The Falklands thread

Firestar_3x · 12 Mar 2013 at 17:23

Castiel said:
The Argentines don't have any Exocets, and even if they did the UK is now in possession of the codes which make them useless.

I'm not sure on the state of the Argentine offensive weapons, but to quote a rather rubbish source:

In May 2010, Defence Minister Nilda Garre announced that the Navy would continue working on a system that would enable the launch of Exocet missiles from the Navy’s P3 Orion aircraft. In addition, the financing of the local development and construction of a coastal Naval defence system that may also be based on the use of Exocet missiles similar to the Excalibur system.

However:

As of 2013, only 16 of a total of 70 navy vessels are in a condition to sail due to shortfalls in the fleet’s maintenance budget. On 23 January 2013 the Type 42 destroyer Santísima Trinidad sank at her moorings having been mothballed for ten years

Gold.

GAC · 12 Mar 2013 at 17:28

been a bit surprised kercher's not been on the tv waving a flag or something, sky had the uk argie envoy on and she said they wouldnt speak to the islanders as its nothing to do with them. nice to see being mental runs in the gov there.

Castiel · 12 Mar 2013 at 17:32

Firestar_3x said:
I'm not sure on the state of the Argentine offensive weapons, but to quote a rather rubbish source:

Even if they do have any operational Exocets with the ability to launch them, the Type 45 PAAMS missile defence system (Asters) was tested against live Exocets in development...needless to say the Exocets didn't really stand an earthy.

Firestar_3x · 12 Mar 2013 at 17:36

Castiel said:
Even if they do have any operational Exocets with the ability to launch tem, the Type 45 PAAMS missile defence system (Asters) was tested against live Exocets in development...needless to say the Exocets didn't really stand an earthy.

And even if that failed i'm sure lessons learned during previous close in anti ship missile tests will have proved the Phalanx system is a good bet for last resort.

elmuzzy66. · 12 Mar 2013 at 17:40

The argies don't even have the aircraft to launch the missles. 83% of all the argie airforce isn't able to fly because lack of mainatence, spares and pilot trainning. 14 mirage III and 7 a4 skyhawks are sll that is left. And thats not going to change any time soon.

Woden · 12 Mar 2013 at 17:47

Castiel said:
Even if they do have any operational Exocets with the ability to launch them, the Type 45 PAAMS missile defence system (Asters) was tested against live Exocets in development...needless to say the Exocets didn't really stand an earthy.

Argentina's continued (and now extended it looks like) reliance on the Exocet is rather puzzling. If the UK military presence is as much a threat as Argentina claims why are they relying on a weapon provided by an EU member that would be duty bound to help. When they invaded the islands France delayed the shipment of Argentine Exocets.

Firestar_3x · 12 Mar 2013 at 19:07

They have no money to buy anything new!

Xordium · 12 Mar 2013 at 19:16

Castiel said:
The Falklands also has low level radar cover to augment the type45, not to mention the subs and the support ships.

It's not the same as decent AEW which is something blatantly missing from our naval forces.

Firestar_3x · 12 Mar 2013 at 19:18

Xordium said:
It's not the same as decent AEW which is something blatantly missing from our naval forces.

We have early warning radar, the seakings can provide over the horizon radar coverage.

arknor · 12 Mar 2013 at 19:27

Speaking to a few people where I work (defence based) the general feeling is they would try and get troops in on a "civilian plane",

is that even legal?
Don't the geneva conventions forbid that type of stuff?

ubersonic · 12 Mar 2013 at 20:00

Woden said:
Argentina's continued (and now extended it looks like) reliance on the Exocet is rather puzzling. If the UK military presence is as much a threat as Argentina claims why are they relying on a weapon provided by an EU member that would be duty bound to help. When they invaded the islands France delayed the shipment of Argentine Exocets.

It is a bit odd isn't it, with the UK being the one nation their most likely to get into a conflict with and also the best at countering the Exocet

BTW as well as delaying shipment to the Argies France also sent over a squad of Mirage jets identical to the ones it had sold the Argies complete with French pilots for the RAF to practice against and handed over highly classified data on the Exocets weaknesses (doing quite a bit of damage to their rep as an arms dealer). As it stands the UK is pretty much the best nation (alongside France obv) at countering Exocets lol.

arknor said:
is that even legal?
Don't the geneva conventions forbid that type of stuff?

The airliner thing gets brought up a lot in Falklands conversations, its actually from a remark from the commander of the Falklands defences, he said something like the only way they could even stand a chance of getting past the defences would be to fake an emergency landing with a commercial airliner full of soldiers but even then all that would achieve would be to get a plane full of soldiers surrounded and hopelessly outnumbered/out-gunned.

Firestar_3x said:
the Exocet has a range of around 50km, I’d expect the ship could pick up the launch aircraft before the missile was fired.

Lies! those Migs carry the Exocet anti-ship missile, they can fire that missile from a hundred miles away! (before any keyboard warriors go full retard im quoting Top Gun

)

elmuzzy66. · 12 Mar 2013 at 20:12

Firestar_3x said:
We have early warning radar, the seakings can provide over the horizon radar coverage.

The ones that were used on the carriers?

The Funktopus · 12 Mar 2013 at 20:16

arknor said:
is that even legal?
Don't the geneva conventions forbid that type of stuff?

It wouldn't be the best idea anyway I'd have thought. The only place to land a large civilian type plane (i.e. an Aerolineas Argentinas A340 or something) on the Falklands is Mount Pleasant, where the garrison is concentrated.

Castiel · 12 Mar 2013 at 20:30

Xordium said:
It's not the same as decent AEW which is something blatantly missing from our naval forces.

There are two US AWACS planes in the region that give that support as part of their NATO obligations.

Firestar_3x · 12 Mar 2013 at 20:41

elmuzzy66. said:
The ones that were used on the carriers?

They have been used on / with several of our ships, example of it working with the tyoe 45:

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/bagger-meets-type-45-for-first-time

Quite the combination!

Xordium · 12 Mar 2013 at 20:54

Castiel said:
There are two US AWACS planes in the region that give that support as part of their NATO obligations.

Yes but it is not the same as having your own and a glaring oversight. And anyone who things a SeaKing provides anything like what is needed is sorely misguided. The point of naval warfare is to know where they are and not have them know where you are and the limited range on a helicopter along with the inability to carry a decent radar is not a good plan.

Firestar_3x · 12 Mar 2013 at 21:01

Don't agree, besides if something kicked off or showed signs we have E-3 sentrys which we could fly down.

Just what is needed then, the seaking can track things in the air and subs, it has a proven track record, just how far out from the ship do you want to look?

Castiel · 12 Mar 2013 at 21:02

Xordium said:
Yes but it is not the same as having your own and a glaring oversight. And anyone who things a SeaKing provides anything like what is needed is sorely misguided. The point of naval warfare is to know where they are and not have them know where you are and the limited range on a helicopter along with the inability to carry a decent radar is not a good plan.

We do have AWACs, it is just a matter that NATO already supply regional support.

elmuzzy66. · 12 Mar 2013 at 21:23

Has anybody really looked at the state of the argie armed forces? Don't think they could attack even if they wanted and we had two ribs and model aircraft to defend them.

Vanquish-Storm · 12 Mar 2013 at 21:30

So basically its a case of "come and have a go if you think your hard enough" which we have all established that they are not.

Reminds he of when Spain sent some of their coastguard and fishing boats to Gibraltar, we send in one small navy ship and they sail off back to Spain with their tapas between their legs.