protein and fat in each meal, but they are pretty close to the calculators target so shouldn't be a problem really.

At the moment, i'm kinda struggling to get a 5/6 meal diet together. So far i've done breakfast and morning snack.

Aiming for 6 meals a day.

564 Calories per meal
28g of protein per meal
84g of carbs per meal
12g of fat per meal

The fat seems to be the hardest to keep down to 12g. Lowest i've got it so far is 20 and 23g respectively for each meal.

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Wow those meal macros seem way off. Take your carbs waaay down, you should be aiming for no more than 200g of carbs a day, so split that between your meals and go from there. Also 20g of fat per meal for 6 is fine, the carbs are what you should be worrying about for fat loss.
 
ANONANON said:
I would like to be both muscular and strong, but out the 2 i would choose muscular. I want muscle definition which isn't hidden underneath a thick layer of fat. Someone like Andy Sugden out of emmerdale (before you ask, i don't watch it, but i couldn't help but spot him when the mrs was watching it) :D

I've seen quite a few of scoobies videos, but totally forgot about his website, so thanks for the link to the calculator. After using scoobies calculator, I'm currently putting a diet together on Fitday. It's quite hard to get the correct amount of calories, carbs, protein and fat in each meal, but they are pretty close to the calculators target so shouldn't be a problem really.

At the moment, i'm kinda struggling to get a 5/6 meal diet together. So far i've done breakfast and morning snack.

Aiming for 6 meals a day.

564 Calories per meal
28g of protein per meal
84g of carbs per meal
12g of fat per meal

The fat seems to be the hardest to keep down to 12g. Lowest i've got it so far is 20 and 23g respectively for each meal.

641684.png
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when it says 6 meals, you wont be eating 6 full meals

1 meal will be like a protein shake. another 2 pieces of fruit. another a peanut butter laden slice of bread folded in half.

then 3 proper meals.

also that guy from emmerdale, i just googled him and he is nothing special. you should be able to get his physique by following stronglifts religiously for 1-2 years, depending on your age.

if you want bigger muscles than him then your gonna need to switch to a higher rep workout.
 
Definitely start lifting weights straight away ANONANON. The weight will drop off and then when you want to start bulking, you'll already have decent form and be familiar with weight lifting.
 
Freefaller said:
A protein shake is NOT A MEAL!!!
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I would never class a shake/drink as a meal. Its like those juice diets.

Also you look a lot heavier than 14 stone. I am only 4lbs lighter than you and 3 inch shorter and dont have a belly that big, what's your body fat percentage?
 
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You do look a bit heavier than 14 stone, but this could just be water weight / bloating / not long just eaten a huge meal.

Any way, for you id suggest starting SL and at the same time try and devise a decent calorie controlled diet.

You don't want to aim too low in the calories, I keep being told that 1800 calories is the lowest you ever want to go. But at 14 stoneish (Similar to me in scale weight) you want 2400-2600 calories while cutting (This is doing 300 calories cardio in the morning and 3 x gym sessions a week). So your 3kish target seems decent, but you may want to reduce it as the weeks go on, just keep an eye on your body composition and your weight.

Cut your carbs down a chunk as mentioned above and increase your fats, try get some fish oily fat in there if possible.
 
Mansize_tissue said:
Wow those meal macros seem way off. Take your carbs waaay down.....
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Well that's what it came back as, according to the scooby calculator...

Height (70")
Weight(14s)
Age(31)
5-6 hrs/wrk of strenuous exercise
Gain Muscle, reduce fat
6 meals/day
20%protein / 60%carb / 20%fat


I've actually adjusted the Macro ratio now to 50%protein / 30%carb / 20%fat

Completed diet is here, what do people think?
MySecondMealPlanAttemptBetterthan1st.png


cheets64 said:
Also you look a lot heavier than 14 stone. I am only 4lbs lighter than you and 3 inch shorter and dont have a belly that big, what's your body fat percentage?
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I don't know to be honest. I would guess around the 25% mark. As of this morning, I'm actually a shade UNDER 14 stone now. Tested on 3 different sets of scales ;)

BlackCoat2k10 said:
Any way, for you id suggest starting SL and at the same time try and devise a decent calorie controlled diet.
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I have constructed a diet, took me 24 hours to get it all together. I found it pretty tricky tbh, getting a right balance of macros. I've never done anything like this before, never thought i would ever have to lose weight either. After the age of 28, the weight has just been literally slapped on :o

BlackCoat2k10 said:
You don't want to aim too low in the calories, I keep being told that 1800 calories is the lowest you ever want to go. But at 14 stoneish (Similar to me in scale weight) you want 2400-2600 calories while cutting (This is doing 300 calories cardio in the morning and 3 x gym sessions a week). So your 3kish target seems decent, but you may want to reduce it as the weeks go on, just keep an eye on your body composition and your weight.
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To be entirely honest, i'm trying to keep the cardio to a minumum. I've got a treadmill and exercise bike, but find them so boring. On the other hand i've got a heavybag and will be doing some form of complexes instead.
 
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Those macros are much better! That calories are still a tad high though so you might find weight loss too slow (or even not at all, many would consider that a bulking diet!). If it were me I'd keep it under 3000 calories. That, along with the resistance training, the fat will start falling off in no time.
 
The calories look waaaaay to high for your current goals. I would be looking at about 2600,-2800 depending on the effort you are putting in with the weights.
 
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tbh I would just get into a routine of exercise and lifting before going full retard with all the Macros/broscience, I have only counted calories for a odd days to see what I am eating, I eat roughly the same everyday and its working, my body is showing results.

You are trying to run before you have learnt to walk.

Turst me if you are wanting to shift the fat, you need to hammer the cardio, get the heart working, body sweating. Not only that it will keep you active and the body/joints/muscles in great form.
 
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Cardio isn't the best way to lose fat though, as exemplified by the video posted on here recently: 15 weeks into marathon training some dude stayed at roughly the same weight, lost muscle and gained fat... go figure.

Fat is lost in the kitchen. By all means do cardio for fitness, in fact this is vital, but just not for fat loss.
 
cheets64 said:
Turst me if you are wanting to shift the fat, you need to hammer the cardio, get the heart working, body sweating. Not only that it will keep you active and the body/joints/muscles in great form.
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That's just not true, as I've explained to you before.

Mansize is right, although some would say things like HIIT were cardio :)

As a slight left field suggestion, buy a kettlebell and do loads of KB swings.
 
Mansize_tissue said:
Cardio isn't the best way to lose fat though, as exemplified by the video posted on here recently: 15 weeks into marathon training some dude stayed at roughly the same weight, lost muscle and gained fat... go figure.

Fat is lost in the kitchen. By all means do cardio for fitness, in fact this is vital, but just not for fat loss.
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lol marathon training, of course you are not going to put on muscle if you are running 15+ a day, you seen the body types that run, I am on about short distances, op is not going to be doing those distances for ages. Swimming or Rowwoing, all classed as cardio and are not going to make you lose muscle.

I do cardio and lift weights and have lost fat and gained strength increase.
 
I'm just over 15st at 5'7 and would struggle to lose fat on 3600kcals a day unless I was very very very active, if I were you I would be aiming for 2000-2200kcals a day.
 
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