Timing Belt Gone 15 Months/5k Miles After Replacement - Where do I stand?

andy_mk3 · 26 Jul 2013 at 19:52

I'll try and keep this fairly short.

The car in question is a 2002 Renault Clio 1.4 16v.

Around April 2012 the timing belt snapped, and was repaired by an independent garage in town. It had 14 new valves, head skim, full timing belt kit, water pump, the works. I think it came to just shy of £1200.

Skip forward to today, driving home through a village at 30 in 4th, heard a funny grating noise, lost all power.

Pulled to the side of the road, my first thought was the cambelt. So I took the oil cap off, flicked the key briefly and the cam in view remained stationary, so that confirmed my fears.

The garage in question is now closed so I wont be able to talk to them until tomorrow. But I 'd like some information as to where I stand with this. I know for a fact they're not going to turn around and say they'll sort it out FOC. But as far as I'm aware, the timing belt is guaranteed for the duration of the replacement interval.

So if a tensioner has maybe failed, is it down to the garage to strip it down and contact the manufacturer of the parts?

Any information would be great, thanks!

pepsilol · 26 Jul 2013 at 20:29

Who was the maker of the kit?

bledd · 26 Jul 2013 at 21:02

What was replaced last time?

Brookert · 26 Jul 2013 at 21:04

I hope for your sake they don't try and blame something that wasn't part of the cambelt kit, and just shrug their shoulders.

andy_mk3 · 26 Jul 2013 at 21:16

As far as I know they used a Gates kit. I'll ring them tomorrow but was hoping to do so armed with a little bit of information.

Everything was replaced, as with the cost of all the head work, the extras weren't an issue.

MrMoonX · 26 Jul 2013 at 21:43

It's over a year since they did it, I'd say you won't get anything out of them and I doubt you could pursue a claim as sucky as this is

pepsilol · 26 Jul 2013 at 21:52

Have you considered there is something causing premature wear on your timing belt?

Under what condition did it snap in the first place?

Brookert · 26 Jul 2013 at 22:08

pepsilol said:
Have you considered there is something causing premature wear on your timing belt?

Under what condition did it snap in the first place?

Indeed. If the belt is at a funny angle somewhere due to previous damage, or something internally is not right, could be wearing away belts much faster. I wouldn't put it down to coincidence that another belt has gone.

Maybe time to scrap and move on?

andy_mk3 · 26 Jul 2013 at 22:15

It snapped because it was very very overdue a change the last time.

It was going up for sale next week so it's typical, and obviously don't want to be throwing a lot of money at a car that's not even worth a grand.

Frozennova · 26 Jul 2013 at 22:16

We're the tensioners replaced last time round?

Edit: as you said full kit I'd assume they we're.

I doubt there's much they will do but my guess is either they put a small knick in it trying to lever it on with a screwdriver or similar or over tensioned it.

-westy- · 26 Jul 2013 at 22:35

By everything, do you mean the tensioners and water pump as well as the cam belt itself?

andy_mk3 · 26 Jul 2013 at 23:42

Frozennova said:
We're the tensioners replaced last time round?

Edit: as you said full kit I'd assume they we're.

I doubt there's much they will do but my guess is either they put a small knick in it trying to lever it on with a screwdriver or similar or over tensioned it.

-westy- said:
By everything, do you mean the tensioners and water pump as well as the cam belt itself?

Yup, tensioners and everything were replaced.

I'm guessing my only hope is that maybe a tensioner has failed, meaning that it could fall back to the manufacturer? But they'd probably put it down to being over-tensioned or something silly.

I can't see me getting far with this. But I've nothing to lose by trying.

If not it's going on ebay for 99p no reserve. Get rid!

Third Opinion · 27 Jul 2013 at 14:07

That's rotten luck.

If the water pump is driven by the cambelt on that car my money would be on that being the cause. They are frequently missed on changes because it is often just a recommendation that it is changed, not deemed as essential like the belt.

If it has done the valves a second time it might be better sourcing a second hand engine due to possible damage to the bottom end.

I had a belt snap and cost me £1300 to repair only for the bottom end to give up 10k later.

Westyfield2 · 27 Jul 2013 at 15:56

andy_mk3 said:
The car in question is a 2002 Renault Clio 1.4 16v.

Around April 2012 the timing belt snapped, and was repaired by an independent garage in town. It had 14 new valves, head skim, full timing belt kit, water pump, the works. I think it came to just shy of £1200.

Dare I ask why?

I've been keeping an eye on the price of spare engines for my 2004 Renault Clio 182 (2.0 16v), as even if you keep belts to the right intervals, keep refreshing the oil and replace the dephaser at the same time as the belts, you can just be unlucky with the valves/pistons being rubbish French quality, standard rod bolts not liking big revs, bottom end bearing failure, etc. You can pick up an engine for £300 these days. Obviously you'd want to renew the belts, and depending on how handy with a spanner you are you might be paying labour to have it fitted etc, but the point is it's a good bit cheaper just to stick another engine in there compared with fixing the dead one.

Is the 1.4 16v some magical engine that spares are really expensive or something?

Scythe · 27 Jul 2013 at 16:10

Third Opinion said:
If the water pump is driven by the cambelt on that car my money would be on that being the cause. They are frequently missed on changes because it is often just a recommendation that it is changed, not deemed as essential like the belt.

^^ agreed

If the water pump wasn't replaced with the belt, it's probably seized and wrecked the belt. I changed the water pump on my 2001 Clio 1.4 16V whilst doing the timing belt at 75000 miles as a precaution because of this.

pepsilol · 27 Jul 2013 at 17:07

andy_mk3 said:
It had 14 new valves, head skim, full timing belt kit, water pump, the works. I think it came to just shy of £1200.

andy_mk3 · 27 Jul 2013 at 18:05

Westyfield2 said:
Dare I ask why?

I've been keeping an eye on the price of spare engines for my 2004 Renault Clio 182 (2.0 16v), as even if you keep belts to the right intervals, keep refreshing the oil and replace the dephaser at the same time as the belts, you can just be unlucky with the valves/pistons being rubbish French quality, standard rod bolts not liking big revs, bottom end bearing failure, etc. You can pick up an engine for £300 these days. Obviously you'd want to renew the belts, and depending on how handy with a spanner you are you might be paying labour to have it fitted etc, but the point is it's a good bit cheaper just to stick another engine in there compared with fixing the dead one.

Is the 1.4 16v some magical engine that spares are really expensive or something?

I'm actually a mechanic myself. But at the time it happened I didn't have the time to get it done, plus someone helped out with the money so it just worked out easier all round really.

I have thought about another engine. I'd happily chuck one in that runs and at least it will sell as a running car.

But yes the water pump was changed, I made sure of that.

I didn't get chance to ring them today as it was very busy at work. I'm wondering if it's even worth it.

Gamefreak501 · 27 Jul 2013 at 18:16

Hmm, replacing the engine seems a sensible option since you've already pumped £1200 into getting the engine fixed previously but at the same time it's rough luck that your belt snapped only after 5k miles/15 months. I would question the quality of the belt or tensioner.

1st Choice spares is a good web site to get a quote and comparison for parts and have a word with your local scrapyards as well for comparison and to consider if it's worthwhile or not.

A 2002 Clio may not fetch a great deal of money depending on mileage and condition so another option is to look at how much you'll get for the scrap or as is and consider another car perhaps.

andy_mk3 · 27 Jul 2013 at 20:02

Gamefreak501 said:
Hmm, replacing the engine seems a sensible option since you've already pumped £1200 into getting the engine fixed previously but at the same time it's rough luck that your belt snapped only after 5k miles/15 months. I would question the quality of the belt or tensioner.

1st Choice spares is a good web site to get a quote and comparison for parts and have a word with your local scrapyards as well for comparison and to consider if it's worthwhile or not.

A 2002 Clio may not fetch a great deal of money depending on mileage and condition so another option is to look at how much you'll get for the scrap or as is and consider another car perhaps.

The car was replaced last weekend. It was meant to be going up for sale tomorrow which is gutting really lol!

I have no doubt it will have done valve damage. Otherwise I'd be happy to put a belt on and hope for the best.

I honestly don't think it's worth the hassle of taking it back to the garage. I may strip it myself and go from there. Then work out the cost or repair or replacement engine. Just want rid of the damn thing now!

Dis86 · 28 Jul 2013 at 12:43

£1200?! Can't help but think that's got to be pushing on for the value of the whole car, even 15 months ago. Time to go to the great big scrap-yard in the sky?