Poll: ** The AMD VEGA Thread **

[D.P.]

Even if it beats a 1080 slightly and comes in at £200/250, people would still claim that AMD are doomed



It's not called defending, it's called having some common sense and logic to wait until the "final" drivers are released along with the "correct" version of the GPU

These are final drivers, that is what the Vega Fe is shipping with and are the office drivers on AMD's webpage. pcPer even called up AMD and asked if there were any newer drivers and if it was ok to benchmarks games with them, AMD told pcPer to go right ahead and confirm these are the latest drivers.


What do you mean by correct version of the GPU. This is the exact same silicon. Only thing RX Vega will have is half the Vram.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

This is a PR disaster (yet again) for AMD, Vega FE should never have been talked about at the same time as RX Vega at the paper launch last month if it's genuinely not a gaming card.

This. They wanted to save face even though they knew the gaming drivers were not fully there yet.

i hope so too for all are sakes ....maybe the gaming part of the card is gimped or not yet finished and main features like Tiled rendering are disabled ...as the creation results look ok ...

Seems in gaming 30 / 40% of the gpu is not being used correctly... just does not make sense 14nm 13.1TFLOPS but only be slightly faster than a OCed fury / 1070.....

So maybe there is hope

Does anybody know the transistor count of vega FE?

I mean if AMD had not even launched this card they would have more positive PR. Its almost like an anti-PR launch.

Who knows,maybe RTG has a cunning plan to massively underplay gaming performance so to not tip off Nvidia,and the RX Vega ends up being a good performer in games!!

 

[muon]

Well a Fury X is 8.6Tflops at 1050mhz.

At 1600mhz it would also have 13.1Tflops.

 

[Jono8]

GCN is just inefficient.

This is essentially the problem. You would have thought that with a new process they could put more shaders than the Fury X on Vega, but they still have the same number. They clearly just can't get a reasonable power draw or TDP with anything more, even when using HBM. They just seem to be really far behind Nvidia in perf/watt which is making it impossible for them to compete at the high end.

 

[D.P.]

i hope so too for all are sakes ....maybe the gaming part of the card is gimped or not yet finished and main features like Tiled rendering are disabled ...as the creation results look ok ...

Seems in gaming 30 / 40% of the gpu is not being used correctly... just does not make sense 14nm 13.1TFLOPS but only be slightly faster than a OCed fury / 1070.....

So maybe there is hope

Does anybody know the transistor count of vega FE?

What do you mean by the creation results look OK?

The professional software results show.itbis way slower than a 1080 when the 1080 is using the appropriate drivers (P5000).

If anything the gaming g results are better than the professional results when correct drivers are used.


People mistakingly going about how Vega I'd faster than a Titan XP in professional software, when the reality is it is slower than a 1080.

 

[muon]

This is essentially the problem. You would have thought that with a new process they could put more shaders than the Fury X on Vega, but they still have the same number. They clearly just can't get a reasonable power draw or TDP with anything more, even when using HBM. They just seem to be really far behind Nvidia in perf/watt which is making it impossible for them to compete at the high end.

Nvidia struck gold with the Maxwell architecture. Only now will people realise what a leap it was. Then it was refined into Pascal with high clocks.

 

[harney]

Well a Fury X is 8.6Tflops at 1050mhz.

At 1600mhz it would also have 13.1Tflops.

fair point ...so if that is the case its a fury shrunk to 14nm then

 

[Davedree]

Even if it beats a 1080 slightly and comes in at £200/250, people would still claim that AMD are doomed



It's not called defending, it's called having some common sense and logic to wait until the "final" drivers are released along with the "correct" version of the GPU Although unlike most here, I was never expecting vega to come close to a 1080ti, I was just expecting 1080 performance, possibly slightly better than 1080 performance...... If gaming vega can't even match a 1080 on release day in every thing then don't worry, I will also be joining in with the AMD are doooooomed posts

Like I said earlier, considering this is suppose to be a computer enthusiast forum (and I imagine a lot of people would work in the IT sector too), it just amazes me that people have no clue on how important drivers are for everything tech/hardware related, hardware will only perform as well as what the drivers allow it to...

People bang on about nvidia always being far better for drivers especially in the past but now, it seems like drivers aren't important, at least that is what comes across from reading the majority of posts in here anyway

It is rather amusing too as I posted images/benchmarks of the fury x gaining 30 fps in doom and fallout 4 gaining a 24% improvement just from new drivers but as per usual in this sub-forum, people ignore facts and rather go to their bunkers and declare that doomsday is coming

Drivers dedicated to gaming and disabling logic internally to save power, or improve shader throughput are scenarios that can aid the Rx Vega. What cannot be overlooked is the freaking size of the die relative to it's power envelope and manufacturing costs and yield rate, vs a smaller cheaper more efficient GP104 using gddr5/x that caters for both desktop and higher marked up mobile.

link months ago AMD VEGA confirmed for 2017 H1

 

[humbug]

This is a PR disaster (yet again) for AMD, Vega FE should never have been talked about at the same time as RX Vega at the paper launch last month if it's genuinely not a gaming card.

The problem is headline garbing gutter reviewers like PcPer treating the card as a gaming card despite being told by AMD that its not.

They were also told the gaming performance on the RX version of the card would be much higher, again PcPer ignored that and reviewed the FE card as if its a gaming card at its final gaming performance.

AMD have had a PR disasters in the past but on this occasion its reviewers like Ryan Sprout knowingly misrepresenting the cards.

If someone like Ryan Shrout decides to troll AMD for click bait there isn't anything they can do about it.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

This is essentially the problem. You would have thought that with a new process they could put more shaders than the Fury X on Vega, but they still have the same number. They clearly just can't get a reasonable power draw or TDP with anything more, even when using HBM. They just seem to be really far behind Nvidia in perf/watt which is making it impossible for them to compete at the high end.

Its not even that - Nvidia has moved to using two different lines,one compute focused and one gaming focused,so AMD is trying to use general purpose GPUs to fight GPUs which are simply more dedicated to the tasks in hand. At the same time Nvidia has managed to get their designs to run at much higher clockspeeds whilst being efficient.

As a result AMD needs to push the gaming cards to the edge in regards to clockspeeds and performance/watt goes out the window.

It didn't also help that HBM and HBM2 have not been the panacea AMD expected,with HBM2 being delayed over six months it seems.

 

[muon]

fair point ...so if that is the case its a fury shrunk to 14nm then

AMD also stated the performance increase would be +50% from the Fury X. Given the clock speeds that is pretty much what the card is. An overclocked Fury X.

 

[harney]

What do you mean by the creation results look OK?

The professional software results show.itbis way slower than a 1080 when the 1080 is using the appropriate drivers (P5000).

If anything the gaming g results are better than the professional results when correct drivers are used.


People mistakingly going about how Vega I'd faster than a Titan XP in professional software, when the reality is it is slower than a 1080.

My mistake then
i must be reading it wrong from the pcper results ..so can you use a 1080 in the same creation software then ?

 

[D.P.]

The problem is headline garbing gutter reviewers like PcPer treating the card as a gaming card despite being told by AMD that its not.

They were also told the gaming performance on the RX version of the card would be much higher, again PcPer ignored that and reviewed the FE card as if its a gaming card at its final gaming performance.

AMD have had a PR disasters but on this occasion its reviewers like Ryan Sprout knowingly misrepresenting the cards.

Here we go again with this complete revisionist BS again.

AmD market the Vega Fe as a card used for gaming. The drivers it is for gaming. AMD themselves compared it to a gaming card Titan XP.

PCPer asked AMd if it was ok to benchmark games and AMD gave them the green light.

 

[Relentless81]

This is what is irritating me, if the RX vega sucks, then sure thing fire away and slate AMD all you want.

Yup, meanwhile I need a new fridge to wash my clothes

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

TBH,everybody did we seriously expect another AMD graphics card launch were everything was launched properly and there was no issue and no drama as a result.

Nope.

 

[D.P.]

My mistake then
i must be reading it wrong from the pcper results ..so can you use a 1080 in the same creation software then ?

You can use a 1080 for content creation if you I stall the right drivers. The official way to do this to buy the corresponding Quadro, the unofficial way is a soft mod.

 

[harney]

AMD also stated the performance increase would be +50% from the Fury X. Given the clock speeds that is pretty much what the card is. An overclocked Fury X.

I am so confused by all this it makes no sense

This. They wanted to save face even though they knew the gaming drivers were not fully there yet.



I mean if AMD had not even launched this card they would have more positive PR. Its almost like an anti-PR launch.

Who knows,maybe RTG has a cunning plan to massively underplay gaming performance so to not tip off Nvidia,and the RX Vega ends up being a good performer in games!!

maybe they are playing it down.. any news even if its bad creates talk but why? lets hope they can pull a great trick out of there HAT ..will know in less than a month ...

 

[Nexus18]

....

If it came in under 300 it'd be a best seller but the 580 struggles to come in at that price at the moment.

Nah it wouldn't be as people/nvidia guys will moan at how:

- it sucks too much power (got to think of those few pounds that add up each year you know)
- it runs too hot
- it is too loud
- they are late and that is the best they can do, matching a 1+ year old 1080?!
- and the classic, driver sucks

Well the old AMD Vega H1 thread is now an amusing thread. Large IPC improvements, power efficient and higher than 1600mhz clocks all at the same time.

1080Ti beater it was going to be.

Yup if gaming vega does suck as much as vega FE for "gaming" then those posts will also be amusing

But as said, it was only a few who were expecting 1080ti performance.

.........

As has been shown time and time again especially on this forum and even by people who know more than their fair share about drivers/gpus etc., a lot of people will never go AMD, more so for the "high end", it doesn't matter if AMD have a great high end card, AMD don't have the same mind share as what nvidia have over their customers. In order for AMD to "fully" get rid of this peasant/buggy/cheap tarnished image that they have in the mind of many people, they need to start from scratch with everything, branding name, their PR/marketing, how they handle launches, the whole shebang.

 

[humbug]

Here we go again with this complete revisionist BS again.

AmD market the Vega Fe as a card used for gaming. The drivers it is for gaming. AMD themselves compared it to a gaming card Titan XP.

PCPer asked AMd if it was ok to benchmark games and AMD gave them the green light.

One, no they didn't, you just made that up.

Two, nVidia say the Titan Xp is a work station card.

 

[harney]

You can use a 1080 for content creation if you I stall the right drivers. The official way to do this to buy the corresponding Quadro, the unofficial way is a soft mod.

got you...i thought all that had been locked down not being able to hack/use pro drivers ect if that is the case its not looking good then